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Djodref
France3332 Posts
You still didn't have answered some of my questions... On October 27 2012 03:03 Djodref wrote: I'm going to bed right now (for real this time^^). I'll sleep for few hours then come back... @ sylver Could you please answer my previous questions ? /snip | ||
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
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nackhtjogger
Germany105 Posts
On October 27 2012 10:31 kushm4sta wrote: Is debears like this every game? It's not how I remember him. And yeah debears you basically buttfucked us during the first half of day 1 when you had your little dickmeasuring contest with Rad, which NOTHING came out of. Nothing except spamming the thread to hell and making it unreadable. I don't like this post Hello, I should be asleep and I'll correct this in a few moments. Just wanted to say hello and that I'm in the process of reading the thread. I'll be back in 5 hours or so with my assessment of the situation. I'm a big Street Fighter fan btw, love the flavor. | ||
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da0ud
Hong Kong252 Posts
Just back to see I am dead... Enjoy the game, ill enjoy my vacation :D no need to phone post anymore. | ||
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Rad
United States935 Posts
Anyone around atm? Let's try to spark up some conversation?! This feels completely dead compared to the last 2 nights. I'll give some initial thoughts: If inig is found to be scum at some point: 1. debears confirmed town - because he pushed so hard, i feel this has to be the case. If inig isn't scum, I don't think it says anything about debears one way or the other. 2. djo confirmed town? - perhaps, I say this because djo was one of the first people I remember trying to put up a case on inig, before inig was considered suspicious at all. It doesn't make sense (to me) for scum to bus another scum before there's any clear reason to. I say the above still thinking djo feels scummy at this point, so it's just a scenario of if we find inig to be confirmed scum, I feel like it would confirm him town. During the last hour before the lynch, djo was very indecisive and I don't know how to read that. At this point it's hard to view debears as anything other than town, but I don't consider him confirmed town yet. I do feel the urge to consider him town though. kush feels scummy after the lynch: I looked over some old content briefly, mostly kind of confused/depressed at what just happened so if I'm wrong here please let me know (I might have missed something). This was the scenario: for the case on da0ud: - first suspicion was by alsn - major case from nowhere by kush, he votes for da0ud - alsn agrees with kush and votes for da0ud I don't know kush's meta, and honestly it probably doesn't even matter here, but he was so quick for presenting a serious case on da0ud that in hindsight it feels scummy. Before, it just felt like "wow this guy must know what he's talking about," but now, just scummy. In hindsight, da0ud feels like the perfect target. Semi lurker, hasn't contributed too much, pretty much just like inig but isn't confusing, like he knows what his plan as scum is and is ready to stick to it. Because of that, it feels like scum made this happen rather than town made it happen and scum watched. Perhaps kush saw that and decided to run with it. I'm not convinced that kush is scum but so far he's the main one I glance at and raise an eyebrow to concerning this lynch. let me explain my vote: I voted for da0ud because kush's case was (to me) more convincing than anything against inig (debear's case, djo's case, + anything else I read). I think that might have to do with da0ud not being confusing along with kush's case not being confusing. debear's case on inig was not confusing either but inig himself is confusing. Maybe this threw me off. In hindsight, I think I should have done one of the following: 1. voted for no lynch. I wasn't completely convinced with kush's case, but I was more convinced with with it than the case against inig. If I'm not convinced enough, perhaps I should vote no lynch. I do not know what having a no lynch on d1 means for town (maybe it doesn't help at all?) so choosing this would have been really difficult for me. 2. voted for a lurker. As I said before, I think if we don't have a solid scum read, we should vote lurker. We had a total lurker that we could have voted for and 2 not-so-amazing scum reads. I wasn't sure exactly what would be best here and felt compelled to vote for one or the other. Because of that, I went with what I thought was the better case, but perhaps I should have stuck to my initial thoughts. Up until the lynch time, the only people I really felt I had any sort of scummy read on were debears, djo, and sylver. Everyone else, for me, was null or town vibes. I'm still not sure at this point if inig is scum. Nothing has changed there for me except how crazy it was that da0ud was at 2 votes then suddenly at 7. I need to hear more from inig, his thoughts on all this, I think he should be pressured hard over the next 24h, etc. I want inig to prove his innocence and I want it to make complete sense this time. sylverfyre I just want to state that I feel this guy's actions are completely questionable. If kush died right now and flipped town, I'd have to look at sylver next (even before Alsn I think). He's had a ton of sheeping and was (I think) the 3rd person to jump on da0ud bandwagon (4th being me if I remember correctly). He's the kind of scum I would imagine was waiting for the right opportunity to jump on a townie bandwagon. If he was scum, I'd be very likely to consider inig as scum because of his timing. His arguments are also very wishy washy, a little less confusing than inig's but along the same lines. FoS sylverfyre Final thoughts after re-reading my post Kush's super fast case against da0ud makes sense if inig might potentially be voted. He had 2 votes at that point, by da0ud and dan. Others votes were against imcasey, djo, and roco. It's hard to make a good case to vote imcasey and roco. It's especially hard to make a case for djo because we had been talking about him since the beginning, and he kept just asking questions and creating good conversation. It's easy to jump on da0ud though. He's an easy target like inig and dan were, but if inig is scum, kush would want to jump on the opportunity to frame someone else ASAP because every other vote was obviously going nowhere. FoS Kush | ||
