• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 02:26
CEST 08:26
KST 15:26
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Finals Preview: Sweet Victory!9[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5
Community News
Evil Geniuses - shutting down10ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier5Weekly Cups (October 12-18): 5.0.17 era begins1[$1250] International ShieldBattery League53Weekly Cups (October 5-11): Farewell to 5.0.165
StarCraft 2
General
Weekly Cups (October 5-11): Farewell to 5.0.16 REPORT: StarCraft 2: Remastered In Development No more SC2 streamers on team liquid? Evil Geniuses - shutting down How do you feel about the mass reverts in the 5.0.17 PTR?
Tourneys
RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22 ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament ScienceCraft (October 24-25) - Live Event WORTEX Challenger Series — Open SC2 LAN in Budapes
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[G] How to playtest arcade maps [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Sweltering Sands [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 548 Shining Bright The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 547 Temple Of Terror Mutation # 546 Catch the Train
Brood War
General
Do we even care about balance? [Megathread] Daily Funny Videos Rollback Netcode in Brood War BW General Discussion Young Players Tournament Announced by SOOP
Tourneys
[ASL22] Grand Finals [$1250] International ShieldBattery League [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL23] RO24 Group Stage
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Simple Questions, Simple Answers Replay Review Process - What do you do?
Other Games
General Games
General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Armies of Exigo - YesYes? Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25!
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Artificial Intelligence Thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Chess Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
How Much Genes Contribute to…
TrAiDoS
ShieldBattery on Mac
Kraekkling
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 7356 users

StarCraft II Multiplayer - Major Design Changes - Page 13

Forum Index > SC2 General
832 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 11 12 13 14 15 42 Next All
Musicus
Profile Joined August 2011
Germany23580 Posts
August 18 2017 12:01 GMT
#241
On August 18 2017 09:58 seemsgood wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 18 2017 09:04 Snakestyle1 wrote:
Interesting changes other than one part.

ZvZ will be absolute hell now. Stronger /more agile lurkers, fungal doesnt hit air...

Mass muta will be way too strong in zvz... Lurker spore turtle late game as well.

For these changes to be reasonable for zvz i would propose the following changes.


Buff spores anti bio back to hots values.

Give broodlords frenzy so they cant be abducted into spores/hydras. Making them a good answer to spore/lurker turtle.



Carrier change is too little to have any impact.

You forgot fucking 180 dmg parasitic bomb!

But it no longer stacks right?

While a single para bomb is better now, mass vipers vs mass air in the late game is worse.

Anyway , looking forward to playing this weekend!
Maru and Serral are probably top 5.
reneg
Profile Joined September 2010
United States859 Posts
August 18 2017 12:17 GMT
#242
On August 18 2017 21:01 Musicus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 18 2017 09:58 seemsgood wrote:
On August 18 2017 09:04 Snakestyle1 wrote:
Interesting changes other than one part.

ZvZ will be absolute hell now. Stronger /more agile lurkers, fungal doesnt hit air...

Mass muta will be way too strong in zvz... Lurker spore turtle late game as well.

For these changes to be reasonable for zvz i would propose the following changes.


Buff spores anti bio back to hots values.

Give broodlords frenzy so they cant be abducted into spores/hydras. Making them a good answer to spore/lurker turtle.



Carrier change is too little to have any impact.

You forgot fucking 180 dmg parasitic bomb!

But it no longer stacks right?

While a single para bomb is better now, mass vipers vs mass air in the late game is worse.

Anyway , looking forward to playing this weekend!


True, it does do 180 now, so it's basically like 2 of the old ones...so that's a pretty solid .

So one thing I'm a little confused about: if the Lurker Den is its own building now, does it just require the Hydra den before being built? And if so, I'm assuming that lurkers still evolve from Hydras?

The thing that makes me sad about that change, is that it removes the clear evolve relationship from the game.

Hydra den --> Lurker den, just like Hydra --> lurker. Now it's just multiple buildings that aren't related. It dissociates the units, and makes it harder to be understood by someone who is new.
moose...indian
Maniack
Profile Joined October 2012
South Africa2 Posts
August 18 2017 12:47 GMT
#243
Excitement has been stirred. Looking forward to trying these after not playing much the last year or so
FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Profile Blog Joined March 2013
Netherlands30548 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-08-18 12:51:48
August 18 2017 12:48 GMT
#244
oops
Neosteel Enthusiast
FueledUpAndReadyToGo
Profile Blog Joined March 2013
Netherlands30548 Posts
August 18 2017 12:48 GMT
#245
On August 18 2017 21:17 reneg wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 18 2017 21:01 Musicus wrote:
On August 18 2017 09:58 seemsgood wrote:
On August 18 2017 09:04 Snakestyle1 wrote:
Interesting changes other than one part.

