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On August 08 2014 23:15 LSB wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2014 22:54 Matoo- wrote:On August 08 2014 08:06 LSB wrote:On August 08 2014 06:27 Lonyo wrote:On August 08 2014 06:17 chiflutz wrote:
I don't really know/care about the Owned CEO controversy, but tech-wise hitbox is miles ahead of the old Owned and quite a bit ahead of twitch, worldwide server coverage notwithstanding (although they said on their blog that they do have a worldwide network set up).
It'd be a shame if it turned out to be the same person's moneygrabbing scheme all over again. Apparently it's the guy who took over as CEO of Own3d after all the crap had started going wrong, and was trying to sort it out, and not the guy who started Own3d and made everything go tits up. Apparently. Unsourced (Reddit). Hitbox supposedly 'learned from own3d's mistakes' about keeping their costs down. It's run by the same people http://blog.hitbox.tv/an-introduction-to-our-management/ and making the same mistakes (using amazon) http://whois.domaintools.com/hitbox.tv. The only thing your whois is showing is that their web servers are likely on Amazon. But who cares about that? What matters is their streaming servers, and from a quick glance they're streaming from Edgecast, not from Amazon: (With a stream opened in FF) $ lsof -i | grep plugin [...]->68.232.32.221:macromedia-fcs (ESTABLISHED) $ whois 68.232.32.221 NetName: EDGECAST-NETBLK-04 OrgName: EdgeCast Networks, Inc. Now, I'm not claiming that Edgecast is cheap - as a third-party CDN they're probably charging Hitbox much more than what Twitch has to pay to stream on their own infrastructure - but the fact is that no, they don't seem to be streaming from Amazon. Well, that's worse than amazon as per https://www.scaleengine.com/pricing/edgecast/We are looking at $0.16 per gig. O.O
Edgecast's pricing is not public. Your link is from a competing CDN who has every reason in the world to make Edgecast look bad. If that wasn't enough to discredit it, the page hasn't been updated in 4 years, and the quote is for a 25TB commit which may be very different from Hitbox's commit.
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On August 08 2014 23:33 Matoo- wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2014 23:15 LSB wrote:On August 08 2014 22:54 Matoo- wrote:On August 08 2014 08:06 LSB wrote:On August 08 2014 06:27 Lonyo wrote:On August 08 2014 06:17 chiflutz wrote:
I don't really know/care about the Owned CEO controversy, but tech-wise hitbox is miles ahead of the old Owned and quite a bit ahead of twitch, worldwide server coverage notwithstanding (although they said on their blog that they do have a worldwide network set up).
It'd be a shame if it turned out to be the same person's moneygrabbing scheme all over again. Apparently it's the guy who took over as CEO of Own3d after all the crap had started going wrong, and was trying to sort it out, and not the guy who started Own3d and made everything go tits up. Apparently. Unsourced (Reddit). Hitbox supposedly 'learned from own3d's mistakes' about keeping their costs down. It's run by the same people http://blog.hitbox.tv/an-introduction-to-our-management/ and making the same mistakes (using amazon) http://whois.domaintools.com/hitbox.tv. The only thing your whois is showing is that their web servers are likely on Amazon. But who cares about that? What matters is their streaming servers, and from a quick glance they're streaming from Edgecast, not from Amazon: (With a stream opened in FF) $ lsof -i | grep plugin [...]->68.232.32.221:macromedia-fcs (ESTABLISHED) $ whois 68.232.32.221 NetName: EDGECAST-NETBLK-04 OrgName: EdgeCast Networks, Inc. Now, I'm not claiming that Edgecast is cheap - as a third-party CDN they're probably charging Hitbox much more than what Twitch has to pay to stream on their own infrastructure - but the fact is that no, they don't seem to be streaming from Amazon. Well, that's worse than amazon as per https://www.scaleengine.com/pricing/edgecast/We are looking at $0.16 per gig. O.O Edgecast's pricing is not public. Your link is from a competing CDN who has every reason in the world to make Edgecast look bad. If that wasn't enough to discredit it, the page hasn't been updated in 4 years, and the quote is for a 25TB commit which may be very different from Hitbox's commit.
