EPTIf you can reason that he made that many obvious mistakes throwing the game, you can't reason he made obvious mistakes trying to win? It seems silly. I agree with Andre, the confirmation bias is strong in this thread.
Pinnacle voids ByuL vs MarineKing Match - Page 42
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Jermius
United States13 Posts
If you can reason that he made that many obvious mistakes throwing the game, you can't reason he made obvious mistakes trying to win? It seems silly. I agree with Andre, the confirmation bias is strong in this thread. | ||
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Deathstar
9150 Posts
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Luolis
Finland7096 Posts
On March 26 2015 21:18 maGicc wrote: All his reactions looks extremely fake to me, especially the one @5:45 when he tries to sell the fact that he had no idea about anything. Just wanting to say that all your posts on tl are just participating in this witch hunt. Go to reddit, while people here atleast try to hear from all accounts. | ||
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DJHelium
Sweden13480 Posts
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SoSexy
Italy3725 Posts
On March 26 2015 22:04 Deathstar wrote: People are just witch hunting in this thread. 42 pages of nothing new or interesting :/ People are just defending the undefendable in this thread. 42 pages of nothing new or interesting :/ | ||
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Clonester
Germany2808 Posts
On March 26 2015 21:35 Andre wrote: 1. Because half the posts are how all of MKP's game decisions are stupid/noob. 2. No, you see I can't do that. Because I'd have to be convinced of a player throwing. I made that statement as a hypothetical. For examples; see CS:GO there was a similar situation awhile ago with fnatic's team specifically flusha's gameplay. It's not exactly the same situation as cs:go had aimbot/ aimassits not matchfixing but in terms of gameplay analysis/witchunting it's the same. The majority of community and even a lot of pros were in agreement that flusha was hacking, without any real proof. Just a lot of detailed analysis of gameplay. People see what they see. Because of weird gameplay and betting spikes people just want to connect those things so they make sense, it's a subconscious thing. As long as you have any notion of someone being a cheater every analysis you do will be biased, sadly. I'm all for public recognition of the problem, but analyzing gameplay elements and basing MKP's innocence on that is silly. You can make a point because of the betting spike but it's still not conclusive, it's just speculation - even if it is quite probable that MKP was throwing. We go to CS:GO analogies? Lets talk about that game in August 2014... how where they called? iBuyPower? When they threw the game, smiling after lose, playing rubbish obvious, everybody shouted "what evidence!!!" "no throw" "they where tired from EU to US flight". 6 month later. Nobody shouted that shit anymore. Sorry but how the game run, it is a cetrain evidence to the theorie, that MK wanted to throw the game via losing a macro game. Thats easy and nobody can spot that, just make bad splits. But then he saw this no hatch but after hatch pool and gas timing and had to think "how to throw but not obvious". So he tried to play like against a 1bbb even knowing its a hatch somewhere. But he accediently saw this spine and now had to pretend not seeing it. I mean, if he saw it, he would just not build a reactor, but a tech lab, 2 bunkers and boom, instand won. But he did not want to win and if he used the reaper to scout it more out, he would have to react and against ByuLs build, you can either react straight and win or look extremly suspicious. He new it, thus pretending not seeing it, not seeing the creep later (the caster where total wtf is going on here at that moment) thinking it would look more fishy if he reacted "bad" to it. This theorie may not be right or wrong. But for me it is the most possible theorie out there. Thus making MK a suspect which has to be further investigated by people who have more power and controll then me and most other people here in tl.net But this is not happening or not shown to us leading to the mass speciulations, mass fight of people saying "throw" or "no throw". When KESPA would atleast openly say they would investigate or knowing the match fixing problem and try to do something. Even normal PR-Blablabla would be enough at the moment. But they say nothing leaving the field to the public. | ||
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OtherWorld
France17333 Posts
On March 26 2015 22:10 DJHelium wrote: https://twitter.com/SC2MVP/status/581068461784322048 Nice, hopefully we'll get more than PR bullshit. The hopes are small though. edit : lol did MVP's twitter really retweet Apollo's tweet about MK being easy for ByuL (x | ||
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Deathstar
9150 Posts
On March 26 2015 22:16 OtherWorld wrote: Nice, hopefully we'll get more than PR bullshit. The hopes are small though. Are you mad? They're going to say they will either investigate this further or that there is no conclusive evidence of match fixing. | ||
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OtherWorld
France17333 Posts
On March 26 2015 22:19 Deathstar wrote: Are you mad? They're going to say they will either investigate this further or that there is no conclusive evidence of match fixing. Which is pretty much PR bullshit, no? d: | ||
