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On November 06 2013 22:46 Zealously wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2013 06:25 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 05:14 lolfail9001 wrote:On November 06 2013 05:10 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 01:14 Jealous wrote:
I would rather have an all-Korean tournament - skill level is simply higher. Felt the need to quote this.  Yeah, replace Naniwa with Sora. lol Naniwa: consistently top10 Protoss in the world since 2011 (and breaking into the top3 during his best times) Sora: got a decent place (?) in some tournament once I'm sorry, what Show nested quote +On November 06 2013 22:43 boxerfred wrote:It thrills me that a foreigner is in. I was so happy when Bomber overcame his curse and won S2 - I was live on stage at Gamescom. Then - Bomber didn't show a single sign of joy, and all my thrill instantly was killed. Edit: though I have to admit I'm cheering for HerO and Taeja.  That isn't really true though :/ sure he didnt fly through the roof but he looked happy and shocked most of all to me
If you are korean,unless you do a triple backwards flip; put on a murloc suit and jump in the crowd you are emotionless if you have to belive this forum.
I still facepalm thinking that people said Seed showed not emotion after his GSL win.
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On November 06 2013 21:25 SweKenZo wrote:
Naniwa played a kinda "cheesy" playstyle. or rather a 2-based centric style.
Isnt Soulkey known for being un-cheesable?
Are you kidding or did you just not watch the games? Or just absurdly Zerg biased?
Naniwa went for a quick 3rd game 2 and 3 and just rolled Revival when he decided to throw away 30 roaches to kill it.
It's Revival who went for the "Cheesy" playstyle. Naniwa just reacted exactly as he should have.
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Very impressive play from naniwa. Always been a fan of his but I must say i didn't expect him to roll revival like that. Naniwa gonna Roflstomp his way into blizzcon, what next?!
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United States23455 Posts
On November 06 2013 23:08 Figgy wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2013 21:25 SweKenZo wrote:
Naniwa played a kinda "cheesy" playstyle. or rather a 2-based centric style.
Isnt Soulkey known for being un-cheesable? Are you kidding or did you just not watch the games? Or just absurdly Zerg biased? Naniwa went for a quick 3rd game 2 and 3 and just rolled Revival when he decided to throw away 30 roaches to kill it. It's Revival who went for the "Cheesy" playstyle. Naniwa just reacted exactly as he should have.
TIL attacking with any sort of army on 3 bases with a worker lead on your opponent is "cheesy"
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On November 06 2013 22:46 Zealously wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2013 06:25 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 05:14 lolfail9001 wrote:On November 06 2013 05:10 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 01:14 Jealous wrote:
I would rather have an all-Korean tournament - skill level is simply higher. Felt the need to quote this. Yeah, replace Naniwa with Sora. lol Naniwa: consistently top10 Protoss in the world since 2011 (and breaking into the top3 during his best times) Sora: got a decent place (?) in some tournament once I'm sorry, what
Early 2011: second place in TSL3, wins MLG Dallas --> surely top10 Protoss worldwide
Late 2011: Code A, can't qualify for Code S; 2nd place at MLG Providence, 4th place at Blizzcon; since there are only 5 Protoss players in Code S at the end of 2011, argueable that he is top10
Early 2012: 3 Code S seasons in a row; in two of those he reaches the Ro8 (no other Protoss reaches top8 in both of those seasons) --> probably top3
end of 2012/very early 2013: Not top10
mid-late 2013: DH (2nd), IEM (2nd), MLG (3rd-4th), WCS Europe (5th-6th), top16 in WCS points (6th Protoss on that list) --> definitely top10 Protoss currently
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Naniwa is korean level no doubt. With this win vs Revival he clearly deserves to be in this tour, end of discussion.
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East Gorteau22261 Posts
On November 06 2013 23:23 Big J wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2013 22:46 Zealously wrote:On November 06 2013 06:25 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 05:14 lolfail9001 wrote:On November 06 2013 05:10 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 01:14 Jealous wrote:
I would rather have an all-Korean tournament - skill level is simply higher. Felt the need to quote this. Yeah, replace Naniwa with Sora. lol Naniwa: consistently top10 Protoss in the world since 2011 (and breaking into the top3 during his best times) Sora: got a decent place (?) in some tournament once I'm sorry, what Early 2011: second place in TSL3, wins MLG Dallas --> surely top10 Protoss worldwide Late 2011: Code A, can't qualify for Code S; 2nd place at MLG Providence, 4th place at Blizzcon; since there are only 5 Protoss players in Code S at the end of 2011, argueable that he is top10 Early 2012: 3 Code S seasons in a row; in two of those he reaches the Ro8 (no other Protoss reaches top8 in both of those seasons) --> probably top3 end of 2012/very early 2013: Not top10 mid-late 2013: DH (2nd), IEM (2nd), MLG (3rd-4th), WCS Europe (5th-6th), top16 in WCS points (6th Protoss on that list) --> definitely top10 Protoss currently
I know Nani's career as well as anyone, I'm questioning your assessment of Sora
And don't get me wrong, as a Nanifan I love the fact that he'll play at Blizzcon so I'm not saying Id rather want someone else in his stead, but I still have to question whether he has ever been in the top 3 for more than a brief period.
