EPTThe floating point number stuff is "x87" code traditionally, but that was sort of replaced over time with different instruction sets. "SSE" was one of those, and "AVX" and "AVX2" are the most current. It can be both unimportant and important as the programs need to be prepared to use it. Developers don't necessarily have to involve themselves much with this, they just need to use the newest Intel C/C++ compiler.
Computer Build Resource Thread - Page 1517
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Ropid
Germany3557 Posts
The floating point number stuff is "x87" code traditionally, but that was sort of replaced over time with different instruction sets. "SSE" was one of those, and "AVX" and "AVX2" are the most current. It can be both unimportant and important as the programs need to be prepared to use it. Developers don't necessarily have to involve themselves much with this, they just need to use the newest Intel C/C++ compiler. | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20275 Posts
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Womwomwom
5930 Posts
As for delidding, there has been some confirmation that Haswell does the exact same shit as Ivy Bridge with the god awful TIM. This should be proof enough. Edit: Keep in mind, I'm not responsible if you scratch the PCB/processor die! | ||
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{ToT}ColmA
Japan3260 Posts
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Cyro
United Kingdom20275 Posts
On June 03 2013 21:30 Womwomwom wrote: Motherbaords seem to be relatively pointless in terms of generic overclocking. Your $300 Gigabyte board doesn't really put out better results than your entry level Z87X board. As for delidding, there has been some confirmation that Haswell does the exact same shit as Ivy Bridge with the god awful TIM. This should be proof enough. Edit: Keep in mind, I'm not responsible if you scratch the PCB/processor die! Good to hear this more, but i'm thinking a little more than generic overclocking. Right now i was looking towards a twin tower heatsink (silver arrow) and delid with clu) and most people won't test under these conditions so i am trying to be quite sure of my choices, rather than take a guess and hope for the best I know haswell has IHS problems, already seen delids but thanks for that link though (just not a ton of info, and there was talk about needing to do something about exposed contacts or something for safety?) There was testing done btw, and most of the temperature gap was caused by the gap that the glue creates between the IHS and the die, not from the actual TIM itself (which seems pretty decent, just not liquid ultra) I don't think i could mess up the hammer method. If people that do it this way have working cpu's, i am confident in my abilities :D On June 03 2013 21:57 {ToT}ColmA wrote: anyone here familiar with oc on an i5 3570k? new pc arriving in 2 days and this is gonna be my first intel cpu since pentium 1 100mhz and the obnoxious turbo button ^_- any help here or a link to a good side for oc would be appreciated It's pretty easy, what motherboard and heatsink are you getting? (motherboard for specific advise and guide link, and heatsink to advise on performance etc) | ||
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Womwomwom
5930 Posts
The hammer method looks foolproof provided you don't hit too hard. I still wouldn't want to have the exposed die fly across the table like that. | ||
Antoine
United States7481 Posts
Then on the subject of physical size, how do I know if after-market heatsink will fit appropriately in case/on motherboard without covering stuff up? I was looking at the TT Frio or CM TPC812 | ||
MisterFred
United States2033 Posts
Any random z77 should be capable of a beginner OC on a 3770k. A step above dirt cheap is often recommended for more than a beginner OC. More than a single step above absolutely cheapest entry-level is useless for most people. Any ATX or m-ATX board should fit your case. It may not having mounting holes for mini-ITX (one expansion slot) or room for E-ATX or other sizes (not a concern, the vast majority of boards are ATX or m-ATX). For heatsink, look up product information for your case and the heatsink. The heatsink will have vertical height: the case will have a vertical height limit. Most decent cases can fit coolers 163mm high or shorter, only a few heatsinks exceed that. Unless you have a small motherboard, the heatsink will rarely conflict with expansion slots. In rare occasions the top expansion slot is covered, which makes it necessary to ensure another suitable slot is available for the video card. This will basically never be a concern on ATX boards, only occasionally on m-ATX boards, often on mini-ITX boards. The most common conflict when it comes to physical dimensions is between heatsink and RAM. If you have RAM with tall, spiky heatspreaders (which are useless, by the way), that will often conflict with a tower-style cooler. Edit: As for specific parts recommendations, the basic Biostart z77 is currently on sale: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813138352 Often the Gigabyte GA-Z77-HD3 is also good choice (by often, I'm generally referring to pricing and being a step above the dirt-cheapest option). However I caution that only an i7-3770K can be overclocked. Without the K and no overclock is possible. Motherboards cheaper than a z77, will do (B75, H77) if you're not overclocking. Also, Intel has new processors out, so if you haven't already purchased your CPU you should be looking at the newer generation, not an i7-3770k. | ||
