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Active: 1747 users

Balance patch this week - Hellbats nerfed, Banshees buffed…

Forum Index > SC2 General
1080 CommentsPost a Reply
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EFermi
Profile Joined May 2011
United States165 Posts
July 08 2013 18:54 GMT
#141
Don't like the banshee change. 100 gas is way too cheap for something that powerful.
GO herO, Bunny, JangBi, Savage, BaBy, Pigbaby, StarDust, RoRo, Flying and Soulkey
Aunvilgod
Profile Joined December 2011
2653 Posts
July 08 2013 18:55 GMT
#142
On July 09 2013 03:22 KawaiiRice wrote:
jesus christ not cloakshees........ would rather play vs hellbats


I think I speak for all people who are not high masters when I ask you to elaborate.
ilovegroov | Blizzards mapmaker(s?) suck ass | #1 Protoss hater
awesomoecalypse
Profile Joined August 2010
United States2235 Posts
July 08 2013 18:58 GMT
#143
Honestly, banshees got a major nerf with HotS because detection became much more common. Since I think they're a much cooler and more micro intensive unit then Hellbats, I'm all for this change, because it means we might actually see cloaked banshees again as something other than an occasional gimmick.
He drone drone drone. Me win. - ogsMC
Olli
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Austria24422 Posts
July 08 2013 19:00 GMT
#144
On July 09 2013 03:51 Topdoller wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2013 03:47 DarkLordOlli wrote:
I'm not sure about this. I feel like PvT might go back to the guessing game it was in beta - if terran takes a gas, they can do absolutely everything and if you guess wrong you die. But hey, we'll see how it plays out, I may be dead wrong. Definitely liking the hellbat change though, I hope it makes TvT a bit more stable.


I guess Protoss will need to go early Robo v Terran again, or use hallucination more often to scout for proxies


Well, the 1 gate into robo is the super standard way to play right now but in WoL for example there was a 3gate timing attack of one base that was designed to a) defend aggression and b) hit a teching terran hard. I remember Parting and HerO throwing it in the mix every now and then to not get predictable in the way they dealt with one base terran. I'm not sure if it's viable in HotS (probably not due to widow mine drops being so popular) but the banshee change alone for example would kill that.
Basically the point I'm trying to make is it might restrict protoss to predictable standard play (1 gate robo) too much which in turn can be exploited by crazy builds. This is all theorycrafting though so don't take this as how I think it will play out.
Administrator"Declaring anything a disaster because aLive popped up out of nowhere is just downright silly."
Rhaegal
Profile Blog Joined July 2013
United States678 Posts
July 08 2013 19:00 GMT
#145
On July 09 2013 03:54 Wingblade wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2013 03:45 Rhaegal wrote:
Terran had lowest winrate in May, and despite what they say, this is a nerf to every matchup, and banshees were shit vs P and Z for reasons other than the cloak cost.


This will just make TvT an early game cluster fuck, and have minimal effect vs P or Z.

Now Hellbats will be a hassle just to make vs early chargelot compositions, if you don't get the upgrade they are worthless. So what's our option? A banshee that can be nullified by nexus cannon? Awesome! good job blizzard, yet again. You guys buffed Queens when the matchup was 50/50, now you nerf Terran when they are performing the worst of all races. Keep up the good work guys!


My meme got deleted, but the idea is the same. Terran had the HIGHEST winrate in May. Not sure what you are looking at.

http://aligulac.com/reports/


I meant June. And aligulac is quite horrid and not accepted by anyone. TLPD is much more accurate.
http://www.twitch.tv/agonysc
b0ub0u
Profile Joined September 2009
Canada445 Posts
July 08 2013 19:01 GMT
#146
lol @ people saying Hellbats were not an issue in TvZ. Maybe at high level but not everyone play pro. I am only diamond but I find it very difficult to deal with burst and splash damage from Hellbats or even Widow Mines.

They come very early and if we are not on top of things we loose workers and mining time.

Terrans were given 2 units that come very early and can completely change an engagement if we are not careful.
In the swarm we trust
Cheeseling
Profile Joined March 2012
Ukraine132 Posts
July 08 2013 19:01 GMT
#147
100/100 upgrade cost sounds reasonable. Paying 200/200 to make opponent build couple of extra turrets or spores wich costs only minerals...
Taefox
Profile Joined March 2010
1533 Posts
July 08 2013 19:01 GMT
#148
Nice change, I'm frustrated of every TvT have to deal against hellbat drop
@taefoxy
Aunvilgod
Profile Joined December 2011
2653 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-08 19:03:16
July 08 2013 19:02 GMT
#149
On July 09 2013 03:54 Wingblade wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2013 03:45 Rhaegal wrote:
Terran had lowest winrate in May, and despite what they say, this is a nerf to every matchup, and banshees were shit vs P and Z for reasons other than the cloak cost.


