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How about this:
You build units the same way as before, except when they finish, they get queued into all connected pylons and phase prisms. That way, to deploy them, you click on pylons or phase prisms anywhere on the map and warp them onto the battlefield. Evidence of this is the numbers next to units in the screenshots that were posted... that could be the units allowed to be teleported at that particular phase prism/pylon. There may be an option to queue the units to automatically warp to a certain location on the map, given that it is in range. There may be restrictions on this, such as only being able to warp units across pylon or phase prism influence... meaning you have to connect the range of the pylons and phase prisms in order to teleport your units to a certain location. This would inspire some really cool strategies, like building a chain of pylons to an opponent's base for quick deployment or heavily using phase prisms.
Maybe it will only work with phase prisms, and pylons solely provide power. However, I find this unlikely, since phase prisms also act as transport units, and since if pylons were unable to deploy your units, you would need phase prisms right off the bat... meaning protoss would have air transport immediately. I guess it is possible, though, that the phase prism is just an added technology that isn't required at the beginning of the game... meaning that you are still allowed to deploy units directly out of buildings, like the gateway... teleporting them may just be an option once you have phase prisms.
I'm going to guess that phase prisms and pylons both act to deploy units, though. Seems cool and logical.
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On May 22 2007 02:21 AcrossFiveJulys wrote:
How about this:
You build units the same way as before, except when they finish, they get queued into a universal queue inside pylons and phase prisms. That way, to deploy them, you click on pylons or phase prisms anywhere on the map and warp them onto the battlefield. There may be an option to queue the units to automatically warp to a certain location on the map, given that it is in range. There may be restrictions on this, such as only being able to warp units across pylon or phase prism influence... meaning you have to connect the range of the pylons and phase prisms in order to teleport your units to a certain location. This would inspire some really cool strategies, like building a chain of pylons to an opponent's base for quick deployment or heavily using phase prisms.
Maybe it will only work with phase prisms, and pylons solely provide power. However, I find this unlikely, since phase prisms also act as transport units, and since if pylons were unable to deploy your units, you would need phase prisms right off the bat... meaning protoss would have air transport immediately.
So the only logical conclusion I'm coming up with here is that phase prisms and pylons both act to deploy units.
You could just read at www.starcraft2.com where they say that the phase prism when deployed is EXACTLY like a pylon and that warp gates deploy units anywhere within the psionic power grid
You can also watch the replay and see that the unit cost is subtracted when the unit is warped in, if it was already build it wouldn't cost to warp it in 
They could always change the mechanic but it seems pretty cool as it is.
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On May 22 2007 02:08 -DaJ- wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2007 01:23 mahnini wrote:Taken from: http://teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=53602On May 21 2007 23:43 nagash wrote:
I'm pretty sure that this entire post is pointless, because PRODUCTION ISN'T BEING DONE THE SAME WAY.
EDIT: Someone make a new thread with this info. It's important. I can't make new posts for 8 more days.
Check this:
A single Gateway/Warp Gate is constantly producing a single generic unit (I'm assuming only 1).
When that single unit is ready, it is your job to select which type of unit you want it to be and to bring it onto the battlefield INSTANTLY (and paying for it). After you do this, the Gateway/Warp Gate starts producing another one *automatically*.
So, in effect, this will make it even more important to multitask. Since you cant just select your Gateway and spam 5 zealots because there is only 1 available, you will have to make sure you are releasing your units all the time as they are available otherwise you will fall behind.
So basically this makes everyones whinging about being able to select and build from multiple production buildings pointless.
Here's the proof:
For proof - check the video.
~ 5:20 when he warps the Stalkers in from a Warp Gate
There are 4 Warp Gates selected, and each mini icon on the right of the HUD shows there being 4 units available. That is, you can select to create 4 zealots, 4 stalkers, 4 immortals or any combination of the above INSTANTLY (if you have the resources). Once the available numbers reach 0 you can clearly see the cooldown/build timer on the icons!
Btw, a Stalker costs 125 minerals and 50 gas atm. (You can work it out when he warps the first one in, by the resources lost)
Same thing at ~7:10 when he warps the Zealots in from a Warp Gate So basically, if this info is correct gateways are essentially always building the only thing is that certain units have to wait longer before they can be built, such as 10 secs before a zealot is available to build, 15 secs before an Immortal is available to build, etc. and I assume that once it reaches the maximum build time any unit is available to be built and acts like a queued unit without the wasted money. Can anyone confirm this? All credit goes to nagash, I'm just making the thread since he cannot yet. Edit: Shoot mod please move to SC2 forum. T.T ok lets assume the cool down for immortals is really 15 and the cooldown for besis is 10. what happens to the cooldown (of the besis) if you build 4 besis? does it start off fresh? or does it start off with 5 because you already built up these additional 5 seconds waiting for the immortal to load...?
