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On June 04 2013 02:39 Rannasha wrote:
Get different memory.
DDR3-1066 is pretty ancient and even though memory speeds don't affect performance that much, there's no real reason to go below the speeds your CPU is rated for, which is DDR3-1600.
Additionally, 4 GB is a rather low amount. It'll work, but for a modern system I wouldn't really go below 8 GB, so you can do a bit of multitasking at least. Make sure to get your RAM modules in pairs (so 2 x 4 GB if you go for 8 GB).
Finally, "I dont plan on messing up my system." is not a valid answer to the question on overclocking.
Ok^^ I dont want to overclock, because i dont have any experience with overclocking. So i rather choose not to mess up my system.
ok i wasnt sure if i really needed 8 gb since a lot of programs / games dont use them anyhow. And i dont want to do photoshop stuff. But yeah i can look for a little more ram.
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On June 04 2013 02:06 Myrmidon wrote:
Really? I thought that Gigabyte X meant SLI support (which means x8/x8 at least), for the Intel boards at least... which usually only comes on higher-end boards that get the overclocking features.
Maybe it means multiple things?
Hmm. Well I don't follow it exactly. You might be right. For me the increased overclocking features were the notable difference between the Z77-D3H/Z77-DS3H and the Z77X-D3H. At least that came up when this thread had that long discussion about overclocking options on low-end boards (notable to me at the time as I hadn't realized Gigabyte had also gimped their low-end lineup). Though looking at newegg now, only the X board of those 3 had SLI capability.
So, check that, you're almost certainly right. As usual. 
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On June 03 2013 22:06 Cyro wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2013 21:57 {ToT}ColmA wrote:
anyone here familiar with oc on an i5 3570k? new pc arriving in 2 days and this is gonna be my first intel cpu since pentium 1 100mhz and the obnoxious turbo button ^_- any help here or a link to a good side for oc would be appreciated It's pretty easy, what motherboard and heatsink are you getting? (motherboard for specific advise and guide link, and heatsink to advise on performance etc)
Gigabyte GA-Z77X-D3H Intel Z77 + macho hr02 on i5 3570k
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On June 04 2013 02:55 SpikeStarcraft wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2013 02:39 Rannasha wrote:
Get different memory.
DDR3-1066 is pretty ancient and even though memory speeds don't affect performance that much, there's no real reason to go below the speeds your CPU is rated for, which is DDR3-1600.
Additionally, 4 GB is a rather low amount. It'll work, but for a modern system I wouldn't really go below 8 GB, so you can do a bit of multitasking at least. Make sure to get your RAM modules in pairs (so 2 x 4 GB if you go for 8 GB).
Finally, "I dont plan on messing up my system." is not a valid answer to the question on overclocking. Ok^^ I dont want to overclock, because i dont have any experience with overclocking. So i rather choose not to mess up my system. ok i wasnt sure if i really needed 8 gb since a lot of programs / games dont use them anyhow. And i dont want to do photoshop stuff. But yeah i can look for a little more ram.
That's not a valid answer buddy It does not make sense. If you're tying to say "I have neither the time nor interest to invest in nice 20% performance increase for a minor cost" that's fair enough. But your answer simply doesn't make sense in the right context  I would highly recommend overclocking. These days it's a relatively painless process and very nice jump in performance can be attained with almost no tweaking. But that's just my opinion!
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United Kingdom20322 Posts
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What is your budget?
I'm hoping to keep it around $350
What is your resolution?
1600x900
What are you using it for?
I'm using it only for SC2
What is your upgrade cycle?
As long as possible.
When do you plan on building it?
I plan on building it soon as I get the parts. I'm willing to wait for better deals though
Do you plan on overclocking?
No.
Do you need an operating system?
Yes.
Do you plan to do SLI/Crossfire?
No.
Where are you buying your parts from?
At the newegg.
