EPTSurprisingly Normal Mini Mafia IX - Page 19
| Forum Index > TL Mafia |
|
Mementoss
Canada2595 Posts
| ||
|
Artanis[Xp]
Netherlands12968 Posts
On March 26 2012 21:38 Mementoss wrote: I still think case-wise, the Nova_Terra case seems stronger to me, but Seviro is suspicious based on the context of his actions/posts, more than the actual post content. This is my main reason that I'd rather go for Seviro than Nova_Terra as well. Something just doesn't sit right with me for the context of Seviro's posts, and it's exactly that pattern that I've often seen mafia players take in past games. They generally don't make large slipups, just try to not contribute to town while still typing a lot. When I pointed this out, he said I missed the point of his posts yet he never bothered to specify which 'point' that actually is. For that reason; ##Vote: Seviro | ||
|
Mementoss
Canada2595 Posts
| ||
|
Artanis[Xp]
Netherlands12968 Posts
| ||
|
Mementoss
Canada2595 Posts
| ||
|
Nova_Terra
Switzerland1190 Posts
| ||
|
Seviro
Canada98 Posts
On March 26 2012 19:21 Nova_Terra wrote: This post kinda came off weird to me. posts some stuff about last game, says how we shouldnt be inactive, and ends on kind of a weird note about pressuring lurkers but not lynching too fast. which is especially strange when later in the day he randomly votes for a lurker. If you're talking about ROS, at the time I voted on him he already had quite a lot of post, they were just not making any sense. And the Virtu vote was more like me pointing out that he said he would post his thought and that 22 hour later he had still not posted. This is one of the posts that i feel the weirdest about. he says that we should have some soft deadline which i had already stated and he agreed on, and then says we can discuss and that if someone has nobody they think is suspicious at all they can just vote No-Lynch no problem and then just switch it later when they feel like? Seems to me like hes encouraging sc2system-like behavior. really weird. At least by voting no-Lynch it is clear for everyone that they don'T have a clue yet as oppose that if they just didn't vote. Then he clears this up saying not to no-lynch, but I still don’t think that his point makes sense, its just encouraging people to say that they are undecided, then wait until last minute and flip with little explanation of their own. See above. I don’t really think that seviro handled defending this case well.it came off very defensive and the end was just OMGUS. One thing I want to note is that he says pressuring is asking people to post thoughts and respond to questions, and lynching is voting them down. In his next few posts he just goes on about how rise of fenix is just probably bad in general, but it isn’t really helping anything. He doesn’t want to lynch him, but doesn’t really present any other option? Scummy. Of course it came off defensive, every single point were due to it being Day 1, these point were true for other people too as you mentionned after his post. And at this point, I was not feeling anyone was more scummy than another one since other than the lurker everyone had about the same activity and were just chit-chatting. And then when RoF posts saying he will try to make it up he goes a bit weird. At this point it starts to go back to the thing about how he just wants to pressure lurkers and not lynch. Now hes just threatening him to post or die, which isn’t really wanting to “not lynch lurkers immediately” At this point ROS was no more a lurker, he had all the time that he wanted to posting something that had some value but all we got was "I'll be better tomorrow".It's not like it was his only post. Lolwut? This is just…. Says lurkers should be pressured (which apparently means asking them directly for their opinion and not voting >Votes for lurker for no reason other than him not having been there for 22 hours That’s just contradicting and scummy. Then he switches between Virtu and RoF (also a lurker) As said above, the vote on Virtu was mostly pointing out that he didn't post for 22 hour when he said he would. After I post my case, the only thing I get from him is Hum, some good point there. No other thoughts on the case at all. Not really suspicious there, but to not share any thoughts on it at all? Ok, I didn'T say clearly "Yes I agree with you", but I added 2 quote that were strenghtening your case. What would I do that had I disagree?. Mhm, compare this to No? you call a pressure play a play where you ask someone to post their opinion on a subject. Virtu's case was different since he did say he would come and post. I knoew it was coming so it was just kind of a reminder. He posts some seeming analysis on Mementoss and more importantly TheMichael but doesn’t really do anything with it. This is his first “real” case/important analysis. Most of his content has been defense or fluff. What would I do with it? I mentioned why I did this little case on Mementoss and then I waited for Micalethe's answers. The main thing I noticed in his defense is really how defensive and angry he got. Scum traits. Maybe it did seems defensive and angry, but most of his point were based on false fact, saying me say something I didn'T and thing that I already answered so of course I got a little impatient. The endless irritation and defense doesn’t stop. See above. In the