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Korean pro gamers have said severals times that they think naniwa is on the same level as them. Thats enough for me.
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On November 06 2013 23:20 Darkhoarse wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2013 23:08 Figgy wrote:On November 06 2013 21:25 SweKenZo wrote:
Naniwa played a kinda "cheesy" playstyle. or rather a 2-based centric style.
Isnt Soulkey known for being un-cheesable? Are you kidding or did you just not watch the games? Or just absurdly Zerg biased? Naniwa went for a quick 3rd game 2 and 3 and just rolled Revival when he decided to throw away 30 roaches to kill it. It's Revival who went for the "Cheesy" playstyle. Naniwa just reacted exactly as he should have. TIL attacking with any sort of army on 3 bases with a worker lead on your opponent is "cheesy"
none of them played cheesy really. Maybe you can consider Naniwas all in game 1 cheesy but I don't know.. for me cheese is different from all ins.
Game 2 and 3 he simply did timings to punish the third... overcommited on drones game 2 and in the actual attack game 3. I see no cheese either way there.
The fact that people call Naniwas builds 2base is silly though. Would it be a onebase build from nani if he killed both the natural and the third and then forced the all in?
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On November 06 2013 23:33 Zealously wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2013 23:23 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 22:46 Zealously wrote:On November 06 2013 06:25 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 05:14 lolfail9001 wrote:On November 06 2013 05:10 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 01:14 Jealous wrote:
I would rather have an all-Korean tournament - skill level is simply higher. Felt the need to quote this. Yeah, replace Naniwa with Sora. lol Naniwa: consistently top10 Protoss in the world since 2011 (and breaking into the top3 during his best times) Sora: got a decent place (?) in some tournament once I'm sorry, what Early 2011: second place in TSL3, wins MLG Dallas --> surely top10 Protoss worldwide Late 2011: Code A, can't qualify for Code S; 2nd place at MLG Providence, 4th place at Blizzcon; since there are only 5 Protoss players in Code S at the end of 2011, argueable that he is top10 Early 2012: 3 Code S seasons in a row; in two of those he reaches the Ro8 (no other Protoss reaches top8 in both of those seasons) --> probably top3 end of 2012/very early 2013: Not top10 mid-late 2013: DH (2nd), IEM (2nd), MLG (3rd-4th), WCS Europe (5th-6th), top16 in WCS points (6th Protoss on that list) --> definitely top10 Protoss currently I know Nani's career as well as anyone, I'm questioning your assessment of Sora And don't get me wrong, as a Nanifan I love the fact that he'll play at Blizzcon so I'm not saying Id rather want someone else in his stead, but I still have to question whether he has ever been in the top 3 for more than a brief period.
Probably a very brief period. But let's stop with the who deserves it more. Naniwa has earned the points and he has i no way done so with easy opposition. Look at the tourneys he's played and who he had to beat. I'd say beating hack twice, Hyun, Jaedong, Innovation, Duckdeok, San and many more that I cant list of the top of my head gives him the right to be there.
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Russian Federation40190 Posts
On November 06 2013 23:20 Darkhoarse wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2013 23:08 Figgy wrote:On November 06 2013 21:25 SweKenZo wrote:
Naniwa played a kinda "cheesy" playstyle. or rather a 2-based centric style.
Isnt Soulkey known for being un-cheesable? Are you kidding or did you just not watch the games? Or just absurdly Zerg biased? Naniwa went for a quick 3rd game 2 and 3 and just rolled Revival when he decided to throw away 30 roaches to kill it. It's Revival who went for the "Cheesy" playstyle. Naniwa just reacted exactly as he should have. TIL attacking with any sort of army on 3 bases with a worker lead on your opponent is "cheesy"
TIL Naniwa ever was on real 3 bases with a worker lead in a series. Granted, Naniwa is not cheesy. He is mindgame-ish, hence proxy gates and soul trains (as his best build, good joke, Naniwa).