ZvZ will be absolute hell now. Stronger /more agile lurkers, fungal doesnt hit air...

Mass muta will be way too strong in zvz... Lurker spore turtle late game as well.

For these changes to be reasonable for zvz i would propose the following changes.


Buff spores anti bio back to hots values.

Give broodlords frenzy so they cant be abducted into spores/hydras. Making them a good answer to spore/lurker turtle.



Carrier change is too little to have any impact.

You forgot fucking 180 dmg parasitic bomb!

But it no longer stacks right?

While a single para bomb is better now, mass vipers vs mass air in the late game is worse.

Anyway , looking forward to playing this weekend!


True, it does do 180 now, so it's basically like 2 of the old ones...so that's a pretty solid .

So one thing I'm a little confused about: if the Lurker Den is its own building now, does it just require the Hydra den before being built? And if so, I'm assuming that lurkers still evolve from Hydras?

The thing that makes me sad about that change, is that it removes the clear evolve relationship from the game.

Hydra den --> Lurker den, just like Hydra --> lurker. Now it's just multiple buildings that aren't related. It dissociates the units, and makes it harder to be understood by someone who is new.

You need to build a baneling nest to morph lings into banes. Nobody has trouble understanding that so I don't see why building a seperate lurker den to morph hydralisks into lurkers would confuse anybody.
Neosteel Enthusiast
Elentos
Profile Blog Joined February 2015
55594 Posts
August 18 2017 12:51 GMT
#246
So I played a game against Viper on the test map where he went lurkers and had +2 ranged attack. And what happened was that the ranged upgrades stacked and a +2 attack hydra got morphed into a +4 attack lurker (28 damage, 42 vs armored). That can't possibly be intentional.
Every 60 seconds in Africa, a minute passes.
MorDka
Profile Joined October 2012
Poland543 Posts
August 18 2017 12:55 GMT
#247
Does the raven ability cancels the warp in if you cast it on a warp prism?
AssyrianKing
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
Australia2133 Posts
August 18 2017 13:04 GMT
#248
MSC IS GOOOONE ! THROW THAT BITCH ON THE BIN AND SHIP IT OFF TO ISIS AND BLOW IT UP !



User was warned for this post
John 15:13
reneg
Profile Joined September 2010
United States859 Posts
August 18 2017 13:07 GMT
#249
On August 18 2017 21:48 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 18 2017 21:17 reneg wrote:
On August 18 2017 21:01 Musicus wrote:
On August 18 2017 09:58 seemsgood wrote:
On August 18 2017 09:04 Snakestyle1 wrote:
Interesting changes other than one part.

ZvZ will be absolute hell now. Stronger /more agile lurkers, fungal doesnt hit air...

Mass muta will be way too strong in zvz... Lurker spore turtle late game as well.

For these changes to be reasonable for zvz i would propose the following changes.


Buff spores anti bio back to hots values.

Give broodlords frenzy so they cant be abducted into spores/hydras. Making them a good answer to spore/lurker turtle.



Carrier change is too little to have any impact.

You forgot fucking 180 dmg parasitic bomb!

But it no longer stacks right?

While a single para bomb is better now, mass vipers vs mass air in the late game is worse.

Anyway , looking forward to playing this weekend!


True, it does do 180 now, so it's basically like 2 of the old ones...so that's a pretty solid .

So one thing I'm a little confused about: if the Lurker Den is its own building now, does it just require the Hydra den before being built? And if so, I'm assuming that lurkers still evolve from Hydras?

The thing that makes me sad about that change, is that it removes the clear evolve relationship from the game.

Hydra den --> Lurker den, just like Hydra --> lurker. Now it's just multiple buildings that aren't related. It dissociates the units, and makes it harder to be understood by someone who is new.

You need to build a baneling nest to morph lings into banes. Nobody has trouble understanding that so I don't see why building a seperate lurker den to morph hydralisks into lurkers would confuse anybody.



Good point, I'm dumb.
moose...indian
Elentos
Profile Blog Joined February 2015
55594 Posts
August 18 2017 13:07 GMT
#250
On August 18 2017 22:04 AssyrianKing wrote:
MSC IS GOOOONE ! THROW THAT BITCH ON THE BIN AND SHIP IT OFF TO ISIS AND BLOW IT UP !


Dude what the fuck?
Every 60 seconds in Africa, a minute passes.
The_Red_Viper
Profile Blog Joined August 2013
19533 Posts
August 18 2017 13:12 GMT
#251
On August 18 2017 21:51 Elentos wrote:
So I played a game against Viper on the test map where he went lurkers and had +2 ranged attack. And what happened was that the ranged upgrades stacked and a +2 attack hydra got morphed into a +4 attack lurker (28 damage, 42 vs armored). That can't possibly be intentional.

