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Sweden33719 Posts
On October 10 2014 05:55 Big J wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2014 05:46 Wombat_NI wrote:
I don't know what the fuck they were thinking with the first incarnation of Daedalus lol The ramp was 4-wide instead of 3-wide. That was basically it. They patched it asap, when they saw that it really doesn't work. I don't think blizzard should get so much hate for it, I'd rather have them do those experiements on a regular basis to stretch the game balance. Though, maybe not in WCS but maybe in between seasons. Oh, that's what they are doing right now! 
Except instead of bringing in NEW experimental maps, they went on some kind of nostalgic gravedigging spree and brought back Metalopolis from its well deserved eternal rest.
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On October 10 2014 17:28 FFW_Rude wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2014 11:07 Circumstance wrote:
Everyone's favorite cynic had this to say after his operation today:
What did he said ? I don't have sound at work  (hope he is alright)
"Metalopolis? Give me more morphine!"
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On October 10 2014 17:54 Liquid`Jinro wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2014 05:55 Big J wrote:On October 10 2014 05:46 Wombat_NI wrote:
I don't know what the fuck they were thinking with the first incarnation of Daedalus lol The ramp was 4-wide instead of 3-wide. That was basically it. They patched it asap, when they saw that it really doesn't work. I don't think blizzard should get so much hate for it, I'd rather have them do those experiements on a regular basis to stretch the game balance. Though, maybe not in WCS but maybe in between seasons. Oh, that's what they are doing right now! Except instead of bringing in NEW experimental maps, they went on some kind of nostalgic gravedigging spree and brought back Metalopolis from its well deserved eternal rest.
Exactly. Just go have a look at some recent, interesting, innovative, new maps published in the custom maps forum (and these are just the ones on the first page). Having them in an offseason/alternative map pool would be exciting.
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Sweden33719 Posts
Crux Bridgehead is gorgeous :C
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I took some time figuring out where the spawns were, but yeah I would love to see pro matches on it
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Northern Ireland27460 Posts
Such a shame they didn't go the route Jinro/OtherWorld outlined above. Some of these maps look like they would play out differently, but not be borderline/completely broken
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Tbh I wish more non-WCS tournaments organizers would use non-ladder maps. O'Gaming did that with NW2 and with the Underdogs and that's really awesome from them, it would be nice to see others tournaments doing that (madals' and TakeTV's events for exemple)
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even with the upcoming season it seems organizers stick with s3 ladder maps, it's ridiculous how much control blizzard has over ladder maps and eventually tournament maps.
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Northern Ireland27460 Posts
It's a consequence of the WCS system I guess. Tournaments used to filter in the best community maps and those that were good stuck around.
Because WCS tournaments use the ladder pool, I think other tournaments just stick with that for ease of organisation/having the pros familiar with them.
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On October 10 2014 17:54 Liquid`Jinro wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2014 05:55 Big J wrote:On October 10 2014 05:46 Wombat_NI wrote:
I don't know what the fuck they were thinking with the first incarnation of Daedalus lol The ramp was 4-wide instead of 3-wide. That was basically it. They patched it asap, when they saw that it really doesn't work. I don't think blizzard should get so much hate for it, I'd rather have them do those experiements on a regular basis to stretch the game balance. Though, maybe not in WCS but maybe in between seasons. Oh, that's what they are doing right now! Except instead of bringing in NEW experimental maps, they went on some kind of nostalgic gravedigging spree and brought back Metalopolis from its well deserved eternal rest.
serioulsy relax guys
They did this all year long : where do you think heavy rain, foxtrot lab, deadwing catallena and many more came from?
Result was people whining about they should have been testing more before putting them in the ladder pool.
If they added one of these "new experimental" maps and it prooved to be imba, every nerds and their little sister would come and start ranting at them.
So next season is old, sicko, wierdo maps - elected by the community!!! we only have ourselves to blame - we will just fool around and have fun, and 2015 season one will have plenty of nice, refined maps (probably the current new experimental ones but with 3 monthes of tests and mods)
We know next season will make no sense, just have fun (or just veto anyway)
(although I would have liked to have the close air posisition on metalopolis, to make it really crazy)
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On October 10 2014 19:47 Gwavajuice wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2014 17:54 Liquid`Jinro wrote:On October 10 2014 05:55 Big J wrote:On October 10 2014 05:46 Wombat_NI wrote:
I don't know what the fuck they were thinking with the first incarnation of Daedalus lol The ramp was 4-wide instead of 3-wide. That was basically it. They patched it asap, when they saw that it really doesn't work. I don't think blizzard should get so much hate for it, I'd rather have them do those experiements on a regular basis to stretch the game balance. Though, maybe not in WCS but maybe in between seasons. Oh, that's what they are doing right now! Except instead of bringing in NEW experimental maps, they went on some kind of nostalgic gravedigging spree and brought back Metalopolis from its well deserved eternal rest. Result was people whining about they should have been testing more before putting them in the ladder pool.
