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On December 11 2013 09:43 istandwithmitt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 11 2013 09:29 Faust852 wrote:On December 11 2013 09:26 istandwithmitt wrote:
Well I guess we know where TL places its values.
The writers producing content for the community are volunteers while TL makes money from the hits they're providing via advertising. Seems fair. Yeh, how dare they use ad to pay servers costs for such a big forum/website. TL maintains two fairly large & star-studded esports team. Obviously there's money. This is just the most embarrassing & novice part of esports that the community is exploited because it's the cheapest option. Any legitimate sport or business would pay its writers because their work deserves pay and because their work is used to generate revenue. TL is taking advantage of the enthusiasm of people to avoid shilling out any money to the people that make it run.
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Such bullshit and i will explain why. U can put any event in history in a negative or positive context, depending from which side u look at it. The glass is half full or half empty.
U see a TL that doesnt pay there writers (which i call hobbyists) and spends it on esportsstuff and players. Pitchforks!! I see them facilitating a community where peeps with the same interests come together for free. I can watch there proteam for free, which is formerly of another organisation. I can watch different tl-players and read articles for free. Thx to teamliquid i get free stuff! But maybe u want paperview, with just a fraction of the content, a samplesize community, coerier pt 10, no more teaja's, fluffs.
Plz go and be ashamed. If u dont like it here, just leave. It isnt that hard u know.
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I would really like to apply for this but I know I wouldn't be able to keep up with the workload. Already managing a writing society, working as a journalist, and studying for a degree...
Unless "minimal" counts for the "desired workload"...
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Philadelphia, PA10406 Posts
On December 11 2013 10:28 KivTM wrote:
While TL is under no obligation to pay any of their writers, lets not kid around the fact that they are in fact taking advantage of their position. They know they can get away with not paying anything because they know that there are a bunch of people out there who are willing to do it for free. If hypothetically, nobody applied for these jobs, you can be sure that they would offer something more (maybe pay or some other benefits). Instead, we have supply of willing writers > demand and hence we're in this position here.
I don't believe that TL is in position where they couldn't possibly afford to pay any of their writers. That might have been true when they were a small community with a small number of hardcore members but not anymore.
If nobody applied for these positions, a few people would probably step up and work more to cover the lost space, but gradually the writing on TL would dry up and coverage would become less and less. Actually.
I really regret that we let MLG get away with all their bullshit in 2011, because now everybody thinks esports is an industry where everyone is making out like bandits.
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Bisutopia19368 Posts
Maybe I can finally get accepted into the ever so elite SC2 staff forums! I'm going to write my ass off!
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I'll be submitting my application next week after exams.
Thanks for the opportunity, TL. Have been wondering if there would be anymore positions opened.
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Estonia4644 Posts
someone's been pocketing my ESPORTS dollars
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So I assume I get a 6 figure salary when I get the job right?
:D
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your Country52798 Posts
I really tried writing something, realized I was absolutely awful at stringing multiple sentences together, and gave up.
I'm sorry  . I will contribute to TL in every way possible but my writing skills are just bad.
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your Country52798 Posts
On December 11 2013 10:54 Liltwizzler wrote:
So I assume I get a 6 figure salary when I get the job right?
:D
In ESPORTS money yes
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On December 11 2013 10:55 The_Templar wrote:I really tried writing something, realized I was absolutely awful at stringing multiple sentences together, and gave up. I'm sorry . I will contribute to TL in every way possible but my writing skills are just bad.
Dude, u can still write articles, guides and stuff. Only difference being peeps dont bitch about so much becuz it aint official (+) and most of the time u dont get FP coverage (-). The people will still thank you for your efforts and even discuss everything inside and out (even if the guides/analysis u post are mediocre, believe me i know my stuff about mediocre).
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1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
My animal castration / illegal arms dealing / vampirism already pays me enough that I don't need to be paid by TL.
Getting league passes, extra forums, and a fancy icon that makes me feel superior on an internet message board are compensation enough!
also now I get to brutally judge you applicants muwahaha
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your Country52798 Posts
On December 11 2013 10:57 govie wrote:Show nested quote +On December 11 2013 10:55 The_Templar wrote:I really tried writing something, realized I was absolutely awful at stringing multiple sentences together, and gave up. I'm sorry . I will contribute to TL in every way possible but my writing skills are just bad. Dude, u can still write articles, guides and stuff. Only difference being peeps dont bitch about so much becuz it aint official (+) and most of the time u dont get FP coverage (-). The people will still thank you for your efforts and even discuss everything inside and out.
My writing is sufficiently bad that I will stick to battle reports and live reports in that field
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On December 11 2013 10:55 The_Templar wrote:I really tried writing something, realized I was absolutely awful at stringing multiple sentences together, and gave up. I'm sorry . I will contribute to TL in every way possible but my writing skills are just bad.
If you want to get better at writing you just have to practice! Just like anything else, the more you do it, the better at it you become. I would suggest just every night before going to sleep, write some of your thoughts down on how the day went or whatever you feel like writing. It's really easy to develop your own unique style that way. People aren't magically born as good writers and suddenly are off writing novels and poems and essays, it takes work as well as practice just as you would any other skill. Don't be intimidated!