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nackhtjogger
Germany105 Posts
On October 25 2012 18:31 Djodref wrote: @Roco I have more questions for you. Why do you want to never be suspected ? Are you mafia ? Gave me the lolz | ||
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
I think we are not going to here from Roco anymore. I'm not going to draw any conclusion for his two weird posts because they are a just a newbie tell for me. | ||
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
Why are you nor FoSing Alsn ? He was also pushing for a daoud's lynch iirc... I found strange that you forgot him in your recap. | ||
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
On October 27 2012 01:51 Alsn wrote: Also, I think an argument can be made for the usefulness of lynching da0ud in order to find out if Inig is scum or not. If it turns out that da0ud is scum then it almost certainly confirms Inig as innocent(or at worst a SK). This because I just cannot fathom a scenario where a scum D1 bus would be done that poorly. In my mind that's a pretty good reason to find out what da0ud flips, especially since I find him suspicious. The risk is that he'll flip green which wouldn't necessarily be very helpful, but at this point I don't personally see a better option. @ Alsn So daoud has flipped blue. What do you get of this ? | ||
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
@ kush I don't think that a lot of people know you in this game so I think you should give everyone some links to your filters from previous games. I want also to know if you have some scumreads to share with us. I'm also expecting a lot from Alsn and Ini today. I'm also watching sylver closely right now. | ||
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
On October 27 2012 08:20 Mr. Cheesecake wrote: Okay I just got back, and will be here pre and post lynch. My thoughts on the current state of affairs. It seems the lynch is in favor of Inig, but Da0ud following close behind. My vote on Djo is obviously not doing any good. I still consider him suspicious, and he is by no means off the hook. My efforts right now are better spent deciding who is a better lynch candidate: Da0ud or Inig. /snip @ Cheese At this point, were you considering that daoud and Inig were better candidate than me ? You have been suspecting me for quite a long time D1 and you suddenly prefer to lynch daoud because some replacement came in and told you he was scummy ? You alsmost didn't consider him at all until that point yet you have no problem with lynching him instead of your top scumread (which was me) ? I'm pretty surprised that you didn't try to push my lynch. | ||
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
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kushm4sta
United States8878 Posts
I stand by the lynch. I still don't think Ini was scum. We had a bunch of afks. We had no other good lynch candidate. So debears went onto the pony mafia thread after the flip and said On October 27 2012 09:50 debears wrote: LOL. I really need a breathe of fresh pony mafia air :D To me this an indirect but clear reference to this game, how he is upset over lynching a blue. I think there is the possibility for it to be genuine or a scum trick. So it leaves me with a null read. Then he pms me saying it's not related. @debears While this game is going on don't PM me or anyone in the game ever about anything. | ||
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
debears is also playing in the pony themed mafia game going on right now. Check the player list here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=376110 Pretty sure that he was talking about the pony game and not ours. Does anyone look really scummy for you during D1 ? | ||
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
Look what we have from nackhtjogger right now. On October 27 2012 12:09 nackhtjogger wrote: I don't like this post Hello, I should be asleep and I'll correct this in a few moments. Just wanted to say hello and that I'm in the process of reading the thread. I'll be back in 5 hours or so with my assessment of the situation. I'm a big Street Fighter fan btw, love the flavor. 5 hours later: nice assessment. I would tend to agree that our D1 could be ridiculously hilarious but more from a mafia point of view. So, nackhtjogger, if you are town, could you tell us what you have found interesting during this D1 ? We could really use a pair of new eyes right now  Can I call you Nacht by the way ? Or do you prefer Jogger ? | ||
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Djodref
France3332 Posts
Sorry, I have totally misread your post... | ||
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kushm4sta
United States8878 Posts
Djo I have not really put a lot of time into reading the thread and looking at filters, but my primary suspect just from preliminary observations is you. I think your indecision at lynch time is a huge scumtell. It seems like you know that both of them were going to be town and wanted to gain town points by opposing both lynches. If you were town, and you really thought that none of them were scum, you would have tried to push someone who you actually thought was scum. But you did nothing except ask sylver endless questions with really no point to them. | ||
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kushm4sta
United States8878 Posts
