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On May 30 2012 07:29 rotinegg wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 07:01 SKC wrote:On May 30 2012 04:21 rotinegg wrote:On May 30 2012 03:08 SKC wrote:On May 29 2012 22:39 Torte de Lini wrote:
^perfectly reasonable thing to do.
I like the game, though it does have a lot of flaws. I don't think it's perfectly reasonable to spend hundreds of hours and then return it for the full price because you "didn't really like it". I have no idea how someone would spend 100+ hours in less than 2 weeks doing something they hate out of their own free will. It's one thing to be dissapointed the game is not everything you hoped for, that it didn't give you 10 years of uther joy or whatever you expected, or returning something you used for a little while and realized it's not something you want, but getting like $0.50 per hour of entertainment is not bad, it's worth the money. Do people really play for 80 hours, hate the game, but believe it will magically change in the next 20 hours? *talking about in case the OP would ask for a refund, not asking one in the first 100 hours after launch like in the case quoted, but I still don't think you could have hated playing that much and still get lvl 60 in under 100 hours realtime. I think asking for a full refund for anything you have over 20 hours of playtime doesn't make a lot of sense. The 100 hours were fun, especially my first run through normal, but I felt end-game content was lacking. Once i got to 60, it was like 'now what,' whereas in D2 hitting 99 was pretty difficult. I liked collecting and bartering items from D2 so I had high hopes for AH, which was what kept me playing, but when I realized how inefficient and broken the AH was, I threw the towel in. Didn't help that a bunch of my friends' accounts got hacked. I'm not denying that, I can easily see people not liking the endgame or feeling it get's old fast, but are the 100 hours (which I guess mean at least something like 30 hours gametime) of fun time really not worth $60? Are they really closer to $0 which is what you end up paying with the full refund? That's why I don't agree that it's perfectly reasonable to ask for a full refund in such situation, they should be avaible for people that didn't actually use the product. People are way too harsh on gaming prices sometimes, it's the same with the whole pay to watch VoD's/Streams. $15 for a 2 hours movie is fine, but 60$ for 30+ hours of fun isn't? And it could easily pass 100 hours, do you really feel you would never feel like playing the game again? For me, voting with you wallet ussually means not buying things you don't like or don't agree with, not using them, having fun, and then getting a full refund because you got tired of it, even if you believed you would get 500+ hours of entertainment instead of "only" around 30-40. I see your point. I won't deny that asking for a refund after playing through a large part of the game may cross some people's moral code. In my defense, I had certain expectations when I purchased the game, such as the 500+ hours of entertainment, a working auction house, a challenging experience, and just a place to blow some steam after work. The product was underwhelming and failed to meet my expectations on multiple ends, as I experienced more stress from the login servers being down constantly and the AH not working, so I asked for a full refund. If I bought a rice cooker that promised me I could also steam dumplings in it, but after a few days' use turned out only the rice cooking part worked, I would return it, assuming the store allowed me to return it within a certain timeframe. My roommate and most of my other friends still play D3 but I haven't felt like I wanted to play the game again since I requested a refund. I'll just leave it at that so feel free to make your own judgments about the legitimacy of what I did.
My biggest issue wasn't even with what you did, if you really though it was such a let down, it's your call, and it's your money. But the OP's case is diferent, he has spent more time in the game and his complaints were far less reasonable. Your post came off as an advice, that he should ask for a refund if he feels like it. And them someone else says that's "perfectly reasonable". And no, that's not perfectly reasonable in a general sense, you generally should not spend a hundreds of hours in a game and then be able to get a refund. I feel like there are very few situations that could call for such a thing, and I guess you also wouldn't do this for any other game that you enjoyed for a while but simply didn't live up to your huge expections. There are some drawbacks to all the hype in a title like this one.
I may have come a little strongly, but I just don't think that's something that should be encouraged. It's fine if you feel like you deserve your money back, but I just don't like spreading the word that using something and asking for a refund should be commonly accepted as the right thing to do, specially when your issues with the game are so heavily supported by assumptions that hold no ground.
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I just see a bunch of people putting down the OP to justify their purchase.
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On May 30 2012 08:02 Zombo Joe wrote:
I just see a bunch of people putting down the OP to justify their purchase.
Wut
I've already made 300 bucks off this game while having fun in my spare time. No need to justify it. When all's said and done most people will have made money on this game after they quit.
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On May 30 2012 08:24 Itsmedudeman wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 08:02 Zombo Joe wrote:
I just see a bunch of people putting down the OP to justify their purchase. Wut I've already made 300 bucks off this game while having fun in my spare time. No need to justify it. When all's said and done most people will have made money on this game after they quit.
That's optimistic of you. Let me explain to you what "most people" means.
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On May 30 2012 08:27 Djzapz wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 08:24 Itsmedudeman wrote:On May 30 2012 08:02 Zombo Joe wrote:
I just see a bunch of people putting down the OP to justify their purchase. Wut I've already made 300 bucks off this game while having fun in my spare time. No need to justify it. When all's said and done most people will have made money on this game after they quit. That's optimistic of you. Let me explain to you what "most people" means.