Since I'm on a tight budget I'm hoping that I can just re-use a lot of the stuff from my old HP computer. I upgraded it a couple years ago when WOL's release date was announced. The only things I did to it were replaced the PSU and added an EVGA GTS 450. The PSU died and I've decided to just upgrade while I'm ordering the PSU. I pretty much want to re-use everything other than the CPU and MOBO. This is the PC I'm currently using.
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Since I'm not planning on upgrading after this purchase for awhile would it be best to stretch the budget and squeeze in an i5? I don't mind working in the HP case although it is really small. Later on down the road I'll get a new case and SSD just 'cause the WD Green is so slow. My current PC has 3 sticks of 2GB RAM, would it be possible to get a mobo that has 4 RAM slots? It's not that big of a deal though since I don't think I've ever gotten above 4GB being used.
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Canada13389 Posts
On June 03 2013 08:13 skyR wrote:Show nested quote +On June 03 2013 07:01 ZeromuS wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On May 28 2013 06:15 skyR wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2013 05:35 ZeromuS wrote:+ Show Spoiler +I have never built a PC before but am thinking of doing so in the coming months.
Currently, I and my girlfriend are both students and use laptops as we don't live together but often go to eachothers homes every day. In the fall, she will be starting a new program in another city and I will be finishing my masters. Keeping this in mind, I am thinking of investing in a desktop since I won't be required to be nearly as mobile as I am now. The odd time I will be driving back to Ottawa for meetings regarding my MA thesis but those won't be often and will be day trips so I can manage without the computer at those times. Her laptop is starting to fail and we have one more repair on it atm through Best Buy before the plan ends. The next time it fails its over. The cost of a laptop being fairly high, I plan on getting a desktop which is more reliable and giving her my current laptop.
I think I will have around 800$ Canadian to spend at most I think and already own all the peripherals (monitor at 1600x900 atm - 2 of them but plan on single use) and also own a copy of windows 7 Ultimate so I don't need an OS.
I am looking honestly, to match or exceed my current performance of my laptop which runs most games on medium with no issues and runs SC2 on low at 80+ FPS in large battles - which I assume would not be hard to emulate.
I am not in an immediate rush to purchase my computer parts and start building but am starting the planning phase. So I would love some insight on where to start. I also very importantly want to know if it is worth it to start buying the odd part if it is on sale, such as a DVD/CD drive and case if I see them on sale.
I don't think that I will be needing SLI/Crossfire or Overclocking it to be honest, but the options for the future could be nice but is not necessary. Since I mainly just play SC2 and the odd other game as it releases I don't think I need to upgrade too too often or if I will even have the money in the future to be honest.
Another option is if I do not build it by the fall, and her computer survives that long I plan to get a job at Best Buy for seasonal work in the new city I move to ( got laid off in January after five years and hoping to get job back for fall rush). Would be worth waiting for the discounts on whatever is available in Best Buy Canada or are prices better online if they go on sale?
Lots of questions, but I dont have many tech savvy friends who build PCs so I decided to come to my 2nd home here on TL <3 Best Buy is the worst place you can buy a computer from, their shit is overpriced and their selection sucks. You want to be looking at NCIX, Memory Express, Newegg, and Canada Computers if you're looking for sales. NCIX has sales every week, starting on Wednesday night and also daily deals. Newegg has daily deals. The rest of the retailers also have their sales as well. You can buy parts as they go on sale if you wish but you would need knowledge to do this and some self control to not overspend. Canadian retailers also offer pricematching. Memory Express offers a 25% price beat so if you find a shellshocker deal on Newegg, you can pricematch it with Memory Express to get it for less. For $800, you're looking at something like this. - Core i5 4670 - this comes out next week and will be $210
- H87 or B85 motherboard - releases alongside the processor, about $60 - $100
- Radeon HD7790 or GTX 650 Ti - about $130, this would be able to do ultra at 1080p but if you're not looking to purchase a new monitor anytime soon or not wishing to play on higher settings than you can get something like a Radeon HD7770 for around $110 which is still capable of playing SC2 on ultra at 1080p or drop down even further.