On November 06 2013 23:33 doffe wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2013 23:20 Darkhoarse wrote:On November 06 2013 23:08 Figgy wrote:On November 06 2013 21:25 SweKenZo wrote:
Naniwa played a kinda "cheesy" playstyle. or rather a 2-based centric style.
Isnt Soulkey known for being un-cheesable? Are you kidding or did you just not watch the games? Or just absurdly Zerg biased? Naniwa went for a quick 3rd game 2 and 3 and just rolled Revival when he decided to throw away 30 roaches to kill it. It's Revival who went for the "Cheesy" playstyle. Naniwa just reacted exactly as he should have. TIL attacking with any sort of army on 3 bases with a worker lead on your opponent is "cheesy" none of them played cheesy really. Maybe you can consider Naniwas all in game 1 cheesy but I don't know.. for me cheese is different from all ins. Game 2 and 3 he simply did timings to punish the third... overcommited on drones game 2 and in the actual attack game 3. I see no cheese either way there. The fact that people call Naniwas builds 2base is silly though. Would it be a onebase build from nani if he killed both the natural and the third and then forced the all in?
I say that Naniwa never really planned on actually playing macro game. He would make void rays then. So yes, those were 2 base all-ins with faked third that forced overcommit from Revival (granted, he did not have good decision making at any point of series).
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On November 06 2013 23:33 Zealously wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2013 23:23 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 22:46 Zealously wrote:On November 06 2013 06:25 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 05:14 lolfail9001 wrote:On November 06 2013 05:10 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 01:14 Jealous wrote:
I would rather have an all-Korean tournament - skill level is simply higher. Felt the need to quote this. Yeah, replace Naniwa with Sora. lol Naniwa: consistently top10 Protoss in the world since 2011 (and breaking into the top3 during his best times) Sora: got a decent place (?) in some tournament once I'm sorry, what Early 2011: second place in TSL3, wins MLG Dallas --> surely top10 Protoss worldwide Late 2011: Code A, can't qualify for Code S; 2nd place at MLG Providence, 4th place at Blizzcon; since there are only 5 Protoss players in Code S at the end of 2011, argueable that he is top10 Early 2012: 3 Code S seasons in a row; in two of those he reaches the Ro8 (no other Protoss reaches top8 in both of those seasons) --> probably top3 end of 2012/very early 2013: Not top10 mid-late 2013: DH (2nd), IEM (2nd), MLG (3rd-4th), WCS Europe (5th-6th), top16 in WCS points (6th Protoss on that list) --> definitely top10 Protoss currently I know Nani's career as well as anyone, I'm questioning your assessment of Sora And don't get me wrong, as a Nanifan I love the fact that he'll play at Blizzcon so I'm not saying Id rather want someone else in his stead, but I still have to question whether he has ever been in the top 3 for more than a brief period.
I have no clue about Sora. He has won something or so from what I heard. Nothing major. I have no clue why this guy is so hyped these days. Surely not from his results.
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Russian Federation40190 Posts
On November 06 2013 23:39 Big J wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2013 23:33 Zealously wrote:On November 06 2013 23:23 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 22:46 Zealously wrote:On November 06 2013 06:25 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 05:14 lolfail9001 wrote:On November 06 2013 05:10 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 01:14 Jealous wrote:
I would rather have an all-Korean tournament - skill level is simply higher. Felt the need to quote this. Yeah, replace Naniwa with Sora. lol Naniwa: consistently top10 Protoss in the world since 2011 (and breaking into the top3 during his best times) Sora: got a decent place (?) in some tournament once I'm sorry, what Early 2011: second place in TSL3, wins MLG Dallas --> surely top10 Protoss worldwide Late 2011: Code A, can't qualify for Code S; 2nd place at MLG Providence, 4th place at Blizzcon; since there are only 5 Protoss players in Code S at the end of 2011, argueable that he is top10 Early 2012: 3 Code S seasons in a row; in two of those he reaches the Ro8 (no other Protoss reaches top8 in both of those seasons) --> probably top3 end of 2012/very early 2013: Not top10 mid-late 2013: DH (2nd), IEM (2nd), MLG (3rd-4th), WCS Europe (5th-6th), top16 in WCS points (6th Protoss on that list) --> definitely top10 Protoss currently I know Nani's career as well as anyone, I'm questioning your assessment of Sora And don't get me wrong, as a Nanifan I love the fact that he'll play at Blizzcon so I'm not saying Id rather want someone else in his stead, but I still have to question whether he has ever been in the top 3 for more than a brief period. I have no clue about Sora. He has won something or so from what I heard. Nothing major. I have no clue why this guy is so hyped these days. Surely not from his results.