5 million gold isn't that hard to make. Unless you're super casual and it takes you a month to reach 60.
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On May 30 2012 08:30 Itsmedudeman wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 08:27 Djzapz wrote:On May 30 2012 08:24 Itsmedudeman wrote:On May 30 2012 08:02 Zombo Joe wrote:
I just see a bunch of people putting down the OP to justify their purchase. Wut I've already made 300 bucks off this game while having fun in my spare time. No need to justify it. When all's said and done most people will have made money on this game after they quit. That's optimistic of you. Let me explain to you what "most people" means. 5 million gold isn't that hard to make. Unless you're super casual and it takes you a month to reach 60.
That's like the definition of most people to be honest.
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On May 30 2012 05:09 Backpack wrote:I don't understand why people can't just be happy with a good game anymore. Everything always has to be perfect. Show nested quote +Seriously, paying at around 50euro, I have had 100+hours of entertainment, the game is GREAT, solely based on that fact. You say this but then you also go on to say you won't ever be buying from blizzard any more? Instead of being happy with a game they enjoyed, people are just picking out the flaws and complaining... God help you when you try to get a girlfriend with that attitude.
Saying the game is great as in it gave me that 100hours entertainment =/= i cant say I am disappointed by the game overall. I was expecting something better, you would know what i mean if you came from WC2, sc1, WC3. Blizzard is no longer making game for us gamers. My gf on the other hand is amazing to say the least :3
On May 29 2012 22:29 Dead9 wrote:
no, the op's point was that droprates are somehow changed by or because of ah
basically he's complaining about something that doesn't actually exist lol
your drop rates aren't influenced by anything other than ingame mf and rng
droprates are "manipulated" by the ah in the sense that they are lower across the board, but they're still completely random
this is because ah makes it much easier to trade items
for example, imagine in d2 a certain mob drops an uncommon 50% of the time a rare 5% of the time and a legendary .5% of the time
now in d3 the same mob will drop an uncommon 5% of the time a rare .5% of the time and a legendary .05% of the time
dude, that's exactly why i hated that and you cant see why i dislike that so much??
to me diablo is a single player game in the of the day, why the fck, i mean, why the fck in the end of the day, i have got this 0.05% drop because of the design of AH???
And you really cant say how far would they go to manipulate the market. They can even adjust the drop rate of X item when there are too many of it in the market. Why? Because too many rare X item will devalue that item on AH ie blizz make less money. They probably wont limit the total amount of rare X item but the drop rate can be reduced to like 0.0005%. It is possible.
I certainly hope that when they said AH manipulates drop they meant the harmless way you said, all i can see from my personal aspect is that Blizzard has became so fcking greedy that they designed their game in a sense to make more money.
take away AH, let people trade at forum/d2jsp if they want, i dont want my fcking drop affected by anything other than pure mf and rng factors.
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On May 30 2012 08:44 BurningSera wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 05:09 Backpack wrote:I don't understand why people can't just be happy with a good game anymore. Everything always has to be perfect. Seriously, paying at around 50euro, I have had 100+hours of entertainment, the game is GREAT, solely based on that fact. You say this but then you also go on to say you won't ever be buying from blizzard any more? Instead of being happy with a game they enjoyed, people are just picking out the flaws and complaining... God help you when you try to get a girlfriend with that attitude. Saying the game is great as in it gave me that 100hours entertainment =/= i cant say I am disappointed by the game overall. I was expecting something better, you would know what i mean if you came from WC2, sc1, WC3. Blizzard is no longer making game for us gamers. My gf on the other hand is amazing to say the least :3 Show nested quote +On May 29 2012 22:29 Dead9 wrote:
no, the op's point was that droprates are somehow changed by or because of ah
basically he's complaining about something that doesn't actually exist lol
your drop rates aren't influenced by anything other than ingame mf and rng
droprates are "manipulated" by the ah in the sense that they are lower across the board, but they're still completely random
this is because ah makes it much easier to trade items
for example, imagine in d2 a certain mob drops an uncommon 50% of the time a rare 5% of the time and a legendary .5% of the time
now in d3 the same mob will drop an uncommon 5% of the time a rare .5% of the time and a legendary .05% of the time dude, that's exactly why i hated that and you cant see why i dislike that so much?? to me diablo is a single player game in the of the day, why the fck, i mean, why the fck in the end of the day, i have got this 0.05% drop because of the design of AH??? And you really cant say how far would they go to manipulate the market. They can even adjust the drop rate of X item when there are too many of it in the market. Why? Because too many rare X item will devalue that item on AH ie blizz make less money. They probably wont limit the total amount of rare X item but the drop rate can be reduced to like 0.0005%. It is possible. I certainly hope that when they said AH manipulates drop they meant the harmless way you said, all i can see from y personal aspect is that Blizzard has became so fcking greedy that they designed their game in a sense to make more money. take away AH, let people trade at forum/d2jsp if they want, i dont want my fcking drop affected by anything other than pure mf and rng factors.