And do you have any substantial reasoning to believe that Edgecast would provide cheap hosting?
Yes my data point is 4 years old, however even in 2010 those prices are instantly high and video CDN pricing hasn't changed very much as a whole.
Lets face it, hitbox will not and will never in the near future be profitable, or make enough revenue to pay streamers.
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I tried yesterday night to get a dailymotion streaming channel and from what i get you can only stream if you have a partnership with them. Youtube is the same thing as twitch cause they flag audio too on videos.
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On August 08 2014 23:51 LSB wrote:
Lets face it, hitbox will not and will never in the near future be profitable, or make enough revenue to pay streamers.
Unless it has backing from another source.
And people saying that this is Google forced, Twitch was stating these things for over a year. They just are now implementing a system (even one that is different from the one YouTube currently uses).
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On August 08 2014 23:51 LSB wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2014 23:33 Matoo- wrote:On August 08 2014 23:15 LSB wrote:On August 08 2014 22:54 Matoo- wrote:On August 08 2014 08:06 LSB wrote:On August 08 2014 06:27 Lonyo wrote:On August 08 2014 06:17 chiflutz wrote:
I don't really know/care about the Owned CEO controversy, but tech-wise hitbox is miles ahead of the old Owned and quite a bit ahead of twitch, worldwide server coverage notwithstanding (although they said on their blog that they do have a worldwide network set up).
It'd be a shame if it turned out to be the same person's moneygrabbing scheme all over again. Apparently it's the guy who took over as CEO of Own3d after all the crap had started going wrong, and was trying to sort it out, and not the guy who started Own3d and made everything go tits up. Apparently. Unsourced (Reddit). Hitbox supposedly 'learned from own3d's mistakes' about keeping their costs down. It's run by the same people http://blog.hitbox.tv/an-introduction-to-our-management/ and making the same mistakes (using amazon) http://whois.domaintools.com/hitbox.tv. The only thing your whois is showing is that their web servers are likely on Amazon. But who cares about that? What matters is their streaming servers, and from a quick glance they're streaming from Edgecast, not from Amazon: (With a stream opened in FF) $ lsof -i | grep plugin [...]->68.232.32.221:macromedia-fcs (ESTABLISHED) $ whois 68.232.32.221 NetName: EDGECAST-NETBLK-04 OrgName: EdgeCast Networks, Inc. Now, I'm not claiming that Edgecast is cheap - as a third-party CDN they're probably charging Hitbox much more than what Twitch has to pay to stream on their own infrastructure - but the fact is that no, they don't seem to be streaming from Amazon. Well, that's worse than amazon as per https://www.scaleengine.com/pricing/edgecast/We are looking at $0.16 per gig. O.O Edgecast's pricing is not public. Your link is from a competing CDN who has every reason in the world to make Edgecast look bad. If that wasn't enough to discredit it, the page hasn't been updated in 4 years, and the quote is for a 25TB commit which may be very different from Hitbox's commit. And do you have any substantial reasoning to believe that Edgecast would provide cheap hosting? Yes my data point is 4 years old, however even in 2010 those prices are instantly high and video CDN pricing hasn't changed very much as a whole. Lets face it, hitbox will not and will never in the near future be profitable, or make enough revenue to pay streamers.
Then why don't you simply say that Hitbox are streaming from a third-party CDN, which according to the average industry pricing is likely to cost them at least $0.03 per GB? Just accept that you don't have any harder evidence than that. You have a valid point, so don't ruin it by claiming they stream from Amazon (factually false) and then pulling up a bullshit pricing page for Edgecast.
I actually share your opinion that bandwidth costs are going to be a very serious issue and that Twitch has a significant advantage in this regard.
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On August 09 2014 00:43 Matoo- wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2014 23:51 LSB wrote:On August 08 2014 23:33 Matoo- wrote:On August 08 2014 23:15 LSB wrote:On August 08 2014 22:54 Matoo- wrote:On August 08 2014 08:06 LSB wrote:On August 08 2014 06:27 Lonyo wrote:On August 08 2014 06:17 chiflutz wrote:
I don't really know/care about the Owned CEO controversy, but tech-wise hitbox is miles ahead of the old Owned and quite a bit ahead of twitch, worldwide server coverage notwithstanding (although they said on their blog that they do have a worldwide network set up).
