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United States23455 Posts
On December 10 2016 02:38 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:
Great to see another year of WCS, I was a bit worried. Prizepool looks healthy enough.
For all the stupid conspiracy blizzard haters:
Korea got fucked.
I know it probably took a lot of hard work to get this done and I appreciate that Incontrol highlights that and I'm happy there will be a WCS in 2017, but I'm still gonna call a spade a spade. Korea got fucked.
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incontrol doesn't care one bit about Korea
he's just happy he gets another year of work, just like Apollo before 2016
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United States23455 Posts
Btw I'm looking forward to sometime mid 2017/early 2018 DH and other "region locked events" creating an exchange program identical to the MLG one with Korea in 2011 and the cycle repeating lel
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On December 10 2016 08:22 Darkhorse wrote:Korea got fucked. I know it probably took a lot of hard work to get this done and I appreciate that Incontrol highlights that and I'm happy there will be a WCS in 2017, but I'm still gonna call a spade a spade. Korea got fucked.
In what way did Korea get fucked?
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United States23455 Posts
On December 10 2016 08:33 Ansibled wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2016 08:22 Darkhorse wrote:Korea got fucked. I know it probably took a lot of hard work to get this done and I appreciate that Incontrol highlights that and I'm happy there will be a WCS in 2017, but I'm still gonna call a spade a spade. Korea got fucked. In what way did Korea get fucked?
Pro league is gone. S2SL is gone. Nothing done to offset this (ie allowing Koreans to enter DH, other weekend events again) so yay for oversaturation in GSL with far fewer established teams to pay players
But like I said in my original post in this thread, it's better than I expected
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On December 10 2016 08:37 Darkhorse wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2016 08:33 Ansibled wrote:On December 10 2016 08:22 Darkhorse wrote:Korea got fucked. I know it probably took a lot of hard work to get this done and I appreciate that Incontrol highlights that and I'm happy there will be a WCS in 2017, but I'm still gonna call a spade a spade. Korea got fucked. In what way did Korea get fucked? Pro league is gone. S2SL is gone. Nothing done to offset this (ie allowing Koreans to enter DH, other weekend events again) so yay for oversaturation in GSL with far fewer established teams to pay players
And by nothing done to offset this what you actually mean is
3 GSLs instead of 2, super tournaments, and money shifted from the foreign scene into global events (which Korea will take.)
I mean is the only way Korea doesn't get fucked to you if Blizzard comes out and funds 6 teams and a teamleague? You have pretty unrealistic expectations. Yes, without proleague and KeSPA teams the Korean scene is in a worse state than last year but in no way did it get fucked by WCS.
And of course this goes without mentioning the countless number of online tournaments we have.
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Yeah, Korea got fucked... with 6 tournaments and more than 600k in prize pools. I don't know what do you expect...
Right now I'm looking at the Dota 2 tournaments. Guess how many tournaments Valve held in China this year - "to support the chinese scene"... 1 and it was open for the entire world. Everything else is independent initiative. Where is the independent initiative in Korean SC2 ? They need smaller local tournaments created(AND FUNDED) by korean organisations. Or even bigger tournaments like WESG sponsored by huge corporations.
I'm happy with WCS... And at least 2 more years of great SC2 action.
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I agree with Nony. This is good news. With all the recent negativity, I was expecting SO much worse. Now we know what the scene will be like for a year. I am looking foward to it
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On December 10 2016 08:24 sharkie wrote:
incontrol doesn't care one bit about Korea
he's just happy he gets another year of work, just like Apollo before 2016
I don't care either apparently, look at me not bitching about both scenes having a guaranteed stable system for next two years.
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United States23455 Posts
On December 10 2016 08:41 Ansibled wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2016 08:37 Darkhorse wrote:On December 10 2016 08:33 Ansibled wrote:On December 10 2016 08:22 Darkhorse wrote:Korea got fucked. I know it probably took a lot of hard work to get this done and I appreciate that Incontrol highlights that and I'm happy there will be a WCS in 2017, but I'm still gonna call a spade a spade. Korea got fucked. In what way did Korea get fucked? Pro league is gone. S2SL is gone. Nothing done to offset this (ie allowing Koreans to enter DH, other weekend events again) so yay for oversaturation in GSL with far fewer established teams to pay players And by nothing done to offset this what you actually mean is 3 GSLs instead of 2, super tournaments, and money shifted from the foreign scene into global events (which Korea will take.) I mean is the only way Korea doesn't get fucked to you if Blizzard comes out and funds 6 teams and a teamleague? You have pretty unrealistic expectations. And of course this goes without mentioning the countless number of online tournaments we have.
Super tournaments replace Kespa cup, something Korea lost that I didn't mention in my previous post (because I knew super tournaments offset them) also the IEM WC in Katowice has always been global unless I'm mistaken so it's not like Korea was "given something" there although I'll concede that the prize pool is higher this year.