The people that control the money always control the world.. in D2JSP you also give the creator incredible wealth as he is able to print money at will.. now that power is in blizz's hands. the system is inherently flawed, no matter who you let control it
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On May 30 2012 08:44 BurningSera wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 05:09 Backpack wrote:I don't understand why people can't just be happy with a good game anymore. Everything always has to be perfect. Seriously, paying at around 50euro, I have had 100+hours of entertainment, the game is GREAT, solely based on that fact. You say this but then you also go on to say you won't ever be buying from blizzard any more? Instead of being happy with a game they enjoyed, people are just picking out the flaws and complaining... God help you when you try to get a girlfriend with that attitude. Saying the game is great as in it gave me that 100hours entertainment =/= i cant say I am disappointed by the game overall. I was expecting something better, you would know what i mean if you came from WC2, sc1, WC3. Blizzard is no longer making game for us gamers. My gf on the other hand is amazing to say the least :3 Show nested quote +On May 29 2012 22:29 Dead9 wrote:
no, the op's point was that droprates are somehow changed by or because of ah
basically he's complaining about something that doesn't actually exist lol
your drop rates aren't influenced by anything other than ingame mf and rng
droprates are "manipulated" by the ah in the sense that they are lower across the board, but they're still completely random
this is because ah makes it much easier to trade items
for example, imagine in d2 a certain mob drops an uncommon 50% of the time a rare 5% of the time and a legendary .5% of the time
now in d3 the same mob will drop an uncommon 5% of the time a rare .5% of the time and a legendary .05% of the time dude, that's exactly why i hated that and you cant see why i dislike that so much?? to me diablo is a single player game in the of the day, why the fck, i mean, why the fck in the end of the day, i have got this 0.05% drop because of the design of AH??? And you really cant say how far would they go to manipulate the market. They can even adjust the drop rate of X item when there are too many of it in the market. Why? Because too many rare X item will devalue that item on AH ie blizz make less money. They probably wont limit the total amount of rare X item but the drop rate can be reduced to like 0.0005%. It is possible. I certainly hope that when they said AH manipulates drop they meant the harmless way you said, all i can see from y personal aspect is that Blizzard has became so fcking greedy that they designed their game in a sense to make more money. take away AH, let people trade at forum/d2jsp if they want, i dont want my fcking drop affected by anything other than pure mf and rng factors.
Trading would still affect the drop rates. And they have confirmed it's a simple drop in rates. Do you think trading (well, and duping/boting) didn't affect D2? Runewords, Uber Tristam, etc. wouldn't be tuned that way strictly for single player. Have you ever gotten a Zod?
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^nope, i have only seen zod from other's print screen xD but i am fine with that. i dont feel bad when i didn't win the lottery while someone won it. but i will be very angry if someone won it and there is some kind of manipulation involved (be it directly related to that winner or not).
and i didn't use bot back then  i have only gotten less than 10 gold items throughout my countless hours dumped for d2 and i absolutely love those moments. is all in the brain i know but that's how lottery works.
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On May 30 2012 09:04 BurningSera wrote:^nope, i have only seen zod from other's print screen xD but i am fine with that. i dont feel bad when i didn't win the lottery while someone won it. but i will be very angry if someone won it and there is some kind of manipulation involved (be it directly related to that winner or not). and i didn't use bot back then i have only gotten less than 10 gold items throughout my countless hours dumped for d2 and i absolutely love those moments. is all in the brain i know but that's how lottery works.
There isn't any more manipulation in D3 than there was in D2. In both games, the drop rates of some stuff are very, very low because you are suposed to get them by trading, not single player. The big diference is that D2 required a lot less to finish the game, so you feel like you have to use the AH in D3, but farming for an extended period of time is still technically possible.
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so many people do not remember that in D2, people farmed gear to convert to SoJs/runes which then allowed them to trade for gear they needed.
I have no idea why so many people thought they were able to acquire solely through drops because rng is rng and you're more likely to get stuff you don't need but others might when you're playing a single class and there are 3-4 other classes in the game.
all Blizzard did was replace SoJs/runes with gold and replaced the D2 trading process of bartering through public games or creating and maintaining forum threads for trades. D2jsp's foundation was so that people could build up forum gold and use that as trade currency instead of SoJs/runes.
so many people seem to have their opinions clouded by nostalgia and I seriously wonder how much D2 people actually played through its lifetime when comparing D2 and D3
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On May 29 2012 23:18 BadBinky wrote:
So that's why there's no RMAH for hardcore. Any speculations about when "perfect sword of one shot" will reach droprate of 0? :D
there's no RMAH for hardcore because Blizzard doesn't want Hardcore players crying to them once their character dies and they spent 100s of dollars to gear the character
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Ya, people said this was nonsense when i wrote this. Now that i hope everyone realized that i spoke the truth!!
RMAH/GAH ruined D3. Blizz why you so greedy.
/rant
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it was nonsense when you wrote it because you were complaining about something that doesn't even exist lol
you can certainly argue that the ah ruined d3, but you can't say it's because using the ah changes your droprates
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EPT