14-0 win streak against Bomber, Fantasy, Soulkey, Curious, Gumiho, JKS and whoever else. There is a reason to hype him. And no, he played good solid macro style in pretty much all games i have happened to see from him in that streak.
Results only matter so much when you face easier players or players that greatly underestimate you to the point of doing something stupid.
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East Gorteau22261 Posts
On November 06 2013 23:36 doffe wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2013 23:33 Zealously wrote:On November 06 2013 23:23 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 22:46 Zealously wrote:On November 06 2013 06:25 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 05:14 lolfail9001 wrote:On November 06 2013 05:10 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 01:14 Jealous wrote:
I would rather have an all-Korean tournament - skill level is simply higher. Felt the need to quote this. Yeah, replace Naniwa with Sora. lol Naniwa: consistently top10 Protoss in the world since 2011 (and breaking into the top3 during his best times) Sora: got a decent place (?) in some tournament once I'm sorry, what Early 2011: second place in TSL3, wins MLG Dallas --> surely top10 Protoss worldwide Late 2011: Code A, can't qualify for Code S; 2nd place at MLG Providence, 4th place at Blizzcon; since there are only 5 Protoss players in Code S at the end of 2011, argueable that he is top10 Early 2012: 3 Code S seasons in a row; in two of those he reaches the Ro8 (no other Protoss reaches top8 in both of those seasons) --> probably top3 end of 2012/very early 2013: Not top10 mid-late 2013: DH (2nd), IEM (2nd), MLG (3rd-4th), WCS Europe (5th-6th), top16 in WCS points (6th Protoss on that list) --> definitely top10 Protoss currently I know Nani's career as well as anyone, I'm questioning your assessment of Sora And don't get me wrong, as a Nanifan I love the fact that he'll play at Blizzcon so I'm not saying Id rather want someone else in his stead, but I still have to question whether he has ever been in the top 3 for more than a brief period. Probably a very brief period. But let's stop with the who deserves it more. Naniwa has earned the points and he has i no way done so with easy opposition. Look at the tourneys he's played and who he had to beat. I'd say beating hack twice, Hyun, Jaedong, Innovation, Duckdeok, San and many more that I cant list of the top of my head gives him the right to be there.
Of course he deserves to be there more than the people that arent, no one could realistically say otherwiae with how the system works, but it's something else to say that he is better than everyone not attending because he is there. That's not necessarily the case.
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Russian Federation40190 Posts
On November 06 2013 23:45 Zealously wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2013 23:36 doffe wrote:On November 06 2013 23:33 Zealously wrote:On November 06 2013 23:23 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 22:46 Zealously wrote:On November 06 2013 06:25 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 05:14 lolfail9001 wrote:On November 06 2013 05:10 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 01:14 Jealous wrote:
I would rather have an all-Korean tournament - skill level is simply higher. Felt the need to quote this. Yeah, replace Naniwa with Sora. lol Naniwa: consistently top10 Protoss in the world since 2011 (and breaking into the top3 during his best times) Sora: got a decent place (?) in some tournament once I'm sorry, what Early 2011: second place in TSL3, wins MLG Dallas --> surely top10 Protoss worldwide Late 2011: Code A, can't qualify for Code S; 2nd place at MLG Providence, 4th place at Blizzcon; since there are only 5 Protoss players in Code S at the end of 2011, argueable that he is top10 Early 2012: 3 Code S seasons in a row; in two of those he reaches the Ro8 (no other Protoss reaches top8 in both of those seasons) --> probably top3 end of 2012/very early 2013: Not top10 mid-late 2013: DH (2nd), IEM (2nd), MLG (3rd-4th), WCS Europe (5th-6th), top16 in WCS points (6th Protoss on that list) --> definitely top10 Protoss currently I know Nani's career as well as anyone, I'm questioning your assessment of Sora And don't get me wrong, as a Nanifan I love the fact that he'll play at Blizzcon so I'm not saying Id rather want someone else in his stead, but I still have to question whether he has ever been in the top 3 for more than a brief period. Probably a very brief period. But let's stop with the who deserves it more. Naniwa has earned the points and he has i no way done so with easy opposition. Look at the tourneys he's played and who he had to beat. I'd say beating hack twice, Hyun, Jaedong, Innovation, Duckdeok, San and many more that I cant list of the top of my head gives him the right to be there. Of course he deserves to be there more than the people that arent, no one could realistically say otherwiae with how the system works, but it's something else to say that he is better than everyone not attending because he is there. That's not necessarily the case.