I'll concede that Blizzard shouldn't be expected to save PL on their own but Stork's recent interview seems to suggest they didn't even really try. That's most of my disappointment with Blizzard atm. Also I've never been a fan of splitting the global finals 50/50 (biggest prize pool of the year) when given an even playing field Koreans could easily qualify for more of those spots. But that last bit is all preference and I understand if you disagree
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Great overall, maybe somethings could be better but it's in our natura to bitch and hope for more!
Anyways GSL still on, Koreans will still get something and the foreign scene will also get some more action!
Like incontrol said it's been 7 years and it will probably go for two more, thank you.
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About as good as i could have hoped for for the Korean scene. I'm happy with it .
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On December 10 2016 08:52 Darkhorse wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2016 08:41 Ansibled wrote:On December 10 2016 08:37 Darkhorse wrote:On December 10 2016 08:33 Ansibled wrote:On December 10 2016 08:22 Darkhorse wrote:Korea got fucked. I know it probably took a lot of hard work to get this done and I appreciate that Incontrol highlights that and I'm happy there will be a WCS in 2017, but I'm still gonna call a spade a spade. Korea got fucked. In what way did Korea get fucked? Pro league is gone. S2SL is gone. Nothing done to offset this (ie allowing Koreans to enter DH, other weekend events again) so yay for oversaturation in GSL with far fewer established teams to pay players And by nothing done to offset this what you actually mean is 3 GSLs instead of 2, super tournaments, and money shifted from the foreign scene into global events (which Korea will take.) I mean is the only way Korea doesn't get fucked to you if Blizzard comes out and funds 6 teams and a teamleague? You have pretty unrealistic expectations. And of course this goes without mentioning the countless number of online tournaments we have. Super tournaments replace Kespa cup, something Korea lost that I didn't mention in my previous post (because I knew super tournaments offset them) also the IEM WC in Katowice has always been global unless I'm mistaken so it's not like Korea was "given something" there although I'll concede that the prize pool is higher this year. I'll concede that Blizzard shouldn't be expected to save PL on their own but Stork's recent interview seems to suggest they didn't even really try. That's most of my disappointment with Blizzard atm. Also I've never been a fan of splitting the global finals 50/50 (biggest prize pool of the year) when given an even playing field Koreans could easily qualify for more of those spots. But that last bit is all preference and I understand if you disagree
Well there was 1 KeSPA cup and it was a global event not a WCS Korea event, so that's not strictly true. IEM Katowice last season was a WCS Circuit event.
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2016_WCS_Winter_Circuit_Championship
I understand people not liking the way WCS final spots are allocated but I personally have no issues with it, and it's fairer than we see in most other games.
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It could be far worse and what we are about to have is probably reliant on Blizzard bleeding cash.
I'm fine with this system, it's the best bad system we can get
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United States23455 Posts
On December 10 2016 08:41 Pr0wler wrote:
Yeah, Korea got fucked... with 6 tournaments and more than 600k in prize pools. I don't know what do you expect...
Right now I'm looking at the Dota 2 tournaments. Guess how many tournaments Valve held in China this year - "to support the chinese scene"... 1 and it was open for the entire world. Everything else is independent initiative. Where is the independent initiative in Korean SC2 ? They need smaller local tournaments created(AND FUNDED) by korean organisations. Or even bigger tournaments like WESG sponsored by huge corporations.
I'm happy with WCS... And at least 2 more years of great SC2 action.
To suggest that nobody in Korea has taken independent initiative or that no tournament in Korea has been funded by Korean orgs is way wrong btw
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On December 10 2016 08:55 corydoras wrote:
It could be far worse and what we are about to have is probably reliant on Blizzard bleeding cash.
I'm fine with this system, it's the best bad system we can get
Yeah the whole SC2 scene is reliant on big daddy Mikes passion.
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United States23455 Posts
On December 10 2016 08:55 Ansibled wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2016 08:52 Darkhorse wrote:On December 10 2016 08:41 Ansibled wrote:On December 10 2016 08:37 Darkhorse wrote:On December 10 2016 08:33 Ansibled wrote:On December 10 2016 08:22 Darkhorse wrote:Korea got fucked. I know it probably took a lot of hard work to get this done and I appreciate that Incontrol highlights that and I'm happy there will be a WCS in 2017, but I'm still gonna call a spade a spade. Korea got fucked. In what way did Korea get fucked? Pro league is gone. S2SL is gone. Nothing done to offset this (ie allowing Koreans to enter DH, other weekend events again) so yay for oversaturation in GSL with far fewer established teams to pay players And by nothing done to offset this what you actually mean is 3 GSLs instead of 2, super tournaments, and money shifted from the foreign scene into global events (which Korea will take.) I mean is the only way Korea doesn't get fucked to you if Blizzard comes out and funds 6 teams and a teamleague? You have pretty unrealistic expectations. And of course this goes without mentioning the countless number of online tournaments we have. Super tournaments replace Kespa cup, something Korea lost that I didn't mention in my previous post (because I knew super tournaments offset them) also the IEM WC in Katowice has always been global unless I'm mistaken so it's not like Korea was "given something" there although I'll concede that the prize pool is higher this year. I'll concede that Blizzard shouldn't be expected to save PL on their own but Stork's recent interview seems to suggest they didn't even really try. That's most of my disappointment with Blizzard atm. Also I've never been a fan of splitting the global finals 50/50 (biggest prize pool of the year) when given an even playing field Koreans could easily qualify for more of those spots. But that last bit is all preference and I understand if you disagree Well there was 1 KeSPA cup and it was a global event not a WCS Korea event, so that's not strictly true. IEM Katowice season was a WCS Circuit event. http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2016_WCS_Winter_Circuit_ChampionshipI understand people not liking the way WCS final spots are allocated but I personally have no issues with it, and it's fairer than we see in most other games.