It'd be a shame if it turned out to be the same person's moneygrabbing scheme all over again. Apparently it's the guy who took over as CEO of Own3d after all the crap had started going wrong, and was trying to sort it out, and not the guy who started Own3d and made everything go tits up. Apparently. Unsourced (Reddit). Hitbox supposedly 'learned from own3d's mistakes' about keeping their costs down. It's run by the same people http://blog.hitbox.tv/an-introduction-to-our-management/ and making the same mistakes (using amazon) http://whois.domaintools.com/hitbox.tv. The only thing your whois is showing is that their web servers are likely on Amazon. But who cares about that? What matters is their streaming servers, and from a quick glance they're streaming from Edgecast, not from Amazon: (With a stream opened in FF) $ lsof -i | grep plugin [...]->68.232.32.221:macromedia-fcs (ESTABLISHED) $ whois 68.232.32.221 NetName: EDGECAST-NETBLK-04 OrgName: EdgeCast Networks, Inc. Now, I'm not claiming that Edgecast is cheap - as a third-party CDN they're probably charging Hitbox much more than what Twitch has to pay to stream on their own infrastructure - but the fact is that no, they don't seem to be streaming from Amazon. Well, that's worse than amazon as per https://www.scaleengine.com/pricing/edgecast/We are looking at $0.16 per gig. O.O Edgecast's pricing is not public. Your link is from a competing CDN who has every reason in the world to make Edgecast look bad. If that wasn't enough to discredit it, the page hasn't been updated in 4 years, and the quote is for a 25TB commit which may be very different from Hitbox's commit. And do you have any substantial reasoning to believe that Edgecast would provide cheap hosting? Yes my data point is 4 years old, however even in 2010 those prices are instantly high and video CDN pricing hasn't changed very much as a whole. Lets face it, hitbox will not and will never in the near future be profitable, or make enough revenue to pay streamers. Then why don't you simply say that Hitbox are streaming from a third-party CDN, which according to the average industry pricing is likely to cost them at least $0.03 per GB? Just accept that you don't have any harder evidence than that. You have a valid point, so don't ruin it by claiming they stream from Amazon (factually false) and then pulling up a bullshit pricing page for Edgecast. I actually share your opinion that bandwidth costs are going to be a very serious issue and that Twitch has a significant advantage in this regard.
So what was the point of your posts?
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On August 09 2014 01:24 LSB wrote:Show nested quote +On August 09 2014 00:43 Matoo- wrote:On August 08 2014 23:51 LSB wrote:On August 08 2014 23:33 Matoo- wrote:On August 08 2014 23:15 LSB wrote:On August 08 2014 22:54 Matoo- wrote:On August 08 2014 08:06 LSB wrote:On August 08 2014 06:27 Lonyo wrote:On August 08 2014 06:17 chiflutz wrote:
I don't really know/care about the Owned CEO controversy, but tech-wise hitbox is miles ahead of the old Owned and quite a bit ahead of twitch, worldwide server coverage notwithstanding (although they said on their blog that they do have a worldwide network set up).