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Antoine
United States7481 Posts
wow I am just wholly unprepared here yes I bought the 3770k on Friday for $229 so I can still return it if I decide I want haswell. right now still considering it based on the latest micro center deals - they have the 4770k for 279, 4670k for 199, and then I could save another $40 bundling with certain motherboards. I have until the 16th to make that decision so I am waiting for some more results/picking out motherboards. | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20275 Posts
Dual GPU is a bit niche unless you're an enthusiast. I use only one PCIE slot in my current build and plan to in my future one, and as far as i know, most people do | ||
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Myrmidon
United States9452 Posts
Motherboard already has Ethernet and audio onboard. Everything that could go in an expansion slot except a decent graphics card (so network interfaces, capture cards, sound cards, etc.) has USB variants these days. Though for some niche things like capture cards and SATA RAID cards or RAID SSD cards, higher-end models tend to have PCIe interfaces for the faster transfer rates. | ||
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Antoine
United States7481 Posts
edit: looking at the actual picture, it doesn't seem like it matches up with the printed specs. this is all so confusing. | ||
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SpikeStarcraft
Germany2095 Posts
Im planning to build a new pc and as for now the haswell processors are not more expensive, at least the older cpus didnt drop in price yet. any opinions/recommendations? | ||
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Alryk
United States2718 Posts
On June 04 2013 00:21 SpikeStarcraft wrote: hey im wondering whats your opinion on haswell processors and if they will be added to the op? Im planning to build a new pc and as for now the haswell processors are not more expensive, at least the older cpus didnt drop in price yet. any opinions/recommendations? Depends on if you're over clocking. Fill out the OP. Generally, quad core nonK or 4670K. old Intel ivy bridge cpu's don't tend to drop in piece as well | ||
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Rannasha
Netherlands2398 Posts
On June 03 2013 23:46 Antoine wrote: Thanks guys, this has been really helpful. For example one I might have bought without this information is http://www.microcenter.com/single_product_results.aspx?sku=999474 (total of $415 w/ my CPU i bought) but then I look at the specs and realize, only 2 SATA 6.0 means i'd have to 3.0 one of the drives if I go dual 1tbHDD+250gbSSD, and then it only has 4 expansion slots. SATA2 (3 Gbps) is perfectly fine for regular harddisks, as it's still much faster than what the drive can handle. Even for SSD you'll not notice the real-life benefits of SATA3 (6 Gbps). 4 Expansion slots is also more than almost anyone needs. Like others said before me, except for niche purposes, people only use 1 (for their graphics card). Network and sound is onboard on the motherboard (with good enough quality for everyday use) and a second graphics card doesn't benefit that many people. on the other hand, i could bundle http://www.microcenter.com/single_product_results.aspx?sku=614941 with a 4770k for a total of $425, and it seems almost comically good for the price. Is there something I'm missing on the second one? Doesn't seem like it should be so cheap. Looks like a decent enough price for a Z87 motherboard, should be able to get a cheaper model with the same chipset though. Not sure why you would be missing something, the price isn't that low. edit: looking at the actual picture, it doesn't seem like it matches up with the printed specs. this is all so confusing. I couldn't find SATA ports 9 and 10 on the picture, any other things that I missed? | ||
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Antoine
United States7481 Posts
