EPTPuMa to hite SPARKYZ - Page 5
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IdrA
United States11541 Posts
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MuffinDude
United States3837 Posts
On December 30 2009 19:16 2minutevictory wrote: no they don't horang2 is good. good at abusing carriers and dts that is. which is all the good you need imo. anyways, i hope puma can play some PL matches over at hite, i wanna see how good he is Nope, horang2 is nowhere good enough. Hite needs a much better protoss lineup then haksoo and horang2. | ||
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RamenStyle
United States1929 Posts
On December 30 2009 19:16 2minutevictory wrote: no they don't horang2 is good. good at abusing carriers and dts that is. which is all the good you need imo. anyways, i hope puma can play some PL matches over at hite, i wanna see how good he is I still believe Horang2 can become something good. He needs to be somewhat more solid and maybe think 2 steps ahead when his gimmick bo's fail, but he is young and still got room to develop and improve. And Tazza was supposed to be one of the next big protoss' but he needs a breakthrough. They are in a similar spot where STX was a little bit more than a year ago. Sitting on players with potential hoping they develop properly. Players like Hogil, Da T-Bizzle, Horang2, Tazza and now Puma are mid term projects that bear the hopes for the future. | ||
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QibingZero
2611 Posts
This is similar to the problem in the past of how you prepare for Nal_rA. His strategies were just so crazy that they were impossible to adequately plan for. However, he was also a good standard player, and could macro quite well up until the end of his playing career. Every time he beat someone using some ingenious maneuver, his legend grew, and players would often play much too safe and get beat when he decided to play a more macro-oriented build. Obviously there is some skill and effectiveness to be had in being unpredictable. However, I think the points about Leta stand on their own. Yeah, he's not the best macro player out there, but he's not bad. While he has gained a bit of popularity by playing the way he often does, it's not hard to see why he has no deep appearances in starleagues. You do need a bit of trickery in your game to be the best, but you also need an extremely solid macro backbone in place to fall back on. Which one do you think is more difficult to maintain? | ||
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icystorage
Jollibee19350 Posts
On December 30 2009 19:05 DM20 wrote: When Leta practices his build against someone the person isn't improving his game,they are just learning how to play Leta. Practice is very important to the players having someone who can play a standard game perfectly is a lot more valuable in the long run than a player who can grab you a few wins. oh sure, you do know what happens when sparkyz players practice and what build leta uses during practice | ||
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SK.Testie
Canada11084 Posts
On December 30 2009 19:17 IdrA wrote: or you could, you know, watch him play. I played them both years ago. Does this mean something? There is evidence that it does as it fits into something that is quite telling. Leta was by far the smarter player with better game sense who could take advantage of his opponents mistakes more often. He wasn't cheesy, but saw windows or made them, and took advantage. He didn't play do-or-die. He wasn't a super macro monster like Flash but was great nonetheless. Really was a fine player who was fairly simple minded but just kinda wasn't that amazing. It looks like this has held true throughout the years, but perhaps only fairly recently has Really become a true beast. If so, kudos to him, but now he needs results and to stand a test of time while winning to back it up. Leta has done that, against better competition. Because Really's TvT and TvZ suffer and from what has been said in this thread, he still seems to suffer from the same problems he did years ago. Obviously he is superior to what he was, but again the stats suggest the same thing. In TvT you have to take advantage of every mistake your opponent makes. You cannot just mindlessly macro your balls off and hope to win a good % like you can in TvP / TvZ after shitting out a standard build / game plan. You could say Leta is a gimmicky cheesy newb compared to Really. But that is not the case. Gimmicky cheesy newbs have always, and will always have bad win %'s. Leta has very solid TvT win % and a solid TvZ win % with a bad vs P%. Perhaps his macro is weaker, hence his problems against protoss. Regardless, he has shown he is the better player for a while now. It is up to Really to show that he is now the better player for a long time to come and to back it up with results. The fact that he is 5 elo points ahead of Leta at the moment is a good start, but he's far off from no.1 power rank, the kespa rank, and Leta's elo peak. Hell, every stat points towards Leta being generally a better player, even the win streak / loss streak. I'm glad Really can macro slightly better than him (if that's the case), congrats. Now let him try to win as much as he has. | ||