Hmm, I would assume it wouldn't carry over taking a hell of a lot more skill to be able to macro properly, but then again, at this point all we have are guesses. We don't even know if it's actually implemented yet.
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On May 22 2007 02:25 mahnini wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2007 02:08 -DaJ- wrote:On May 22 2007 01:23 mahnini wrote:Taken from: http://teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=53602On May 21 2007 23:43 nagash wrote:
I'm pretty sure that this entire post is pointless, because PRODUCTION ISN'T BEING DONE THE SAME WAY.
EDIT: Someone make a new thread with this info. It's important. I can't make new posts for 8 more days.
Check this:
A single Gateway/Warp Gate is constantly producing a single generic unit (I'm assuming only 1).
When that single unit is ready, it is your job to select which type of unit you want it to be and to bring it onto the battlefield INSTANTLY (and paying for it). After you do this, the Gateway/Warp Gate starts producing another one *automatically*.
So, in effect, this will make it even more important to multitask. Since you cant just select your Gateway and spam 5 zealots because there is only 1 available, you will have to make sure you are releasing your units all the time as they are available otherwise you will fall behind.
So basically this makes everyones whinging about being able to select and build from multiple production buildings pointless.
Here's the proof:
For proof - check the video.
~ 5:20 when he warps the Stalkers in from a Warp Gate
There are 4 Warp Gates selected, and each mini icon on the right of the HUD shows there being 4 units available. That is, you can select to create 4 zealots, 4 stalkers, 4 immortals or any combination of the above INSTANTLY (if you have the resources). Once the available numbers reach 0 you can clearly see the cooldown/build timer on the icons!
Btw, a Stalker costs 125 minerals and 50 gas atm. (You can work it out when he warps the first one in, by the resources lost)
Same thing at ~7:10 when he warps the Zealots in from a Warp Gate So basically, if this info is correct gateways are essentially always building the only thing is that certain units have to wait longer before they can be built, such as 10 secs before a zealot is available to build, 15 secs before an Immortal is available to build, etc. and I assume that once it reaches the maximum build time any unit is available to be built and acts like a queued unit without the wasted money. Can anyone confirm this? All credit goes to nagash, I'm just making the thread since he cannot yet. Edit: Shoot mod please move to SC2 forum. T.T ok lets assume the cool down for immortals is really 15 and the cooldown for besis is 10. what happens to the cooldown (of the besis) if you build 4 besis? does it start off fresh? or does it start off with 5 because you already built up these additional 5 seconds waiting for the immortal to load...? Hmm, I would assume it wouldn't carry over taking a hell of a lot more skill to be able to macro properly, but then again, at this point all we have are guesses. We don't even know if it's actually implemented yet.
It is obviously implemented since we see it in the video, the question is though how much they will tweak the mechanic. Warcraft 3 changed a fair bit during beta and by a huuge amount during the alpha stages. Didn't it start as a pure rpg?
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On May 22 2007 02:25 mahnini wrote:
Hmm, I would assume it wouldn't carry over taking a hell of a lot more skill to be able to macro properly, but then again, at this point all we have are guesses. We don't even know if it's actually implemented yet.
It's obviously implemented from my analysis and the video itself. The only thing we don't know is the details.
Does it work like this for Gateways as well?
Can it only do 1 unit at a time (which imo would be best and is what it seems at the moment) or if you build your gateway and come back 20 mins later you have 3000 units waiting for you to put out?
Are the cooldowns/build times different or the same for each unit?
These are the things we don't know...
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Hmm, maybe there's a cooldown affect instead of a generic unit automatically building, like your unit builds instantly but afterwards you have to wait a certain amount of time before being able to build another unit, something like a reverse building time effect.
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Son a bitch, I totally missed that little explanation on Blizzard's website about the warp gate. I didn't realize there was such a thing. I'm going to rewatch the gameplay video again and make another attempt at a theory. Thanks for pointing that out.
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On May 22 2007 02:30 mahnini wrote:
Hmm, maybe there's a cooldown affect instead of a generic unit automatically building, like your unit builds instantly but afterwards you have to wait a certain amount of time before being able to build another unit, something like a reverse building time effect.
Yes that is how it appears to be working. My initial posting didn't take this into account, I was just so excited about finding this 
We don't know if the cooldowns for each unit are different or what though.
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if you haven't upgraded your gateway to a warp gate, how do you deploy your first zealot? Would it really be built instantly in front of your gateway?