It'd be a shame if it turned out to be the same person's moneygrabbing scheme all over again. Apparently it's the guy who took over as CEO of Own3d after all the crap had started going wrong, and was trying to sort it out, and not the guy who started Own3d and made everything go tits up. Apparently. Unsourced (Reddit). Hitbox supposedly 'learned from own3d's mistakes' about keeping their costs down. It's run by the same people http://blog.hitbox.tv/an-introduction-to-our-management/ and making the same mistakes (using amazon) http://whois.domaintools.com/hitbox.tv. The only thing your whois is showing is that their web servers are likely on Amazon. But who cares about that? What matters is their streaming servers, and from a quick glance they're streaming from Edgecast, not from Amazon: (With a stream opened in FF) $ lsof -i | grep plugin [...]->68.232.32.221:macromedia-fcs (ESTABLISHED) $ whois 68.232.32.221 NetName: EDGECAST-NETBLK-04 OrgName: EdgeCast Networks, Inc. Now, I'm not claiming that Edgecast is cheap - as a third-party CDN they're probably charging Hitbox much more than what Twitch has to pay to stream on their own infrastructure - but the fact is that no, they don't seem to be streaming from Amazon. Well, that's worse than amazon as per https://www.scaleengine.com/pricing/edgecast/We are looking at $0.16 per gig. O.O Edgecast's pricing is not public. Your link is from a competing CDN who has every reason in the world to make Edgecast look bad. If that wasn't enough to discredit it, the page hasn't been updated in 4 years, and the quote is for a 25TB commit which may be very different from Hitbox's commit. And do you have any substantial reasoning to believe that Edgecast would provide cheap hosting? Yes my data point is 4 years old, however even in 2010 those prices are instantly high and video CDN pricing hasn't changed very much as a whole. Lets face it, hitbox will not and will never in the near future be profitable, or make enough revenue to pay streamers. Then why don't you simply say that Hitbox are streaming from a third-party CDN, which according to the average industry pricing is likely to cost them at least $0.03 per GB? Just accept that you don't have any harder evidence than that. You have a valid point, so don't ruin it by claiming they stream from Amazon (factually false) and then pulling up a bullshit pricing page for Edgecast. I actually share your opinion that bandwidth costs are going to be a very serious issue and that Twitch has a significant advantage in this regard. So what was the point of your posts?
Bringing back some honesty and accuracy to the discussion. I don't see how that's ever a bad thing.
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On August 08 2014 23:19 Kurr wrote:
Some of the anti-hitbox posts are hilariously shameless.
Going from 1 end of the spectrum ("hitbox runs like shit! it's terrible!") to the other ("well of course it runs amazingly, it's renting servers; clearly that is not sustainable and we need twitch to have a monopoly to encourage competition OBVIOUSLY!") within 1 page.
The person saying it runs amazing lives in Sweden. Pretty sure Hitbox's servers are in Russia.
Same issue as Twitch. Works well for North Americans, runs like shit for Europeans.
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On August 09 2014 02:02 WolfintheSheep wrote:Show nested quote +On August 08 2014 23:19 Kurr wrote:
Some of the anti-hitbox posts are hilariously shameless.
Going from 1 end of the spectrum ("hitbox runs like shit! it's terrible!") to the other ("well of course it runs amazingly, it's renting servers; clearly that is not sustainable and we need twitch to have a monopoly to encourage competition OBVIOUSLY!") within 1 page.
The person saying it runs amazing lives in Sweden. Pretty sure Hitbox's servers are in Russia. Same issue as Twitch. Works well for North Americans, runs like shit for Europeans.
Whoa, you're saying that the quality of the stream is directly related to the number of oceans/international boarders between you and the server? Madness. The UI ran like shit for me, but I am no where near russia. The stream was passable.
And of course renting servers is going to be an issue long term, that shit costs a lot, especially if you are going to be running it internationally(so you need servers in each region).
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Well...... I have no idea if this has been posted in this thread yet but since the acquisition muting copyright media has moved over to twitch vods as well.... which we all thought it was going to be able to avoid...
For example:
http://www.twitch.tv/kyo7763/b/555845663
youtube mutes these tracks in my video due to them being new releases from Japanese entertainment. They now mute a large majority of the Twitch VoD surround the music.
A very sad day for me and anyone else who listens to popular Kpop/Jpop/Anime music.. :l
just so this is clear:
You no longer make meaningful highlights of certain VoDs if you play copyright music while you're playing. This is due to the fact that the streamer's voice and all in game sounds will be VOID during the VoD. It makes the entertainment value very low, and in some instance, nonexistent. If you attempt to highlight a certain part for later it will not have its original sound.
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On August 09 2014 03:20 -Kyo- wrote:
stuff Wow breaking news dude... :|
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On August 09 2014 03:32 Sn0_Man wrote:Wow breaking news dude... :|
I don't read the general discussion, instead of being a dick you could just kindly reply that it has already been posted. You could have done so if you read the first sentence of what I wrote.
