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When using this resource, please read FragKrag's opening post. The Tech Support forum regulars have helped create countless of desktop systems without any compensation. The least you can do is provide all of the information required for them to help you properly. | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20343 Posts
You would also require a 3570k (not 3570) to overclock at all. EDIT And what is wrong with the heatsink? Seems to get good reviews on Newegg from consumers It's just one that i've never heard of before. Most people use the hyper212+ for low overclocks, hr-02 macho is the go-to heatsink in europe (silly price : performance ratio, but worse cost vs other heatsinks in US) etc It looks like an awkward low profile model | ||
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zSoloo
50 Posts
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futsel
163 Posts
CPU: Intel i5 - 2500 GPU: Sapphire GTX 560ti Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-P67A-D3-B3 Memory: Samsung PC10600 2gb x 4. PSU: OCZ 550w (can't remember the exact serial. at work atm. might be this one, but I'm not sure OCZ-ZS550W-EU) Now, when I got it, I wasn't going to overclock it, simply because I was afraid to. But nowadays it seems like it ain't as dangerous as it sounds with proper guiding. So now I'm thinking of improving firstly my CPU (I start noticing how it is a little slower then I'd like to since the majority of games I play (arma, planetside) are CPU heavy.) then GPU. I plan on overclocking it too (I have a Thermaltake Big Typhoon cooler which seems ok for that purpose), hence I wanted to ask your guys' opinion on it. Should I go from my 2500 for 2500k (because I've heard it gives amazing overclocking results) or should I just go for a fancy newer one like 3770k or 3570k? And also do you think if my motherboard is still ok (seemed pretty cheap when I got it yet it looked like a really solid choice) for the time being and future upgrades? Also, what are your thoughts about GPU's? Should I upgrade for something like 660ti or should I just wait untill the 700 series hit the shelves and spend a fortune on one of those? The card should be geforce because of the fancy-shmancy PhysX in Planetside2. | ||
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MisterFred
United States2033 Posts
You should go for an i5-3570k. The motherboard will work just fine. The P67s run the new i5-3570ks excellently. You will, however, have to update your board's BIOS before changing out your CPU. Look for the updated software and instructions on the product page for your motherboard on Gigabyte's website. That heatsink should work fine as well, as long as you have a mounting bracket compatible with 1156/1155 pin motherboards. As for GPU, I dunno. I wouldn't upgrade unless you're unhappy with your current 560ti. | ||
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futsel
163 Posts
Any other opinions are more than welcome.  | ||
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Myrmidon
United States9452 Posts
Btw even with the i5-2500, you can just go into BIOS and up all the multipliers by four (the limit for the non-k processors). Very most likely, it'll still be stable like that without extra voltage. It's just like the GTX 560 Ti. I wouldn't upgrade it yet unless it was to meet some situational need. | ||
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futsel
163 Posts
The problem is I want to enjoy the highest settings without occasional dipping to below 30 fps which I sometimes get. I really doubt I need to change the GPU atm. At least not untill the 700 series start rolling in force which I am reading about right now. But the CPU...oh well, if you don't think it's worth it, I might wait. | ||
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Ropid
Germany3557 Posts
This is how I think it might work: Trying to find the default multipliers for the i5-2500, someone posted 37, 36, 35, 34 in a random forum post found by Google. Those four numbers are the multipliers that are used depending on how many of the cores are active. Windows can put unused cores to sleep, and that's when the higher numbers will get used. The 34 multiplier should be the one that's used most of the time in games, so the CPU runs at 3400 MHz in that case. You can increase the numbers by 4 steps to 41, 40, 39, 38. This will be 3800 MHz. You can then try to increase BCLK (base clock) as much as possible. Default is 100 MHz. If your PC runs stable with 105 MHz, that would get you 3990 MHz (= 38 * 105 MHz) if all four cores are in use. If you think that's overwhelming to research how to do, you actually have no choice. The i5-3570k upgrade is probably pretty disappointing by itself, so you have to look into overclocking anyways to really feel a serious difference. | ||