post he says that the other person is understanding badly, makes this Inb4 crap, says that themichael is arrogant etc and has a certain attitude (not saying themichael isn’t scummy, hope to post my thoughts on him relatively soon after this case) but its just rude, and seems OMGUS himself. Since the Artanis/Seviro case, every case I got on me were basically saying the same thing overall. Most of the point that are against me I defended them over and over again and it seems that no one notice since thehy keep coming back as if they were new. And I stand by the fact that micaelthe is needlessly discrediting others post by saying things like he did. (I don't know if you remember last game but you said yourself that it is a scum trait.) Since it seems that one of us will fall today, i'll put my vote on you and if something major happens, I might change. ##vote: Nova_Terra | ||
|
Seviro
Canada98 Posts
On March 26 2012 21:38 Mementoss wrote: If we lynch Seviro and Seviro flips town, Michael would be highly suspicious and so would Nova Terra. I would gladly die for it to happen, the thing I'm afraid of though is if Virtu doesn't get replaced and he is town we are currently in a MYLO situation. we are currently 6 towns/3 scums. if virtu is town and get modkilled 5 town/3 scum if I die (I'm Town btw) 4 town/3 scum and if we add the nigth kill 3 town/3 scums Even if virtu get replaced, tomorrow we'll be at a LYLO situation so today is quite important and if we can get a scum we would be in a much better shape than we are actually. | ||
|
ZBot
194 Posts
Remember, everyone must vote, and you need a majority to lynch (5 people in this case) Current votes: Seviro (4): michaelthe, BlueyD, Nova_Terra, Artanis[Xp] Nova_Terra (3): Mementoss, Ninja4ever., Seviro Not voting: Gossemerr, virtu The Day deadline is at 2012-03-27 12:00:00. (That's approximately 11:52:09 from now.) | ||
|
Nova_Terra
Switzerland1190 Posts
| ||
|
BlueyD
Canada437 Posts
Oh, I really just think now that Fenix is playing poorly or just doesn't care enough to put enough time on the game. But I'll give him the chance to step up his play because I really think he is town. I think that if he was mafia, his fellow scum would have helped him in the background so that he don't look so suspicious. For now I think he is just bad and as I said, i'm willing to give him a chance to step up his play. I shouldn't have said that I think that he is really town, more like I don't see him being more scummy than anyone else right now. Yeah I know, I just feel like it's too obvious to be true. I might be wrong tho. Okay, so he plays poorly, looks suspicious, and feels like obvious scum to you. Great defense! It doesn't feel like you're defending him at all to me, since you bring up something I can bold in every single post. I'm not at 1/1 or at 1/4 now, I'm at 4/4. Truth is when someone looks this bad, we lynch him to know what he is. That's how the game is played. He was a decent lynch target from the start and the only defense you could have brought out was "someone else looks even worse", as I did. Never try to defend me, by the way. | ||
|
BlueyD
Canada437 Posts
Oh, for people wondering, my issue here isn't Rise, it's Seviro trying to gain credit on something he didn't do after the fact. That's a scummy thing to do. | ||
|
Gossemerr
United States195 Posts
##Vote: Nova_Terra He didn't even respond to Mem's post about his defense, or my little blurb for that matter. I need to read through to thread in order this evening to gather my thoughts a bit more on everyone else. | ||
|
Nova_Terra
Switzerland1190 Posts
I thought that looking back on the game that the pressure i made then was more just suspicious early play from me and OMGUS. | ||
|
Mementoss
Canada2595 Posts
Except there is some unique cases, if both Nova and Seviro are scum obviously they are going to vote for the opposite. Also it is possible that Virtu is scum and since hes not voting we can't really look into it. Mafia most likely has 3/8 active voters right now (if virtu is town) the fact that the Seviro vote is going a bit too smooth worries me. | ||
|
Artanis[Xp]
Netherlands12968 Posts
On March 27 2012 04:04 Mementoss wrote: I actually really like BlueyD's point on Seviro, that he is kinda taking credit for something he didn't do. This alone is a better part of the case than most of the other analysis. The Seviro vote train moved a lot faster than the Nova one did though, which leaves me to wonder. All 3 mafia probably aren't on the same vote. They would split up to have less connections between them at least for now. Except there is some unique cases, if both Nova and Seviro are scum obviously they are going to vote for the opposite. Also it is possible that Virtu is scum and since hes not voting we can't really look into it. Mafia most likely has 3/8 active voters right now (if virtu is town) the fact that the Seviro vote is going a bit too smooth worries me. I share your worries, but Mafia might be willing to let Seviro go at this point to look more like town. They already have an advantage and it could be worth saccing one mafia to ensure victory for the rest. Nova's case also came out of thin air as soon as I posted my three cases, which leads me to believe that mafia might've needed a fourth case to try and stretch out town as much as possible, especially after Grosmerr's case wasn't very convincing. Despite Nova's bad defense I still don't feel like he's mafia, if anything it feels more like bad townie play since it's such an unlikely mafia defense. This is all WIFOM though, but so is the argument of the Seviro train going too fast. | ||