Pretty much this, he does deserve to be there, but he is most likely is not better than people not there (teehee, Rain, Trap, First, teehee)
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East Gorteau22261 Posts
On November 06 2013 23:39 Big J wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2013 23:33 Zealously wrote:On November 06 2013 23:23 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 22:46 Zealously wrote:On November 06 2013 06:25 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 05:14 lolfail9001 wrote:On November 06 2013 05:10 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 01:14 Jealous wrote:
I would rather have an all-Korean tournament - skill level is simply higher. Felt the need to quote this. Yeah, replace Naniwa with Sora. lol Naniwa: consistently top10 Protoss in the world since 2011 (and breaking into the top3 during his best times) Sora: got a decent place (?) in some tournament once I'm sorry, what Early 2011: second place in TSL3, wins MLG Dallas --> surely top10 Protoss worldwide Late 2011: Code A, can't qualify for Code S; 2nd place at MLG Providence, 4th place at Blizzcon; since there are only 5 Protoss players in Code S at the end of 2011, argueable that he is top10 Early 2012: 3 Code S seasons in a row; in two of those he reaches the Ro8 (no other Protoss reaches top8 in both of those seasons) --> probably top3 end of 2012/very early 2013: Not top10 mid-late 2013: DH (2nd), IEM (2nd), MLG (3rd-4th), WCS Europe (5th-6th), top16 in WCS points (6th Protoss on that list) --> definitely top10 Protoss currently I know Nani's career as well as anyone, I'm questioning your assessment of Sora And don't get me wrong, as a Nanifan I love the fact that he'll play at Blizzcon so I'm not saying Id rather want someone else in his stead, but I still have to question whether he has ever been in the top 3 for more than a brief period. I have no clue about Sora. He has won something or so from what I heard. Nothing major. I have no clue why this guy is so hyped these days. Surely not from his results.
this list is why
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On November 06 2013 23:54 Zealously wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2013 23:39 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 23:33 Zealously wrote:On November 06 2013 23:23 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 22:46 Zealously wrote:On November 06 2013 06:25 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 05:14 lolfail9001 wrote:On November 06 2013 05:10 Big J wrote:On November 06 2013 01:14 Jealous wrote:
I would rather have an all-Korean tournament - skill level is simply higher. Felt the need to quote this. Yeah, replace Naniwa with Sora. lol Naniwa: consistently top10 Protoss in the world since 2011 (and breaking into the top3 during his best times) Sora: got a decent place (?) in some tournament once I'm sorry, what Early 2011: second place in TSL3, wins MLG Dallas --> surely top10 Protoss worldwide Late 2011: Code A, can't qualify for Code S; 2nd place at MLG Providence, 4th place at Blizzcon; since there are only 5 Protoss players in Code S at the end of 2011, argueable that he is top10 Early 2012: 3 Code S seasons in a row; in two of those he reaches the Ro8 (no other Protoss reaches top8 in both of those seasons) --> probably top3 end of 2012/very early 2013: Not top10 mid-late 2013: DH (2nd), IEM (2nd), MLG (3rd-4th), WCS Europe (5th-6th), top16 in WCS points (6th Protoss on that list) --> definitely top10 Protoss currently I know Nani's career as well as anyone, I'm questioning your assessment of Sora And don't get me wrong, as a Nanifan I love the fact that he'll play at Blizzcon so I'm not saying Id rather want someone else in his stead, but I still have to question whether he has ever been in the top 3 for more than a brief period. I have no clue about Sora. He has won something or so from what I heard. Nothing major. I have no clue why this guy is so hyped these days. Surely not from his results. this list is why
Some nice results, not superimpressive, but may be a strong player in the time to come.
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watched VOD´s, looks to me like rivival got payed well to loose this games.
User was warned for this post
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On November 07 2013 00:21 tadL wrote:
watched VOD´s, looks to me like rivival got payed well to loose this games.
Uh huh. That makes a lot of sense.
"Here, have the 500 bucks I should've given to Taeja, but I didn't."
"But if I win, I get 5000 bucks and a chance to win more."
"Just take the money bro"
"Ok, Mr. Wa"
This makes infinite amounts of sense.
Or you could just accept that Revival played terribly and deserved to lose.
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EPT