GTR
51710 Posts
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Glioburd
France1911 Posts
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SK.Testie
Canada11084 Posts
On December 30 2009 20:21 GTR wrote: IIRC wasn't Leta an oG merc (before he came super known) along with Jang (Up's Brother) and Up himself? Yes. He even beat me in a game on 815 where he predicted my build. And despite me knowing how to stop his build he did something previous opponents hadn't. He went m/m but stimmed his marines all the way across the map so that they reached me with red hp but just seconds before my cannon morphed to win him the game. If they had arrived seconds later, he would have been utterly crushed. Afterwards I thought, 'oh you clever devil.' At that time, Really didn't have the game smarts or the know how to exploit and predict builds like that. He simply would not have thought of stimming his marines across the map asap and entering an opponents base with low hp marines. | ||
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NiGoL
1868 Posts
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RebirthOfLeGenD
USA5860 Posts
On December 30 2009 20:40 MYM.Testie wrote: Yes. He even beat me in a game on 815 where he predicted my build. And despite me knowing how to stop his build he did something previous opponents hadn't. He went m/m but stimmed his marines all the way across the map so that they reached me with red hp but just seconds before my cannon morphed to win him the game. If they had arrived seconds later, he would have been utterly crushed. Afterwards I thought, 'oh you clever devil.' At that time, Really didn't have the game smarts or the know how to exploit and predict builds like that. He simply would not have thought of stimming his marines across the map asap and entering an opponents base with low hp marines. This sounds crazy. If you can find this rep that would be awesome. | ||
KizZBG
u gotta skate8152 Posts
 lol. So now we're just left with Fancy and Classic as backup terrans eh? :p Good luck to Puma tho, he's played some good games and deffinately has potential, it was just his nerves letting him down but I hope he'll get over that.  | ||
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DoX.)
Singapore6164 Posts
On December 30 2009 20:56 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: This sounds crazy. If you can find this rep that would be awesome. Nada vs Shark in Arena MSL has something like that actually, Nada stimmed his rines 3 times to get to crossmap Shark just before lurkers morphed and took down Shark's third on Colo. Real gosu. | ||
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vnlegend
United States1389 Posts
I haven't seen all of Really's games but I can't see how he is better than Leta. The ability to incorporate tricky/aggressive play into your arsenal makes you a more well-rounded and difficult opponent to face. Artosis talks about how Leta cheesed Flash to win the series but look at what Flash just did to JD. Both players won their 1st game with suffocating standard play. Really on the other hand seems like a predictable player who would get exploited and raped by players like Stork, who has an imba record vs Terran macro-oriented players like ForGG and Sea. | ||
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DM20
Canada544 Posts
On December 30 2009 19:35 icystorage wrote: oh sure, you do know what happens when sparkyz players practice and what build leta uses during practice He isn't going to use an unprepared strategy, practice time is a commodity therefore so are good practice partners. | ||
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Piy
Scotland3152 Posts
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Abyzou
Sweden209 Posts
I'd agree with Artosis since I don't think stats are the be all and end all of Starcraft, it's much more nuanced. I mean, if someone who's knowledgeable says player X is better than Y, even though Y has better stats, then that obviously means the knowledgeable person knows something you don't. It doesn't bother me, I'll just take their word for it. Personally I'm not good enough to spot such things about the players. Just as I believe Fantasy's top 5 even though he's been having trouble lately. | ||
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Kreedit
Sweden373 Posts
On December 30 2009 22:39 Piy wrote: Hey remember that Puma guy? I've heard he's pretty good and going to Hite. Puma who? Werent we talking about really and leta in this thread? | ||
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Scaramanga
Australia8093 Posts
Anyway light and skyhigh imo would be in the top 5 terrans | ||
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Doso
Germany769 Posts
Another pratice Terran - good for hite. I approve. | ||
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