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vnlegend
United States1389 Posts
I just ordered an XFX HD 7850 graphics card for $185-$20 rebate. The benchmark is almost 3x better than the graphics card I have now. My CPU is pretty outdated though. I want to get an i5-3570, but do I really need one? I don't want to overclock anything. I'd like advice on: - PSU: Can the 450w rosewill/corsair PSUs that are recommended handle the cpu/gpu/hard drives for gaming at high settings? There's a corsair cx500 watts on sale right now for $30 after rebate. Corsair PSU @ Tiger Direct - CPU: the i5-3570 benchmark is double my cpu's. Will it significantly improve SC2's performance as well as other games like Total war? - Motherboard: switch to Intel will need a new motherboard. Any decent budget-minded recommendations? I don't need a full one, probably a micro-ATX. | ||
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futsel
163 Posts
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Ropid
Germany3557 Posts
On May 23 2013 11:01 zSoloo wrote: So which Mobo should i get? Look for the cheapest H77 or Z77 chipset board you can find. H77 should be cheaper as Z77 enables overclocking, but there are still very cheap Z77 that aren't actually able to overclock much so don't ignore Z77 on your search. | ||
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Ropid
Germany3557 Posts
On May 24 2013 03:24 futsel wrote: Yeah, that seems reasonable. Although I was under the impression that 2500 is not for overclocking and doing so gives really small results. Although a jump from 3400MHz to 3900 doesn't seem that little. I'll look into it. Thanks again. Don't forget to look into increasing that BCLK value. Your board might be able to go up lot while still working stable. I think Gigabyte in particular is good with that. 110 MHz would get you 39 * 110 = 4290 MHz. Though the graphics card will throw a wrench into this as those 110 MHz are also used to drive the PCI-E slot. 105 MHz could still be a realistic increase. I looked at a picture of your board, and I'd guess it has the full options for everything you might want for overclocking. If you have options relating to voltage, you can search for a guide for "Sandy Bridge overclocking" or something. To get your PC stable you'll perhaps have to increase offset voltage a tiny bit for the CPU and the DRAM voltage for the memory, and a guide might help. | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
On May 24 2013 03:22 vnlegend wrote: Hey guys. I'm trying to update my computer so I can play Starcraft 2 on higher settings and the new Rome 2 Total War that will be coming out later. I currently have AMD Athlon X4 645 3.0ghz, HD 5750 graphics card, and 12 gb ram. The problem is in SC2 multiplayer, I get lag like crazy during 3v3 battles with big armies. I'd like to be able to play at higher settings. I just ordered an XFX HD 7850 graphics card for $185-$20 rebate. The benchmark is almost 3x better than the graphics card I have now. My CPU is pretty outdated though. I want to get an i5-3570, but do I really need one? I don't want to overclock anything. I'd like advice on: - PSU: Can the 450w rosewill/corsair PSUs that are recommended handle the cpu/gpu/hard drives for gaming at high settings? There's a corsair cx500 watts on sale right now for $30 after rebate. Corsair PSU @ Tiger Direct - CPU: the i5-3570 benchmark is double my cpu's. Will it significantly improve SC2's performance as well as other games like Total war? - Motherboard: switch to Intel will need a new motherboard. Any decent budget-minded recommendations? I don't need a full one, probably a micro-ATX. Yes the Capstone 450 is more than capable of handling an Athlon X4 and a 7850. The Capstone 450 provides more power than the CX500 fyi... don't be fooled by the wattage label. Starcraft II is primarily CPU handicapped so yes an 3570 will be a decent upgrade for team games. You can just pick any B75 or H77 board for it, the lowest ones typically are $50-$60. The 7850 was sort of an unnecessary purchase as the 5750 is pretty capable of Starcraft II on ultra at 1080p. I'm not sure what benchmarks you looked at but most of them only show the average framerate which is really not all that helpful for an RTS where the late game minimum framerates matter the most. Spending the money towards a 3570k and a Z77 so that you can overclock would have been significantly better. | ||