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I think you would deploy it the same way only that you're limited to the general area around the gateway. Just a guess though.
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On May 22 2007 02:39 AcrossFiveJulys wrote:
if you haven't upgraded your gateway to a warp gate, how do you deploy your first zealot? Would it really be built instantly in front of your gateway?
Assuming that, yes. Or on the completion of the Gateway, it triggers the cooldown. We really have no idea if Gateways production is even the same as Warp Gate, so your guess is as good as anyones.
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ok... i think i can disappoint everybody... but.. remeber that in demo they said that they cheated mana and shields?.. i think they also cheated time production... so when u select warpgate and select "rally point" it will took time in real game before he actually appear on the battlefield
and i'm like 99.99% sure that is how it's done...
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On May 22 2007 02:46 lamarine wrote:
ok... i think i can disappoint everybody... but.. remeber that in demo they said that they cheated mana and shields?.. i think they also cheated time production... so when u select warpgate and select "rally point" it will took time in real game before he actually appear on the battlefield
and i'm like 99.99% sure that is how it's done...
No, because you can see it trigger the cooldown after they warp in the units.
Particularly you can see the cooldown thingy going around the icons after they warp in the 16 zealots. It may very well be sped up - but it's still noticeable. Goes about half way in 5 seconds or something.
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On May 22 2007 02:46 lamarine wrote:
ok... i think i can disappoint everybody... but.. remeber that in demo they said that they cheated mana and shields?.. i think they also cheated time production... so when u select warpgate and select "rally point" it will took time in real game before he actually appear on the battlefield
and i'm like 99.99% sure that is how it's done...
I don't think it will take time since they've mentioned on their website that the idea is that protoss can sneak in with a Phase Prism somewhere and suddenly create a massive army out of nowhere. If it took a long time for the army to get build it would be fairly pointless ^^
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i have to watch gameplay movie one more time
PS it's hard to argue when i'm at work and can't even watch it here:D
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MURICA15980 Posts
Really? 5 seconds is fast... maybe it speeds up as you get more gateways ;o
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On May 22 2007 02:49 nagash wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2007 02:46 lamarine wrote:
ok... i think i can disappoint everybody... but.. remeber that in demo they said that they cheated mana and shields?.. i think they also cheated time production... so when u select warpgate and select "rally point" it will took time in real game before he actually appear on the battlefield
and i'm like 99.99% sure that is how it's done... No, because you can see it trigger the cooldown after they warp in the units. Particularly you can see the cooldown thingy going around the icons after they warp in the 16 zealots. It may very well be sped up - but it's still noticeable. Goes about half way in 5 seconds or something.
Yeah, it has the clockwise color effect like with the Blink icon, except it shows on unit icons. Looks like Stalkers and Immortals have the same build time while zealots are about 1/4 faster.
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You know, there is really no reason why Terran production can't be exactly the same, working on cool downs rather then build times (except obviously no warping anywhere).
Pure speculation though of course. Who knows about Zerg. Will they even still have larvae?
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On May 22 2007 02:33 nagash wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2007 02:30 mahnini wrote:
Hmm, maybe there's a cooldown affect instead of a generic unit automatically building, like your unit builds instantly but afterwards you have to wait a certain amount of time before being able to build another unit, something like a reverse building time effect. Yes that is how it appears to be working. My initial posting didn't take this into account, I was just so excited about finding this We don't know if the cooldowns for each unit are different or what though.
No, now I think your initial idea was correct, haha. The only difference is it works like a spell but for every unit you make the gateway you made it out of resets the cooldown for every type of unit. Hmm, but then why would they need separate numbers per icon?
Edit: To make the idea more clear, the cooldown is for potentially units that you will be building, not for units that you have already built like my reverse build time idea.
Ex: Build zealot instantly, wait zealot build time, build any other unit instantly
Ex2: Wait for unit zealot build time, build zealot, wait for next desired unit build time to be reached, build unit, etc.
I think Ex2 is the way it will work.
This makes me think there are no queues at all because that would make Toss extremely imba, think about suiciding your 200/200 army but being able to build x4 that instantly. O.O
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On May 22 2007 03:01 nagash wrote:
You know, there is really no reason why Terran production can't be exactly the same, working on cool downs rather then build times (except obviously no warping anywhere).
Pure speculation though of course. Who knows about Zerg. Will they even still have larvae?
I think the Terrans will keep their old way to build units while Zerg keep their Larvae.
This way the factions will have completly different ways to produce units :=). Alternatively they might have thought out some utterly awesome way for Terrans and Zerg to produce units and still be different from Protoss.
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EPT