True on Kespa cup. I will say that there is only one IEM circuit event available to Korea this season as opposed to last season (gyeonggi this year as opposed to Shenzhen, gamescon, and Taipei last year)
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Elentos
55594 Posts
On December 10 2016 08:22 Darkhorse wrote:Korea got fucked.
2016 - 2 GSL (~194,000$ each), 2 SSL (~113,000$ each), 2 Cross Finals (~25,750$ each), KeSPA Cup (~50,000$)
Means ~725,000$ prize money available in total in Korean/Global WCS Events
2017 - 3 GSL (~145,000$ each), 2 Super Tournaments (~25,500$ each), IEM Gyeonggi (35,000$), IEM Katowice (250,000$), Korea vs World (unknown)
Means ~770,000$ + prize money available in total in Korean/Global WCS events
As you'll quickly realize the amount of tournaments also appears to be the same, but because the Cross Finals are hardly a tournament - only 4 players play - there are more WCS related tournaments for Koreans next year even though SSL is dropped. And because of the 3rd season, if you drop out of GSL in May you no longer have nothing major to play in until Autumn.
There's only 4 region locked tournaments in 2017 which will make sure the foreign scene doesn't take huge steps back after all the good work non-Korean players did this year. Removing the lock will hurt more than it will heal.
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On December 10 2016 09:00 Darkhorse wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2016 08:55 Ansibled wrote:On December 10 2016 08:52 Darkhorse wrote:On December 10 2016 08:41 Ansibled wrote:On December 10 2016 08:37 Darkhorse wrote:On December 10 2016 08:33 Ansibled wrote:On December 10 2016 08:22 Darkhorse wrote:Korea got fucked. I know it probably took a lot of hard work to get this done and I appreciate that Incontrol highlights that and I'm happy there will be a WCS in 2017, but I'm still gonna call a spade a spade. Korea got fucked. In what way did Korea get fucked? Pro league is gone. S2SL is gone. Nothing done to offset this (ie allowing Koreans to enter DH, other weekend events again) so yay for oversaturation in GSL with far fewer established teams to pay players And by nothing done to offset this what you actually mean is 3 GSLs instead of 2, super tournaments, and money shifted from the foreign scene into global events (which Korea will take.) I mean is the only way Korea doesn't get fucked to you if Blizzard comes out and funds 6 teams and a teamleague? You have pretty unrealistic expectations. And of course this goes without mentioning the countless number of online tournaments we have. Super tournaments replace Kespa cup, something Korea lost that I didn't mention in my previous post (because I knew super tournaments offset them) also the IEM WC in Katowice has always been global unless I'm mistaken so it's not like Korea was "given something" there although I'll concede that the prize pool is higher this year. I'll concede that Blizzard shouldn't be expected to save PL on their own but Stork's recent interview seems to suggest they didn't even really try. That's most of my disappointment with Blizzard atm. Also I've never been a fan of splitting the global finals 50/50 (biggest prize pool of the year) when given an even playing field Koreans could easily qualify for more of those spots. But that last bit is all preference and I understand if you disagree Well there was 1 KeSPA cup and it was a global event not a WCS Korea event, so that's not strictly true. IEM Katowice season was a WCS Circuit event. http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2016_WCS_Winter_Circuit_ChampionshipI understand people not liking the way WCS final spots are allocated but I personally have no issues with it, and it's fairer than we see in most other games. True on Kespa cup. I will say that there is only one IEM circuit event available to Korea this season as opposed to last season (gyeonggi this year as opposed to Shenzhen, gamescon, and Taipei last year)
The IEM and WCS seasons don't line up.
There are only 2 events left on the IEM circuit this year, Gyeonggi and Katowice. We won't know more about IEM until they announce their plans for next season, it's possible they host more events though I don't know how likely this is.
In any case I don't think Korea got fucked is a reasonable conclusion to draw from all of this. As an aside I hope people support online tournaments more this year, especially things like Olimoleague.
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Last year of decent Sc2 pro scene. Sad bad true 
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EPT
