EPTGreatest Players of All Time: The Finale - Page 10
| Forum Index > SC2 General |
|
Wildmoon
Thailand4189 Posts
| ||
|
A_Scarecrow
Australia721 Posts
| ||
|
kyllinghest
Norway1607 Posts
| ||
|
Doodsmack
United States7224 Posts
I'm confused why the author didn't mention his record 4 GSL wins though. I think the list of achievements misstates it too. Or am I missing something? | ||
|
FrostedMiniWheats
United States30730 Posts
On April 30 2015 11:43 kyllinghest wrote: Mvp the obvious #1! My favorite Mvp moment was when he "invented" macro terran. I think it was vs Ensnare on Metalopolis, he did a double expand which was unheard of back then. This game has evolved so much, and Mvp is one of the biggest reasons for it. Was against Hyperdub | ||
|
IcookTacos
Sweden295 Posts
I really loved reading all of this. I've read every single word since you published the first 15. I mean damn, this is some great work. One of the best final edits on TL.net. You have truly poured heart and soul into this and of course hours of research and writing. Big ups to you, mad respect. Mvp. Life. Starcraft. Forever. | ||
|
sibs
635 Posts
On April 30 2015 08:49 sitromit wrote: In that era which according to you was so bad for Terran, there were 3 T in the top 8 of GSL. How many Zergs were at the top 8 of Life's Blizzcon? That's right, only 1. In fact, Zerg was not just the least represented race at that Blizzcon, it had been the least successful race in all WCS events in HotS up until that point. Yea 3T 5P 0Z... Mvp actually had most of his finals vs other Terrans, early in the game history.... it reeks of bias giving the same weight to 2010-2012 GSL's to 2013+ after the kespa switch. But Infestor/Broodlord OP right. | ||
|
paddyz
Ireland628 Posts
| ||
|
PinheadXXXXXX
United States897 Posts
| ||
|
Alpino
Brazil4390 Posts
| ||
|
cYaN
Norway3322 Posts
On April 30 2015 06:05 travis wrote: so silly that people are still living in the past. this is exactly what I expected though, and most people will incorrectly support mvp at #1 life has been as dominant as mvp except he has been doing it for way longer. I would like to know how you write a greatest of all time list without "living in the past". I would think it would be a requirement for even thinking of such a list. | ||
|
bhfberserk
Canada390 Posts
| ||
|
Tsubbi
Germany7979 Posts
also you are overvalueing blink and bl/infestor era a lot, terran has been the strongest race for far longer periods and this combined with nostalgia shows in the ranking with 6 terrans in top 10. anyway, lots of work put into it and lots of discussion of course, coolest article on tl in a long time! | ||
|
ETisME
12387 Posts
the insane imba ghost patch His boX series is the only one that makes me feel the player (Mvp) has prepared a specific strategy for the opponent Master in bio and bio mech and mech. His ability to constantly play amazing games against top players in top form. His innovation for terran builds. All Heil the king of wings | ||
|
yoshi245
United States2969 Posts
| ||
|
Antonidas
United States105 Posts
And those pics of Life are hilarious. There are many tourneys and games ahead. I'm looking forward to the story. | ||
|
Phredxor
New Zealand15076 Posts
Long live the King indeed. | ||
|
swag_bro
Japan782 Posts
On April 30 2015 10:48 baabaa101 wrote: I'll accept this, since the amount of gushing about MVP made it quite clear what race the author prefers. Note how he bent over backwards to make excuses for why MVP ONLY cheesed Squirtle in game 7. MVP should be denied rank #1 for PRECISELY this game. the whole 11/11 meta is a big reason for there being something wrong with the game all this time yet people just "accept" that terrans ought to be allowed to play strategies and win like this, and even if it doesn't work they can usually recover anyway. The fact that any terran, including and especially MVP could get that far and win a GSL by cheesing so much demonstrated the broken early game in favour of terran (that HOTS made even worse) Note also how the author blames MVP's loss to Life in the GSL finals on the Broodlord infestor meta: according to him, when terran wins, it's the godlike skill of the player. when zerg wins, it's the imba race. Next time, get someone to do this who doesn't have that obvious bias. If you want to blame Life's win over MVP on broodlord infestor, then blame MVP's win over Squirtle on the broken 11/11. I watched that series, and it was a great series until game 7 completely ruined it. Can't blame MVP though, he wants to win and he knows terrans can cheese to win and does it. that this kind of play gets glorified as exciting when all it is is taking advantage of a poor early game balance level to steal easy wins is just embarrassing to the game. I suppose if there is one thing that is positive about LoTV is that hopefully this stuff won't continue. Which race can buy cloaked-early game production-auto-attack-air attack-splash damage-non-suicide-counters zerg detection-widow mines for a measly 25 gas...the only unit in the game of any race that comes close to that level of