Yeah but the problem is it's really hard nowadays to get some good data on maps because every tournament uses the same set of maps. I agree we need some tournaments, probably not the ones with WCS points at stake, to try and use some other maps so that the most solid then get a chance to become part of the ladder map pool.
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On October 10 2014 19:47 Gwavajuice wrote:
So next season is old, sicko, wierdo maps - elected by the community!!! we only have ourselves to blame
oh shit, I didn't know I could elect good maps, oh... wait....
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On October 10 2014 19:47 Gwavajuice wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2014 17:54 Liquid`Jinro wrote:On October 10 2014 05:55 Big J wrote:On October 10 2014 05:46 Wombat_NI wrote:
I don't know what the fuck they were thinking with the first incarnation of Daedalus lol The ramp was 4-wide instead of 3-wide. That was basically it. They patched it asap, when they saw that it really doesn't work. I don't think blizzard should get so much hate for it, I'd rather have them do those experiements on a regular basis to stretch the game balance. Though, maybe not in WCS but maybe in between seasons. Oh, that's what they are doing right now! Except instead of bringing in NEW experimental maps, they went on some kind of nostalgic gravedigging spree and brought back Metalopolis from its well deserved eternal rest. Result was people whining about they should have been testing more before putting them in the ladder pool.
That's precisely what we are saying : that this offseason would have been a good opportunity to test potential maps for 2015. That principle would have avoided things such as Yeonsu and Daedalus
But yeah I guess it's way funnier to go back to the past instead of experimenting what could make SC2's future even better right?
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Northern Ireland27460 Posts
I think what people are getting at is not so much what Blizzard do or don't do, but that they have such a stranglehold over maps, even more so now with the advent of WCS.
I don't have a massive issue with their pools other than I would like a much bigger map pool with more vetoes. It gives room to keep maps that are great but are removed for being 'stale', like Frost because the frequency of games would be less with a bigger pool. Additionally it would allow for more experimentation.
You could have a steady core of stable, well-balanced maps and rotate in more experimental ones which would enter 'stable' rotation if they were good.
I just find the small map pool necessitates rotating out GOOD maps solely due to people getting bored of the same maps because they're continually playing on them.
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Northern Ireland27460 Posts
On October 10 2014 19:50 [PkF] Wire wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2014 19:47 Gwavajuice wrote:On October 10 2014 17:54 Liquid`Jinro wrote:On October 10 2014 05:55 Big J wrote:On October 10 2014 05:46 Wombat_NI wrote:
I don't know what the fuck they were thinking with the first incarnation of Daedalus lol The ramp was 4-wide instead of 3-wide. That was basically it. They patched it asap, when they saw that it really doesn't work. I don't think blizzard should get so much hate for it, I'd rather have them do those experiements on a regular basis to stretch the game balance. Though, maybe not in WCS but maybe in between seasons. Oh, that's what they are doing right now! Except instead of bringing in NEW experimental maps, they went on some kind of nostalgic gravedigging spree and brought back Metalopolis from its well deserved eternal rest. Result was people whining about they should have been testing more before putting them in the ladder pool. Yeah but the problem is it's really hard nowadays to get some good data on maps because every tournament uses the same set of maps. I agree we need some tournaments, probably not the ones with WCS points at stake, to try and use some other maps so that the most solid then get a chance to become part of the ladder map pool.
I believe every show match series or smaller community tournament should get the ball rolling.
I think it'd be beneficial to the event organisers too. Considering how much content there is, they can brand it as 'you've seen these guys play 100s of games before , but have you seen them on these maps?'
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On October 10 2014 19:55 Wombat_NI wrote:
I don't have a massive issue with their pools other than I would like a much bigger map pool with more vetoes.
The current setup is great because you should never play on a vetoed map ; even if you and your opponent vetoed 3 different maps, there will still be 1 map you both didn't veto. If the map pool had for instance 10 maps with 6 vetos, it's quite unlikely you and your opponent will have a "common" map. Even a 8 maps / 4 vetos configuration can be problematic since 8 = 4 + 4. I guess that's the reason why they stick to this 7/3 setup, which is a good thing in my opinion.
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Will this be a full length season?
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On October 10 2014 19:59 [PkF] Wire wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2014 19:55 Wombat_NI wrote:
I don't have a massive issue with their pools other than I would like a much bigger map pool with more vetoes. The current setup is great because you should never play on a vetoed map ; even if you and your opponent vetoed 3 different maps, there will still be 1 map you both didn't veto. If the map pool had for instance 10 maps with 6 vetos, it's quite unlikely you and your opponent will have a "common" map. Even a 8 maps / 4 vetos configuration can be problematic since 8 = 4 + 4. I guess that's the reason why they stick to this 7/3 setup, which is a good thing in my opinion.
Wouldn't 9/4, 11/5 or 13/6 have the same effect?
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this season will be somewhat shorter than normal due to blizzcon lengthening the current season.
also I'm quite suspicious of what trash blizzard is going to throw on the ladder with 2015 s1 I bet they have a new daedalus/alterzim.
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EPT