On June 04 2013 00:51 Rannasha wrote: SATA2 (3 Gbps) is perfectly fine for regular harddisks, as it's still much faster than what the drive can handle. Even for SSD you'll not notice the real-life benefits of SATA3 (6 Gbps). 4 Expansion slots is also more than almost anyone needs. Like others said before me, except for niche purposes, people only use 1 (for their graphics card). Network and sound is onboard on the motherboard (with good enough quality for everyday use) and a second graphics card doesn't benefit that many people. Looks like a decent enough price for a Z87 motherboard, should be able to get a cheaper model with the same chipset though. Not sure why you would be missing something, the price isn't that low. I couldn't find SATA ports 9 and 10 on the picture, any other things that I missed? Ah, I was confused - thought SATA3 meant 3 Gbps. You really think I could beat $425 for a 4770k and same chipset motherboard? Also, is there a good place to look for graphics card deals? Like some sort of place where they track deals and so forth. I'm pretty settled on a GTX 770 but I'm not sure where to buy. | ||
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MisterFred
United States2033 Posts
On June 04 2013 01:01 Antoine wrote: Ah, I was confused - thought SATA3 meant 3 Gbps. You really think I could beat $425 for a 4770k and same chipset motherboard? Also, is there a good place to look for graphics card deals? Like some sort of place where they track deals and so forth. I'm pretty settled on a GTX 770 but I'm not sure where to buy. The microcenter bundle option is excellent by the way. That motherboard will cover everything you need, will be above the bottom-tier in terms of overclocking options (Gigabyte puts that X in their product number to indicate full overclocking options), and microcenter is so cheap when it comes to CPU+mobo. Over the last few years, they pretty much always beat any other U.S. option for CPU & mobo bundles for some reason. Presumably to bring people in to spend money on other overpriced components. Edit: Most of the below covered already. SATA3 = SATA 6Gbps, SATA2 = 3Gbps. Yeah, that gets me all the time too. But you really shouldn't need more than 1 SATA3 port. SATA2 is fine for your DVD burner. SATA2 is also plenty for your hard drive(s) - "SATA3" or "SATA 6Gbps" hard drives is just marketing gibberish. It really only means "compatible with." SATA3 is absolutely not necessary for hard drives. It is for a good SSD - but that just leaves one SATA3 port needed, unless you have more than one SSD. Also, as mentioned above, you have a graphics card going into expansion slots (these will also physically cover the slot below the one they plug into). But SSDs plug into SATA ports, something else entirely. Motherboards all come with their own NICs as well. Some people have internal wireless cards that go into pci-e slots, but the USB dongle equivalents are generally better. And all motherboards have onboard sound nowadays, so your average gamer usually only needs the one slot for the video card. But there are exceptions. Edit2: Unlike CPUs, there's no obvious cheap choice for video cards. Newegg is usually a good bet for a good selection & fair prices. A 770 is a fine choice, though I'd note that if you find a 7970 for significantly cheaper, those cards are supposed to have about the same performance. | ||
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Myrmidon
United States9452 Posts
Maybe it means multiple things? | ||
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SpikeStarcraft
Germany2095 Posts
750-1000€ What is your resolution? 1920x1200 What are you using it for? Gaming and perhaps streaming What is your upgrade cycle? As long as possible. I bought a new system 2002 (graphic card upgrade upgrade somewhere 2006ish), 2009 and now its 2013. When do you plan on building it? I thought now is the time because of haswell. Do you plan on overclocking? I dont plan on messing up my system. Do you need an Operating System? Yes i need one. Do you plan to add a second GPU for SLI or Crossfire? No i dont think i want to go that high end. Where are you buying your parts from? I can buy from german websites like alternate.de (sponsor of Team Alternate  ), or amazon.de or hardwareversand.de. All those german websites. I did some research right now and have a system configurated at alternate.de for 779€: CPU: Core™ i5-4670 - € 209,90 GPU: Radeon HD 7870 Dual Fan Black Edition - € 219,90 Mainboard: MSI H87-G41 PC Mate - € 88,90 RAM: G.Skill DIMM 4 GB DDR3-1066 - € 29,99 HDD: Western Digital WD5000AAKX 500 GB - € 45,49 Case: Zalman Z9 Plus - € 49,99 PSU: Thermaltake Hamburg 530W - € 42,99 OS: Windows 7 Home Premium - € 91,90 so my question: are there any major flaws in my plan or would you do something differently? | ||
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Rannasha
Netherlands2398 Posts
DDR3-1066 is pretty ancient and even though memory speeds don't affect performance that much, there's no real reason to go below the speeds your CPU is rated for, which is DDR3-1600. Additionally, 4 GB is a rather low amount. It'll work, but for a modern system I wouldn't really go below 8 GB, so you can do a bit of multitasking at least. Make sure to get your RAM modules in pairs (so 2 x 4 GB if you go for 8 GB). Finally, "I dont plan on messing up my system." is not a valid answer to the question on overclocking. | ||
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