I think it's fine
IU | Sohyang || There is no God and we are his prophets | For if ‘Thou mayest’—it is also true that ‘Thou mayest not.” | Ignorance is the parent of fear |
Jimmon
Profile Joined May 2011
United States112 Posts
August 18 2017 13:25 GMT
#252
They need to bring Khaydarin Amulet back if ghosts have freaking upgrades that bring back more energy? What the hell is Protoss left with no tech like that? That's absolutely absurd.
I love LOveRH
seemsgood
Profile Joined January 2016
5527 Posts
August 18 2017 13:27 GMT
#253
Tried some games today. HIP mode on thor is still unreliable against golden' fleet even with new raven.
But 15 mineral interceptor is reasonable enough to choose splash mode and it works great with repar drone spam.I smell a weird ass version of broodwar in the test map.
Mun_Su
Profile Joined December 2012
France2063 Posts
August 18 2017 13:31 GMT
#254
I have the feeling that all of this will benefits protoss
INno <3 - TY - Maru - Taeja - Rain <3 - Classic <3 - Stephano <3 - soO <3 - Soulkey - Dark - SERRAL =O / END REGION LOCK
WhosQuany
Profile Joined June 2013
Germany257 Posts
August 18 2017 13:34 GMT
#255
On August 18 2017 02:15 Pandemona wrote:
Can't wait to see my MULE's farming all that Vespene Gas :D

yeah this seems to be the biggest change for me and MSC rip
Goin back to Cali
mishimaBeef
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Canada2259 Posts
August 18 2017 14:04 GMT
#256
hype hype hype hype hype
Dare to live the life you have dreamed for yourself. Go forward and make your dreams come true. - Ralph Waldo Emerson
PinoKotsBeer
Profile Joined February 2014
Netherlands1387 Posts
August 18 2017 14:08 GMT
#257
proxy oracle, 2:55 in the base of the enemy....
http://www.twitch.tv/pinokotsbeer
HerrPfotig
Profile Joined July 2012
Germany39 Posts
August 18 2017 14:09 GMT
#258
chrono only usable in range 10 around nexus?
c0sm0naut
Profile Joined April 2011
United States1229 Posts
August 18 2017 14:15 GMT
#259
these changes are just so questionable
Thezzy
Profile Joined October 2010
Netherlands2117 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-08-18 14:36:24
August 18 2017 14:35 GMT
#260
On August 18 2017 22:25 Jimmon wrote:
They need to bring Khaydarin Amulet back if ghosts have freaking upgrades that bring back more energy? What the hell is Protoss left with no tech like that? That's absolutely absurd.


Please no. God no. Warp-in storms cannot make a comeback.
I'd agree only if HT that warp-in get a cooldown on Psionic Storm.

Otherwise...imagine Terran being able to drop-pod Ghosts with 75 energy freely and the EMP doesn't only damage shields.
It'd be like that. Which is bad.

Also Ghosts, started with 75 energy for years now. They would now need an upgrade as it was in WoL.
Given that their AoE cannot kill and they can't warp in, 75 energy Ghosts are not a problem.
Playing Terran is like flying down a MULE drop in a marine suit, firing a Gauss Rifle
Prev 1 11 12 13 14 15 42 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 4h 35m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
WinterStarcraft579
Nina 105
StarCraft: Brood War
Rain 2847
GuemChi 1393
Horang2 648
ProTech151
Dewaltoss 97
Noble 29
NotJumperer 2
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm231
League of Legends
JimRising 632
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox835
Heroes of the Storm
Trikslyr39
Other Games
summit1g7840
Coldzera 745
PiGStarcraft231
Livibee148
Sick112
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick489
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• practicex 23
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota2409
League of Legends
• Rush1533
• Lourlo1160
• Scarra1152
• Stunt494
Other Games
• Shiphtur659
Upcoming Events
IntoTheTV X SOOP
4h 35m
Reynor vs Zoun
Neeb vs Rogue
OSC
16h 35m
FEL
2 days
Patches Events
2 days
AI Arena Tournament
2 days
FEL
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
WardiTV Weekly
4 days
IntoTheTV X SOOP
5 days
ByuN vs Lambo
MaxPax vs Bunny
[ Show More ]
PiGosaur Cup
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
Kung Fu Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-10-20
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HCC Season 3

Ongoing

Acropolis #5
IPSL Winter 2026-27
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
Acropolis #5 - GSC
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026

Upcoming

BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.