- 2x4GB DDR3 1600MHz - about $65, goes on sale for maybe $50-$60
- CX430 - about $40, goes on sales for $30
- any case to your liking, some suggestions are the Bitfenix Merc Alpha ($40), Fractal Design Define Arc MIDI R2 ($90, goes on sale for $70), Fractal Design Define R4 ($100, goes on sale for $80)
- Samsung 840 120gb - $100, goes on sale for $90 or 250gb for $180, goes on sale for $150
- DVD Drive - $15, goes on sale for $10
Taking the higher pricing of everything, this comes to ~$840. If you're going to need more space than you can select any appropriately sized HDD, a 1TB Western Digital Green is typically $70. Note that this configuration can't be overclocked. If you want to overclock than that requires a Z87 motherboard, a K suffix processor (eg. core i5 4670k), and an aftermarket heatsink. Which of course is going to be add to the price. If you are going to work at Best Buy than you may qualify for Intel's Retail Edge (Intel's discount program for retail employees). This summer, they have the 3770k for $60 (which retails for $330). But I guess if you're purchasing in the Fall than you won't be able to participate in this since it only happens during the Summertime and around Christmas time. NCIX also offers assembly if you are too lazy to do it but of course you need to purchase all the components from them in one purchase: http://ncix.com/products/?sku=7842 So I've been looking online and I think I've found the components at decent prices anything I should change on these items to order? Video Card: http://www.canadacomputers.com/product_info.php?cPath=43_1200_557_559&item_id=053205 (sale) CPU: http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116898Case: http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811147153 (sale) Motherboard: http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130703Power Supply: http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139026 (sale) RAM: http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233379 (sale) DVD Drive: http://www.canadacomputers.com/product_info.php?cPath=3_61&item_id=054962 (sale) HDD: http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822236339765.11 after taxes and shipping (then 745.11 after mail in rebate) Is this alright? I am really happy with the price and might be grabbing the stuff thats on sale and waiting on the regular price items for a good deal. Though If I order over 300$ on newegg, I get 30 dollars off so thats nice as well. Though the only things not on sale are the CPU/Motherboard and HDD and I dont know if they will be on sale anytime soon since they are so new. For an extra 40 dollars I can also get the 650ti Boost edition, is it worth the extra 40 dollars? But that point, whats another 20 dollars for a 660? So I guess I should be asking between the 650 (130), 650 boost (170) and the 660 (195) which is the best bang for the buck? If the 660 gives me 4 years for example but the 650 gives me 2, I would rather spend the extra 80 now and save 200 later. But if the 660 means I need a new PSU or something else that will bring the cost up more than just the GPU price, then I don't think its worth it. Newegg isn't particularly a good place to buy besides their sales since their shipping is relatively expensive and they don't offer pricematching. A GTX 650 for $130 is a huge ripoff, GTX 650 is about $100. Suffixes in computer components or anything for that matter do matter... a lot. A GTX 650 is not remotely the same in performance as a GTX 650 Ti. At this price, you should be getting a GTX 650 Ti: http://www.ncix.ca/products/?sku=78422&promoid=1322 Memory Express is sold out on this otherwise I'd tell you to get this there so you can get everything in one order. Get the memory from NCIX for $5 less: http://ncix.com/products/?sku=82158&promoid=1322 If you want to stick to Corsair, you can also find them at the same price probably at NCIX or Memory Express. Your current selection of a 4670 + B75 equates to $300 is... how do i put this? Not that great. I'd consider looking into overclocking and taking a core i5 3570k and a Gigabyte Z77X-UD3H for $340 over it: http://www.memoryexpress.com/Products/BDL_3570K_Z77XUD3H or even with the Z77-HD4 for $300: http://www.memoryexpress.com/Products/BDL_3570K_Z77HD4 Even if you don't think you're going to overclock right now, I'd still take the latter bundle over the 4670 + B75. An aftermarket heatsink is strongly recommended for overclocking, something