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opterown
Australia54784 Posts
On December 11 2013 10:46 BisuDagger wrote:
Maybe I can finally get accepted into the ever so elite SC2 staff forums! I'm going to write my ass off!
it's a pretty slow forum
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On December 11 2013 10:46 BisuDagger wrote:
Maybe I can finally get accepted into the ever so elite SC2 staff forums! I'm going to write my ass off!
Write for Proleague you'd be great
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your Country52798 Posts
On December 11 2013 11:01 ArTiFaKs wrote:Show nested quote +On December 11 2013 10:55 The_Templar wrote:I really tried writing something, realized I was absolutely awful at stringing multiple sentences together, and gave up. I'm sorry . I will contribute to TL in every way possible but my writing skills are just bad. If you want to get better at writing you just have to practice! Just like anything else, the more you do it, the better at it you become. I would suggest just every night before going to sleep, write some of your thoughts down on how the day went or whatever you feel like writing. It's really easy to develop your own unique style that way. People aren't magically born as good writers and suddenly are off writing novels and poems and essays, it takes work as well as practice just as you would any other skill. Don't be intimidated!
It's not just writing though. I find it hard to express my thoughts at all. This has been an issue for me my whole life. I get around it by making stuff that points people towards a viewpoint similar to mine
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TL writers have never been paid so I've never been interested, however, with the great number of bright people that are involved in the community (maybe over exadurated, maybe not) TL has always been able to find pretty good writers.
I think the case will be the same here. Good luck to the applicants, and thank you for the sacrifices you make to provide coverage during your busy lives.
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I love that they're doing this again. hopefully this brings new talent into the industry.
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On December 11 2013 10:46 tree.hugger wrote:
If nobody applied for these positions, a few people would probably step up and work more to cover the lost space, but gradually the writing on TL would dry up and coverage would become less and less. Actually.
I really regret that we let MLG get away with all their bullshit in 2011, because now everybody thinks esports is an industry where everyone is making out like bandits.
Having written for a few eSports sites in the past, I can tell you it has been that way for a much longer time than that (going on perhaps 12ish years...I've been around too long -_-). MLG simply exacerbated the methods, and people slowly caught on.
What started out as a simple way to contribute to your favorite site, forum, or team, turned many talented people into cynics. Slowly, those like myself, doing it out of the love of writing and eSports, grew more into the business side behind the scenes, and saw how things operated. While I was lucky enough to eventually work myself into being monetarily compensated, I know far too many writers that had no such luck.
I used to have spreadsheets regarding some of the financials behind some of the sites I worked for; I'm quite regretting that I didn't keep the effort to continue to store them.
Disclaimer: I'm not endorsing/supporting a theory regarding TL having excessive income or that they may be like sites of the past, where only the top members came away with money. I'm simply expressing that it's possible, and visitors perhaps overcompensate what servers/infrastructure actually cost, and undervalue the income that sites like TL generate.
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On December 11 2013 10:46 tree.hugger wrote:Show nested quote +On December 11 2013 10:28 KivTM wrote:
While TL is under no obligation to pay any of their writers, lets not kid around the fact that they are in fact taking advantage of their position. They know they can get away with not paying anything because they know that there are a bunch of people out there who are willing to do it for free. If hypothetically, nobody applied for these jobs, you can be sure that they would offer something more (maybe pay or some other benefits). Instead, we have supply of willing writers > demand and hence we're in this position here.
I don't believe that TL is in position where they couldn't possibly afford to pay any of their writers. That might have been true when they were a small community with a small number of hardcore members but not anymore. If nobody applied for these positions, a few people would probably step up and work more to cover the lost space, but gradually the writing on TL would dry up and coverage would become less and less. Actually. I really regret that we let MLG get away with all their bullshit in 2011, because now everybody thinks esports is an industry where everyone is making out like bandits.
Are you saying TL is not a profitable business or that they wouldn't be profitable if they paid writers?
(serious questions btw because I always assumed that TL with all its revenue streams was doing quite well for itself but maybe I'm wrong?)
Having written for a few eSports sites in the past, I can tell you it has been that way for a much longer time than that (going on perhaps 12ish years...I've been around too long -_-). MLG simply exacerbated the methods, and people slowly caught on.
What started out as a simple way to contribute to your favorite site, forum, or team, turned many talented people into cynics. Slowly, those like myself, doing it out of the love of writing and eSports, grew more into the business side behind the scenes, and saw how things operated. While I was lucky enough to eventually work myself into being monetarily compensated, I know far too many writers that had no such luck.
I used to have spreadsheets regarding some of the financials behind some of the sites I worked for; I'm quite regretting that I didn't keep the effort to continue to store them.
Disclaimer: I'm not endorsing/supporting a theory regarding TL having excessive income or that they may be like sites of the past, where only the top members came away with money. I'm simply expressing that it's possible, and visitors perhaps overcompensate what servers/infrastructure actually cost, and undervalue the income that sites like TL generate.
I think this guy hit the nail on the head.
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EPT