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futsel
163 Posts
On May 24 2013 03:40 Ropid wrote: Don't forget to look into increasing that BCLK value. Your board might be able to go up lot while still working stable. I think Gigabyte in particular is good with that. 110 MHz would get you 39 * 110 = 4290 MHz. Though the graphics card will throw a wrench into this as those 110 MHz are also used to drive the PCI-E slot. 105 MHz could still be a realistic increase. I looked at a picture of your board, and I'd guess it has the full options for everything you might want for overclocking. If you have options relating to voltage, you can search for a guide for "Sandy Bridge overclocking" or something. To get your PC stable you'll perhaps have to increase offset voltage a tiny bit for the CPU and the DRAM voltage for the memory, and a guide might help. Yes, I will research into the matter. Thanks a lot for your input. That was very helpful. | ||
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Toss907
United States71 Posts
I hate Molex connectors, the case fans are all molex, and my board has the 3 or 4 pin connectors. How can i convert, besides bulking up the wires with crossovers, them to the 3 or 4 pin connector? Am i able to splice them, if so which wire is which? Or should i just buy a fan controller? | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20343 Posts
On May 24 2013 03:22 vnlegend wrote: Hey guys. I'm trying to update my computer so I can play Starcraft 2 on higher settings and the new Rome 2 Total War that will be coming out later. I currently have AMD Athlon X4 645 3.0ghz, HD 5750 graphics card, and 12 gb ram. The problem is in SC2 multiplayer, I get lag like crazy during 3v3 battles with big armies. I'd like to be able to play at higher settings. I just ordered an XFX HD 7850 graphics card for $185-$20 rebate. The benchmark is almost 3x better than the graphics card I have now. My CPU is pretty outdated though. I want to get an i5-3570, but do I really need one? I don't want to overclock anything. I'd like advice on: - PSU: Can the 450w rosewill/corsair PSUs that are recommended handle the cpu/gpu/hard drives for gaming at high settings? There's a corsair cx500 watts on sale right now for $30 after rebate. Corsair PSU @ Tiger Direct - CPU: the i5-3570 benchmark is double my cpu's. Will it significantly improve SC2's performance as well as other games like Total war? - Motherboard: switch to Intel will need a new motherboard. Any decent budget-minded recommendations? I don't need a full one, probably a micro-ATX. Yea Skyr is right to say that while GPU upgrade will probably give you higher FPS early game, it wouldnt suprise me to see if you had the same FPS in those types of battles. They will destroy any CPU on the market (due to sc2 performance being heavily reliant on 1 thread which is stuck on 1 core) but perform much better on a stronger CPU (3570k+overclock is choice buy because an easy OC can give you 40% minimum FPS boost without paying too much for extra hardware, but regular 3570 is still amazing compared to what you have now) It's nice for you to pick up such a card while also making the switch to a 3570 though, for awesome performance all around. It's not the most powerful GPU on the market (while still being mid-high range and awesome), but CPU-wise without overclocking, nothing beats the i5 3570 in many applications (such as sc2) I'm not good with motherboard recommendations sorry. On that front I'd still spend hours reading before making my own purchase (though it's MUCH more important to be picky if you need the motherboard for higher end overclocking, and not really a big deal if you are running stock settings) And if you want yet another reply, cx430 for cheap (in this case cx500 for $30 - the 430 i've seen as low as $20-25 with rebates)/capstone450w are awesome buys. It's pretty much impossible to exceed their capabilities even with high overclocks on CPU and the best single GPU you can find. | ||
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Myrmidon
United States9452 Posts