silliness is .. cyclones.... zerg use swarmhosts in order to not die to terran turtle max mech and in order to not die to protoss turtle max colossus air. the swarm host nerf is as ridiculous a move by blizzard as terrans would think removing air attack from widow mines and making them attack only once every 2 minutes would be, or making forcefields cost 100 energy instead of 50. but hey, what do I know, I only watch reaper widow mine hellbat constantly decimating the TvZ meta all over the GSL and the F button making even armies of P and Z turn into a cakewalk for protoss hardly losing any units while all the zerg units die. what do I know.... just what I actually see happen. User was temp banned for this post. Not this post alone, but continuous balance whine Obvious troll is obvious. Enjoy your ban kid. On April 30 2015 07:52 Musicus wrote: Well even is Life is better, he might not be the greatest of all time. LeBron James could beat Michael Jordan at his peak, because the game and players developed so much since then. But Michael Jordan is still the GOAT, period. Okay this analogy makes absolutely zero sense at all, in comparison to my comparisons at least. Basketball has no metagame that changes consistently or any balance patches because certain shoes are too imba. It's just a few tall guys running around and throwing a ball into a basket. StarCraft II, on the other hand, is evolving every day. Players find new ways to play and there are balance patches that can change everything. Also, players play different race so that also changes things. Basketball is just who is faster and more accurate. That is all. | ||
|
HardTrance9
Mexico10 Posts
Thanks again. Loved the Mvp one as he is my favorite since I saw him first and felt so sorry for his injuries... Thanks to you I could understand so many things from the players and tournaments I always wanted to know but I couldn't find or read ANYWHERE... this is the most valuable part of it... Make a PDF file or something that keeps your articles somewhere a live for ever.. With all your data, you could only add a couple of simple graphs to compare each player, but nothing too fancy like the useless data shown in GSL.. KISS.... "keep it simple....." My reverences to you time and effort again. Cheers from Mexico, Baja California Sur (playing SC since 1998).. | ||
|
Apoteosis
Chile820 Posts
I think stuchiu is exaggerating when it comes to Mvp's changes to the Terran race. Hellion Banshee existed since the very first GSL. The first Terran to play macro in a solid way was Jinro. The most extended build order for TvT (1-1-1) was around since WoL beta. And Nada played far better bio-mech style than Mvp. About TvZ, I can credit Mvp for being one of the first players to use mech in the matchup effectively. But come on, mech play was always a hipster option. Mvp's repertoire of builds during BL/Festor era were pure cheese, save for that hellion banshee into 3 base mech. And as per the finals vs Life, he did not make the same build all the finals: he switched between helion banshee and 2fact BFH. Why did he do that? Both were extremely difficult to discern with overlord scouting. So, Mvp switched between a macro build and a cheesy one. That's why Life opted throughout the series by making 2base muta. As per TvP, granted, he invented the SCV pulls. But nothing more. He grinded that GSL trophy in 2012 relying on pure cheese. I mean, Has will be proud of him. So, overall, Mvp's contributions to the game that lasted to this day were: mech play and SCV pulls. If that is the case, hell, even MKP was far more innovative. Even to this day Terrans do the marine split and stutter step micro, go for 3 base builds against zerg and go for pure bio play in TvT. And Life contributions? Still no Zerg can play like him. Why is that? Because of his timings. His timings are beautiful. And by the way, he was the first one to play aggro in the BL/Festor era. His contributions are not as important as Nestea's or Stephano's, but consider this: Life playstyle is unmatched, impossible to imitate because his playstyle lies upon another conception of the very basic principles of the Zerg race. No Zerg can master the art of making units and drones at the same time. No Zerg can cycle up the drone/Army mechanic like he does: he drones at the most unexpected timings, he attacks when no other Zerg will do such thing. And finally, if it is for miraculous runs, Fruitdealer's run was far more impressive and with a more powerful emotional background. Anyways, Mvp could be the N° 1 because of nostalgia, but please, say it plainly, instead of hiding in "objective" and "rational" arguments. We all know that your list is a subjective one. Nobody would have complained if you out Mvp in N° 1 place because of nostalgia: I, for one, am not complaining. I am just pointing that there is no real objective argument to put Mvp above Life. Only time will tell if there is such argument. Or maybe not and Mvp will be our first bonjwa and Life our next one: none is above the other one, because both belong to another scale. | ||
| ||