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Deathstar
9150 Posts
I don't know what else you would expect. Leave MKP alone until you have something solid | ||
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Penev
28451 Posts
On March 26 2015 22:10 DJHelium wrote: https://twitter.com/SC2MVP/status/581068461784322048 Well, that's something at least, thanks DJ | ||
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OtherWorld
France17333 Posts
On March 26 2015 22:41 Deathstar wrote: I don't know what else you would expect. Leave MKP alone until you have something solid I guess an analysis of the game by MVP's staff, possibly by MK himself, because sadly saying that "there is no conclusive evidence of matchfixing" will do them more hurt than not saying anything. And if you read the thread I am not witch hunting, I actually defended MK's innocence until he is proven guilty and argued against the "it looks shady so, y'known, it has to be shady, right?" logic. | ||
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Grizvok
United States711 Posts
On March 26 2015 22:41 Deathstar wrote: I don't know what else you would expect. Leave MKP alone until you have something solid There's already plenty of solid evidence. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On March 26 2015 22:50 OtherWorld wrote: I guess an analysis of the game by MVP's staff, possibly by MK himself, because sadly saying that "there is no conclusive evidence of matchfixing" will do them more hurt than not saying anything. And if you read the thread I am not witch hunting, I actually defended MK's innocence until he is proven guilty and argued against the "it looks shady so, y'known, it has to be shady, right?" logic. This isn't the logic though. It is more like: "Considering we have a voided bet and MKP's gameplay looked like a thrown match the most simple and probable explanation is that is was a thrown match" | ||
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Grizvok
United States711 Posts
On March 26 2015 23:10 The_Red_Viper wrote: This isn't the logic though. It is more like: "Considering we have a voided bet and MKP's gameplay looked like a thrown match the most simple and probable explanation is that is was a thrown match" Exactly. Given all evidence we've received this being a fixed match is the probable explanation. If you think otherwise you probably lack some pretty basic critical thinking skills. | ||
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lohdon
170 Posts
No there isn't. Solid evidence means you can prove something but all we have is very suspicious betting lines and a game that can be interpreted as being a throw. However it's all still very much up for interpretation. | ||
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Penev
28451 Posts
Explain to me why someone of MK's level wouldn't scout for a (proxy) hatch after scouting late pool + no natural | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On March 26 2015 23:17 lohdon wrote: No there isn't. Solid evidence means you can prove something but all we have is very suspicious betting lines and a game that can be interpreted as being a throw. However it's all still very much up for interpretation. Let me ask you a question. Given the evidence we have right now, do you think there is an explanation which is MORE LIKELY than a fixed match? If so, pls explain it to me. You also will never have 100% proof of anything, that's not possible. | ||
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Muffloe
Sweden6061 Posts
On March 26 2015 23:15 Grizvok wrote: Exactly. Given all evidence we've received this being a fixed match is the probable explanation. If you think otherwise you probably lack some pretty basic critical thinking skills. I feel there could be a few more valid explanations for this situation. R.I.P. my brain I guess | ||
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OtherWorld
France17333 Posts
On March 26 2015 23:10 The_Red_Viper wrote: This isn't the logic though. It is more like: "Considering we have a voided bet and MKP's gameplay looked like a thrown match the most simple and probable explanation is that is was a thrown match" Well yeah, and how do you go from "it's the most simple and probable explanation" to "it's what actually happened"? I said this tons of times but I'll say it again. I don't deny that bets were placed on an unregular basis, because they were, at least according to Pinnacle, which we can probably trust as far as betting goes. I don't deny that MK looked different in his behavior before and during the game, because he did, which may or may not be an indication of him matchfixing. I don't deny that MK's play looked, at least for someone with no knowledge of MarineKing's usual play and reactions, somewhere between "terribly bad" and "straight-up nonsensical". It's enough to suspect him of matchfixing, because yes that's what it looks like unless you have more informations, but it's not enough to jump to the conclusion that "it has to be matchfixing", ie, to accuse him of this. On March 26 2015 23:15 Grizvok wrote: Exactly. Given all evidence we've received this being a fixed match is the probable explanation. If you think otherwise you probably lack some pretty basic critical thinking skills. Jesus, someone who didn't even try to look at things from different point of views telling me that I lack basic critical skills without even reading what I said. Grats. | ||
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