Thanks, dude.
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On August 09 2014 03:33 -Kyo- wrote:Show nested quote +On August 09 2014 03:32 Sn0_Man wrote:On August 09 2014 03:20 -Kyo- wrote:
stuff Wow breaking news dude... :| I don't read the general discussion, instead of being a dick you could just kindly reply that it has already been posted. You could have done so if you read the first sentence of what I wrote. Thanks, dude.
You literally missed like 3 days of drama, an AMA and all of twitter exploding about the change. A little sass might have been earned. Just a little.
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On August 09 2014 03:37 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On August 09 2014 03:33 -Kyo- wrote:On August 09 2014 03:32 Sn0_Man wrote:On August 09 2014 03:20 -Kyo- wrote:
stuff Wow breaking news dude... :| I don't read the general discussion, instead of being a dick you could just kindly reply that it has already been posted. You could have done so if you read the first sentence of what I wrote. Thanks, dude. You literally missed like 3 days of drama, an AMA and all of twitter exploding about the change. A little sass might have been earned. Just a little.
Sorry, unlike some people I do not have enough time to post thousands of times and read each thread thoroughly as some individuals who joined in 2012 do.
If you really want to know I literally just arrived back from Japan on Tuesday. Hence why I do not know where or how far this discussion has gone; and moreover, I clearly just noted I do not read general discussion.
Nonetheless, you were useful for something, that being the vague information about there being an AMA. Maybe you might have earned a little more of a thank you. Just maybe.
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It probably helps to acquaint youself with the topic first before deciding to bold and underline half your post. A little discretion goes a long way. Just maybe.
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On August 09 2014 03:45 -Kyo- wrote:Show nested quote +On August 09 2014 03:37 Plansix wrote:On August 09 2014 03:33 -Kyo- wrote:On August 09 2014 03:32 Sn0_Man wrote:On August 09 2014 03:20 -Kyo- wrote:
stuff Wow breaking news dude... :| I don't read the general discussion, instead of being a dick you could just kindly reply that it has already been posted. You could have done so if you read the first sentence of what I wrote. Thanks, dude. You literally missed like 3 days of drama, an AMA and all of twitter exploding about the change. A little sass might have been earned. Just a little. Sorry, unlike some people I do not have enough time to post thousands of times and read each thread thoroughly as some individuals who joined in 2012 do. If you really want to know I literally just arrived back from Japan on Tuesday. Hence why I do not know where or how far this discussion has gone; and moreover, I clearly just noted I do not read general discussion. Nonetheless, you were useful for something, that being the vague information about there being an AMA. Maybe you might have earned a little more of a thank you. Just maybe.
Broadcasting stuff that you don't have permission to use is a bad thing.
There, some helpful advice.
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Northern Ireland23314 Posts
Oh so K-Pop is getting muted too now? Silver linings...
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On August 09 2014 03:45 -Kyo- wrote:Show nested quote +On August 09 2014 03:37 Plansix wrote:On August 09 2014 03:33 -Kyo- wrote:On August 09 2014 03:32 Sn0_Man wrote:On August 09 2014 03:20 -Kyo- wrote:
stuff Wow breaking news dude... :| I don't read the general discussion, instead of being a dick you could just kindly reply that it has already been posted. You could have done so if you read the first sentence of what I wrote. Thanks, dude. You literally missed like 3 days of drama, an AMA and all of twitter exploding about the change. A little sass might have been earned. Just a little. Sorry, unlike some people I do not have enough time to post thousands of times and read each thread thoroughly as some individuals who joined in 2012 do. If you really want to know I literally just arrived back from Japan on Tuesday. Hence why I do not know where or how far this discussion has gone; and moreover, I clearly just noted I do not read general discussion. Nonetheless, you were useful for something, that being the vague information about there being an AMA. Maybe you might have earned a little more of a thank you. Just maybe.
There's a whole thread here. You could try reading it. If you don't read the thread then don't be surprised by that kind of reaction.
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I really hope that vod gets muted by audible magic
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EPT