like the Coolermaster Hyper 212 EVO, pricematch with http://www.bestdirect.ca/products/237385/COOLERMASTER/RR_212E_20PK_R2/ for $ 27.69: http://www.memoryexpress.com/Products/MX36377 You can also add this later if you're short on finances or unsure about overclocking. Pricematch the CX430 from NCIX ( http://www.ncix.com/products/?sku=76034&promoid=1322 )with Memory Express to get it for $43.74: http://www.memoryexpress.com/Products/MX41857The same for the HDD, pricematch with http://ncix.com/products/?sku=74462&promoid=1322 , for $67.49: http://www.memoryexpress.com/Products/MX40551Memory, same price: http://www.memoryexpress.com/Products/MX33234For case, I'd suggest the Fractal Design Arc Midi R2, pricematch with NCIX ( http://www.ncix.com/products/?sku=78227&promoid=1322 ) to get it for $82.49: http://www.memoryexpress.com/Products/MX44356 Of course this may bring up the total, you're free to select another case thats less expensive or suits your tastes better. Pricematch with http://www.bestdirect.ca/products/245882/SH-224BBBEBE/Samsung/ for $15.40: http://ncix.com/products/?sku=76258&promoid=1322$5 flat shipping for Memory Express as opposed to god knows how much from Newegg. And NCIX is also offering $5 shipping this week.
Hey,
Took your advice and my stuff here is in the mail! Excited to get it built and playing some games on it. Thank you for the help ^^
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On June 04 2013 07:57 -RusH wrote:
Since I'm not planning on upgrading after this purchase for awhile would it be best to stretch the budget and squeeze in an i5? I don't mind working in the HP case although it is really small. Later on down the road I'll get a new case and SSD just 'cause the WD Green is so slow. My current PC has 3 sticks of 2GB RAM, would it be possible to get a mobo that has 4 RAM slots? It's not that big of a deal though since I don't think I've ever gotten above 4GB being used.
What do you guys think? If I can't get an i5 even if by say stretching my budget up to $420 I'll pull the trigger on the i3 deal. I know I've got 'til the 6th to buy it but I want to order it tonight so that it may get here before the weekend.
Thanks for your time, appreciate it.
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On June 04 2013 11:29 -RusH wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2013 07:57 -RusH wrote:
Since I'm not planning on upgrading after this purchase for awhile would it be best to stretch the budget and squeeze in an i5? I don't mind working in the HP case although it is really small. Later on down the road I'll get a new case and SSD just 'cause the WD Green is so slow. My current PC has 3 sticks of 2GB RAM, would it be possible to get a mobo that has 4 RAM slots? It's not that big of a deal though since I don't think I've ever gotten above 4GB being used. What do you guys think? If I can't get an i5 even if by say stretching my budget up to $420 I'll pull the trigger on the i3 deal. I know I've got 'til the 6th to buy it but I want to order it tonight so that it may get here before the weekend. Thanks for your time, appreciate it.
I think there's nothing better you can get for SC2. Looking into AMD would make sense for everything else, but SC2 is sadly a bit "special" about the CPU, and Intel is the best at the moment.
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On June 04 2013 12:00 Ropid wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2013 11:29 -RusH wrote:On June 04 2013 07:57 -RusH wrote:
Since I'm not planning on upgrading after this purchase for awhile would it be best to stretch the budget and squeeze in an i5? I don't mind working in the HP case although it is really small. Later on down the road I'll get a new case and SSD just 'cause the WD Green is so slow. My current PC has 3 sticks of 2GB RAM, would it be possible to get a mobo that has 4 RAM slots? It's not that big of a deal though since I don't think I've ever gotten above 4GB being used. What do you guys think? If I can't get an i5 even if by say stretching my budget up to $420 I'll pull the trigger on the i3 deal. I know I've got 'til the 6th to buy it but I want to order it tonight so that it may get here before the weekend. Thanks for your time, appreciate it. I think there's nothing better you can get for SC2. Looking into AMD would make sense for everything else, but SC2 is sadly a bit "special" about the CPU, and Intel is the best at the moment.