And also his little stunt in the pony thread could be something to try to convince people following that thread that he is town. (I actually did this when I got mafia several games ago) | ||
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Dandel Ion
Austria17960 Posts
Djo is looking really scummy now. Remember the slip calling daoud a townie? By now, I'm thinking that it actually was a scumslip. Djo just said "dw guise, it was a slip, but not a scumslip. Trust me!" And people actually did that. My take on that: He wanted to buddy up daoud, and slipped in the process. The day 1 cases against him didn't hold much ground in my eyes, but daoud's flip changes things. ##FoS Djo So Djo is looking scummy, but I have an even stronger scumread, and I'll tunnel this one (like I promised I would!) http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=374466¤tpage=28#547 (also some later posts, won't link all the relevant ones here) He comes into the thread, dismisses the Inig cases with some excuse about how he is "sharing his thoughts" (a convenient way to ignore WHAT those thoughts actually were), and proclaims daoud scum instead. now, the post where daoud voted Inig WAS weird. I'll admit that. I also commented on that when I read it. But it honestly was not such a big deal as Kush pretended it was. His further points on daoud: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=374466¤tpage=31#609 He excused Djo's scumslip too easily. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=374466¤tpage=31#616 He drags out a random quote of daoud from another game, and uses it as "evidence" that his meta is wrong. Later, he tries to imply a townread on Inig AND a way to subtly imply daoud is scum, just because Inig placed a useless vote on me. Note how this is actually a gigantic logical fallacy, since for this to hold true, he has to look at it from the perspective that Inig is scum, but he somehow draws the conclusion that town is more likely to do that? Wat? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=374466¤tpage=32#625 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=374466¤tpage=32#629 I CONSIDER THIS A SCUMSLIP, since he does logic assuming Inig is scum, even though he doesn't get tired of soft-defending Inig and excusing him as "newbie town" (a horrible defense, I think we agreed on that already), and even when he says he considers it a null-tell, he is trying to make it look as something town is more likely to do (which, by the way, is wrong too) On October 27 2012 22:06 kushm4sta wrote: Someone give me a meta read on debears. Is he usually this angry and rambunctious? I don't know his meta but it seems kind of fake to me. And also his little stunt in the pony thread could be something to try to convince people following that thread that he is town. (I actually did this when I got mafia several games ago) You played scum WITH debears. Don't act like you don't know him. His scum meta is something you should be perfectly familiar with. So I don't believe your "I don't know" bullshit. It just looks like you're trying to sow baseless suspicions. Same with this: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=374466¤tpage=36#713 You're trying to imply suspicious behaviour in another thread, from a relatively random comment, that doesn't neccessarily have anything to do with this game at all. That's bad enough. But then the part about how he PM'd you? wtf is this even trying to accomplish? If somebody PMs you, and you actually have a problem with it, you PM the host. Don't go into the thread to wave it around. And then you act like it's a null read anyways? WHY THANK YOU FOR THIS CONTRIBUTION You're just trying to shit up the thread and undermine the position of somebody that most people (including me) have a townread on. ##FoS Kush | ||
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Mr. Cheesecake
United States3756 Posts
On October 27 2012 20:50 kushm4sta wrote: @djo america was still sleeping. chill out. ^ This On October 27 2012 17:53 Djodref wrote: @ Cheese At this point, were you considering that daoud and Inig were better candidate than me ? You have been suspecting me for quite a long time D1 and you suddenly prefer to lynch daoud because some replacement came in and told you he was scummy ? You alsmost didn't consider him at all until that point yet you have no problem with lynching him instead of your top scumread (which was me) ? I'm pretty surprised that you didn't try to push my lynch. Pushing your lynch at that point would have been wasted effort. It wasn't long before lynch when I got home, and I was the only one still with a vote on you. You even said so yourself. Everyone else was piled on top of Inig and Da0ud. I was put in a position where deciding whether Inig/Da0ud was the best candidate for lynch. I looked over both filters and some of the cases, and concluded that my scumread was way stronger on Da0ud than Inig. That being said, you were my best scum read at the time; but there was no chance of you being lynched. On October 27 2012 22:06 kushm4sta wrote: Someone give me a meta read on debears. Is he usually this angry and rambunctious? I don't know his meta but it seems kind of fake to me. And also his little stunt in the pony thread could be something to try to convince people following that thread that he is town. (I actually did this when I got mafia several games ago) @Kush In reading the last newbie game (You know the one), Debears was all over the place in terms of reads as a townie. Some players even thought that all of his different cases were an attempt to "derail the thread" and "promote chaos". In d1, I'd say that's fairly consistent with his meta. This recent nonsensical outburst, however, leaves me with some ill feelings. It seems uncharacteristic, but whether this comes as a response to genuine anger or not is unknown. I'm curious to see his explanation. In terms of the pony thread, I'd say leave it alone. It bears no effect on this game. | ||
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