On May 24 2013 07:14 Toss907 wrote: I recently purchased the AZZA 9000 case, I have the ASUS P8Z68-Deluxe MOBO. I hate Molex connectors, the case fans are all molex, and my board has the 3 or 4 pin connectors. How can i convert, besides bulking up the wires with crossovers, them to the 3 or 4 pin connector? Am i able to splice them, if so which wire is which? Or should i just buy a fan controller? Pinout for a header is this (three-pin is just missing the fourth): http://www.allpinouts.org/index.php/Motherboard_(CPU)_4_Pin_Fan Pinout for 4-pin molex is here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molex_connector You can splice wires if you want. You just need +12V from the motherboard header to the fan's connection that corresponds to +12V and then GND from the motherboard to GND on the fan side. Sense (third pin) / tachometer would be unused. No PWM, so that's unused too. Don't overload any motherboard header. Depending on the fan specs and motherboard specs, you may or may not be able to run multiple. Generally about 1 A total (@ 12 V, so 12 W) is the limit, but sometimes it could be less. | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20343 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/1dxxg4d.png) This kind of GPU boost behavior on the stock cooler puts the 780 within 5% of the titan in many gaming benches, almost never more than 10% weaker. It destroys the high end market, but not really any specific radeon offerings because they are too cheap, just in a different performance and price class; 7970 is technically mid-high range now, not high Right now, it doesn't make sense to spend far above $400 and not go Nvidia IMO. Crossfire still has issues, the beta driver with most of the fixes will not even be released for another month or two (and finalized a while after that) so Radeon side both has nothing to compete with Nvidia's high end single cards (gk110) and far worse multi-GPU implementation (i stress again til driver fixes - + Show Spoiler + However the BIGGEST THING IMO, and i have no idea how i was not aware of this before.. a feature called Shadowplay on nvidia GPU's, to use the onboard h264 encoder (which is there for Project shield, and now aparantly this) to just save video on HDD, like a capture card. 1920x1080, 30fps (or perhaps higher) and up to 20 minute buffer from what i see on tomshardware article - so you should be able to record anything you want directly onto your HDD with the push of a button with no additional hardware load, or just hit a hotkey, and have the last 20 minutes you did saved onto hard drive, without it taking up permanant hard drive space unless you tell it to Amazing if you want to record stuff, probably easier to use if the feature is literally on the GPU, rather than using a capture card. Because of no performance hit for offline encoding that feature alone is worth $100++ for me. Even the best software solutions require a little bit of work, load the CPU to some extent (not really too relevant for a high end, high overclocked CPU running starcraft 2, trying to take a 1920x1080 30fps local record, but will kill you in many cases) and introduce lag somewhere in frame delivery/interaction that makes the game feel very different and at times impossible to play on for some people Not just the video capture without performance hit is the important thing, but h264 encode - even if it's half as efficient as a CPU encode (i think avermedia live gamer hd cards had bad efficiency making it weird for streaming with their onboard encoding) then you are talking something in the range of 0.5-3% of lossless data for a good quality video - you can run the thing for hundreds of hours on a big HDD, instead of filling a terabyte HDD in a couple of hours. Something like 4gb/hour is awesome. Gigabyte expects their GTX 780 WindForce to retail at the NVIDIA MSRP of $649. Well well.. this changes things a bit Abusing good cooling, higher base clocks etc to beat titan http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Gigabyte/GeForce_GTX_780_OC/31.html | ||
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mav451
United States1596 Posts
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Cyro
United Kingdom20343 Posts
With the same cooler on the titan and 780 and GPU boost doing it's work, 780 clocks up it's fewer cores to come really close to the titan (it targets a set temperature) but titan maintains 3-10% performance lead due to loss of efficiency when driving fewer cores to higher oc frequencies or something like that; gigabyte slapping better cooler on 780 raises headroom for OC and GPU boost, so titan can't actually overcome it using the reference cooler, with my very basic and quick understanding. | ||
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