No I don't want to go for an AMD. I'm going to go with the Intel i3 deal if I can't make an i5 build out of $420. Unless you meant that going for the Core i5 wouldn't matter since sc2 wont use the 2 extra cores? I guess that's understandable but I mean I'm just trying to go for the most I can since I don't plan on upgrading again anytime soon.
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Edit: Sorry tried to edit and quoted instead..
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United Kingdom20322 Posts
Hey guys i wanted to post about this, but just saw a great quote actually from asus (i think) that puts it in good words; You have to be careful with some settings on haswell (particularly voltage settings; there's manual, offset, adaptive, everyone was using adaptive to access haswells power saving and voltage scaling features)
Additionally, Haswell has a more specialized point of consideration for synthetic stress tests. When using an adaptive VID,
voltage levels will be automatically increased by the iVR when AVX instructions are detected from an application. An example is noted below:
A defined voltage of 1.245/1.250 would produce a CPU voltage of 1.245 or 1.250 under a normal realworld multi-thread application under load.
Using the same defined voltage of 1.245/1.250 but running a synthetic stress test like Prime 95 with AVX, produces a CPU load voltage of 1.370.
This increase must be considered as it could induce thermal throttle and overwhelm the cooling capabilities of the thermal solution being used.
This is both a warning, and an explanation (as mentioned before in this thread i think by someone who saw it) for temperatures and some awful results.
FYI got ahold of the package mechanical drawing for 1150....it isn't published in the specs for some reason.
News flash: the IHS sealant thickness on Haswell has much stricter tolerances than it did for Ivy, where delidding might not even be needed. The IHS is also redesigned.
This too. Haswell not looking all too bad as it seemed
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Oh yeah, so that's what adaptive looked like here:
![[image loading]](http://i39.tinypic.com/zwi68.png)
Well, desktop doesn't even get the real power saving stuff anyway. Use offset?
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United Kingdom20322 Posts
Offset or manual, a lot of people jumped on adaptive though because of many reviews
Originally Posted by CL3P20
I would stick to "offset" or "override"... at least until things get worked out with new retail samples... heard of some random deaths recently on very low OC settings and volts. Likely due to spiking from "adaptive" mode... cannot confirm yet though.
So basically, unless you are running stock settings with warranty up, don't touch adaptive =P
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On June 04 2013 12:05 -RusH wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2013 12:00 Ropid wrote:On June 04 2013 11:29 -RusH wrote:On June 04 2013 07:57 -RusH wrote:
Since I'm not planning on upgrading after this purchase for awhile would it be best to stretch the budget and squeeze in an i5? I don't mind working in the HP case although it is really small. Later on down the road I'll get a new case and SSD just 'cause the WD Green is so slow. My current PC has 3 sticks of 2GB RAM, would it be possible to get a mobo that has 4 RAM slots? It's not that big of a deal though since I don't think I've ever gotten above 4GB being used. What do you guys think? If I can't get an i5 even if by say stretching my budget up to $420 I'll pull the trigger on the i3 deal. I know I've got 'til the 6th to buy it but I want to order it tonight so that it may get here before the weekend. Thanks for your time, appreciate it. I think there's nothing better you can get for SC2. Looking into AMD would make sense for everything else, but SC2 is sadly a bit "special" about the CPU, and Intel is the best at the moment. No I don't want to go for an AMD. I'm going to go with the Intel i3 deal if I can't make an i5 build out of $420. Unless you meant that going for the Core i5 wouldn't matter since sc2 wont use the 2 extra cores? I guess that's understandable but I mean I'm just trying to go for the most I can since I don't plan on upgrading again anytime soon.