|
Nova_Terra
Switzerland1190 Posts
On March 26 2012 10:55 Mementoss wrote: Alright lets respond to this defense. First lets start off by underlining everything Nova_Terra said about IRL, and just not read it. Why? IRL stuff has nothing to do with the game, because it can be lied about and no one would know the difference. It is not acceptable as a defense in any form. You shouldn't be scared to post as a vanilla townie. The only way scum is found is through posting your ideas. Re-read your posts from a different perspective to see how it sounds. No excuse to not be posting analysis. Stick to your guns if you think your right, correct yourself if you think you are wrong and explain why the change of thought. No apologizing needed. While you maintain your opinion on leadership, I maintain my opinion that it is bullshit. Not only is it not a good scum argument, it could scare BlueyD and other newer players away from posting, because they don't want this "leadershit" stuff to come back and haunt them. And why BlueyD? I would consider myself in that role more than him. I put out a case that lead to a townie lynch, and was the first to suggest a vigshot on another townie. Would I rathered one or both of them to flip scum? Of course. Am I pissed at myself about it? Not really. It did its job at getting rid of 2 confusing shitty players. Confirmed a townie that was leaning scum in a couple peoples eyes. And took a lot of time that woulda been wasted pushing/pressure sc2system and Artanis. Now we can continue with the game. It gained time and added information, 2 very important resources. About people not agreeing with your case and putting time into it. This game is not being able to be right and finding scum. Its about being able to convince people to agree with your opinions. No matter how much your right about finding scum, if you cant convince the rest of the town, it will not matter. Don't let this discourage you, keep getting better. About people saying its a free kill against a mafia? No it isn't. You realize how hard it would be for Artanis to survive to a point where it actually would be this situation. Hell we mighta lynched him day 2. At least it wasn't wasted in a death, and helped the town and gave information. Which is helpful at anytime. Then to end your defense you post something scummy. Ugh. This list is not helpful to me. If your posting with purpose and concisely. You should be able to know someones read on everyone just by reading their filter. The list basically says who you think is scum and half a sentence explanation. Would it not make more sense to just post a post based on the explanation? This doesn't pressure the players, it doesn't generate discussion and is easy way for mafia to "contribute" while he can just put a townie label on his mafia friends and scum on the popular choices. Im not retracting my vote on you at the moment. Let the discussion continue. I want to see some opinions. We have a relatively good chance of killing a scum today, and it would be huge to do so. Also i was spending a ton of time on my seviro case and just relaxed after that. Okay, advice taken. Why do you think that it isnt scummy to talk as if you are giving directions and then hanging back after that? after he made those posts, he didnt really do much to back up his position at all, and that made it suspicious for me. I noted BlueyD for that because he didnt really back up his position with anything meaningfull, where as you did and seemed very pro town. Yeah, i need help learning how to make my cases better. something is apparently going terribly wrong, somewhere. However, i definitely think my case vs Seviro has merit and brings up some very good points. I dont really think sc2systems death gave much information at all. correct me if i am wrong. yes, okay, maybe it isnt a free kill, but i think there are much better ways to use that shot later, if he could survive until then. A brief overview of my reads is scummy? i thought you guys were getting on my case for not posting much thoughts/analysis, and i thought this was a good way to do this. I think that a reads post can generate good discussion as it helps people see where people are coming from and it can show inconsistencies between different peoples reads. And if i was mafia it wouldnt make sense to me label my mafia friends as townie, because if one of them gets lynched (or if i did) who wouldit reflect badly on? Me/them. Also, if this is scummy to you, i want to note that seviro does pretty much the same thing (with a little bit more content) in one of his next posts. | ||
|
Nova_Terra
Switzerland1190 Posts
a very precarious position o.o | ||
|
Mementoss
Canada2595 Posts
| ||
|
Artanis[Xp]
Netherlands12968 Posts
On March 27 2012 04:20 Mementoss wrote: Yes, Im so on the fence right now its unbelievable. It would be amazing if you were both scum buddies but that seems to be me just hoping hard. And yes I did note that Seviro did the exact same scummy thing as you. It has to be so amazing to be host right now if only one of these two is mafia. | ||
| ||