Hey guys sorry to keep going back and forth. Wondering if it's worth the $100 in going up from an i3 to an i5 in terms of performance when SC2 is the only game I'm playing. Thanks.
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On June 04 2013 23:36 -RusH wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2013 12:05 -RusH wrote:On June 04 2013 12:00 Ropid wrote:On June 04 2013 11:29 -RusH wrote:On June 04 2013 07:57 -RusH wrote:
Since I'm not planning on upgrading after this purchase for awhile would it be best to stretch the budget and squeeze in an i5? I don't mind working in the HP case although it is really small. Later on down the road I'll get a new case and SSD just 'cause the WD Green is so slow. My current PC has 3 sticks of 2GB RAM, would it be possible to get a mobo that has 4 RAM slots? It's not that big of a deal though since I don't think I've ever gotten above 4GB being used. What do you guys think? If I can't get an i5 even if by say stretching my budget up to $420 I'll pull the trigger on the i3 deal. I know I've got 'til the 6th to buy it but I want to order it tonight so that it may get here before the weekend. Thanks for your time, appreciate it. I think there's nothing better you can get for SC2. Looking into AMD would make sense for everything else, but SC2 is sadly a bit "special" about the CPU, and Intel is the best at the moment. No I don't want to go for an AMD. I'm going to go with the Intel i3 deal if I can't make an i5 build out of $420. Unless you meant that going for the Core i5 wouldn't matter since sc2 wont use the 2 extra cores? I guess that's understandable but I mean I'm just trying to go for the most I can since I don't plan on upgrading again anytime soon. Hey guys sorry to keep going back and forth. Wondering if it's worth the $100 in going up from an i3 to an i5 in terms of performance when SC2 is the only game I'm playing. Thanks.
If you leave the i5 at stock? Depends how much you value performance, there is a slight lead in the i5. Overclocked? Almost definitely worth considering, but it's more expensive again. You'd probably be happy with either to be honest.
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On June 05 2013 00:55 Rollin wrote:Show nested quote +On June 04 2013 23:36 -RusH wrote:On June 04 2013 12:05 -RusH wrote:On June 04 2013 12:00 Ropid wrote:On June 04 2013 11:29 -RusH wrote:On June 04 2013 07:57 -RusH wrote:
Since I'm not planning on upgrading after this purchase for awhile would it be best to stretch the budget and squeeze in an i5? I don't mind working in the HP case although it is really small. Later on down the road I'll get a new case and SSD just 'cause the WD Green is so slow. My current PC has 3 sticks of 2GB RAM, would it be possible to get a mobo that has 4 RAM slots? It's not that big of a deal though since I don't think I've ever gotten above 4GB being used. What do you guys think? If I can't get an i5 even if by say stretching my budget up to $420 I'll pull the trigger on the i3 deal. I know I've got 'til the 6th to buy it but I want to order it tonight so that it may get here before the weekend. Thanks for your time, appreciate it. I think there's nothing better you can get for SC2. Looking into AMD would make sense for everything else, but SC2 is sadly a bit "special" about the CPU, and Intel is the best at the moment. No I don't want to go for an AMD. I'm going to go with the Intel i3 deal if I can't make an i5 build out of $420. Unless you meant that going for the Core i5 wouldn't matter since sc2 wont use the 2 extra cores? I guess that's understandable but I mean I'm just trying to go for the most I can since I don't plan on upgrading again anytime soon. Hey guys sorry to keep going back and forth. Wondering if it's worth the $100 in going up from an i3 to an i5 in terms of performance when SC2 is the only game I'm playing. Thanks. If you leave the i5 at stock? Depends how much you value performance, there is a slight lead in the i5. Overclocked? Almost definitely worth considering, but it's more expensive again. You'd probably be happy with either to be honest.
Alright, that's cool. Since I won't be overclocking then the i3 is a better value. Thanks a lot I'll go ahead and buy now hopefully it's still in time to get shipped out today.
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EPT