This will just make TvT an early game cluster fuck, and have minimal effect vs P or Z.

Now Hellbats will be a hassle just to make vs early chargelot compositions, if you don't get the upgrade they are worthless. So what's our option? A banshee that can be nullified by nexus cannon? Awesome! good job blizzard, yet again. You guys buffed Queens when the matchup was 50/50, now you nerf Terran when they are performing the worst of all races. Keep up the good work guys!


My meme got deleted, but the idea is the same. Terran had the HIGHEST winrate in May. Not sure what you are looking at.

http://aligulac.com/reports/


That counts foreign results as well. Can be disregarded.

On July 09 2013 04:01 b0ub0u wrote:
lol @ people saying Hellbats were not an issue in TvZ. Maybe at high level but not everyone play pro. I am only diamond but I find it very difficult to deal with burst and splash damage from Hellbats or even Widow Mines.

They come very early and if we are not on top of things we loose workers and mining time.

Terrans were given 2 units that come very early and can completely change an engagement if we are not careful.


The game cannot be balanced around two levels of play at once. Not possible.
ilovegroov | Blizzards mapmaker(s?) suck ass | #1 Protoss hater
Wingblade
Profile Joined April 2012
United States1806 Posts
July 08 2013 19:02 GMT
#150
On July 09 2013 04:00 Rhaegal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2013 03:54 Wingblade wrote:
On July 09 2013 03:45 Rhaegal wrote:
Terran had lowest winrate in May, and despite what they say, this is a nerf to every matchup, and banshees were shit vs P and Z for reasons other than the cloak cost.


This will just make TvT an early game cluster fuck, and have minimal effect vs P or Z.

Now Hellbats will be a hassle just to make vs early chargelot compositions, if you don't get the upgrade they are worthless. So what's our option? A banshee that can be nullified by nexus cannon? Awesome! good job blizzard, yet again. You guys buffed Queens when the matchup was 50/50, now you nerf Terran when they are performing the worst of all races. Keep up the good work guys!


My meme got deleted, but the idea is the same. Terran had the HIGHEST winrate in May. Not sure what you are looking at.

http://aligulac.com/reports/


I meant June. And aligulac is quite horrid and not accepted by anyone. TLPD is much more accurate.


Where are TLPD's statistics then? I haven't seen them. And on what basis is Aligulac horrid and not accepted? Because it doesn't support your viewpoint?
PartinG fanboy to the max, Rain/Squirtle/Dear/Scarlett/Bbyong are cool too. I don't always watch Dota2 but when I do I have no clue what's going on. GOGO POWER RANGERS
Zoku
Profile Joined November 2010
307 Posts
July 08 2013 19:03 GMT
#151
On July 09 2013 03:55 Aunvilgod wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2013 03:22 KawaiiRice wrote:
jesus christ not cloakshees........ would rather play vs hellbats


I think I speak for all people who are not high masters when I ask you to elaborate.


Most likely a preference thing for Kawaiirice, but the idea is, in the same way that the hellbat made TvT kinda stupid, the banshee buff will do the same thing.
Aunvilgod
Profile Joined December 2011
2653 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-08 19:04:45
July 08 2013 19:04 GMT
#152
On July 09 2013 04:03 Zoku wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2013 03:55 Aunvilgod wrote:
On July 09 2013 03:22 KawaiiRice wrote:
jesus christ not cloakshees........ would rather play vs hellbats


I think I speak for all people who are not high masters when I ask you to elaborate.


Most likely a preference thing for Kawaiirice, but the idea is, in the same way that the hellbat made TvT kinda stupid, the banshee buff will do the same thing.


Not so sure. Banshees do much less terrible, terrible damage. Or can be shut down so much easier if you will. A turret in each mineral line won't stop hellbats but surely will stop Banshees.
ilovegroov | Blizzards mapmaker(s?) suck ass | #1 Protoss hater
Qwerty85
Profile Joined June 2012
Croatia5536 Posts
July 08 2013 19:04 GMT
#153
On July 09 2013 04:01 b0ub0u wrote:
lol @ people saying Hellbats were not an issue in TvZ. Maybe at high level but not everyone play pro. I am only diamond but I find it very difficult to deal with burst and splash damage from Hellbats or even Widow Mines.

They come very early and if we are not on top of things we loose workers and mining time.

Terrans were given 2 units that come very early and can completely change an engagement if we are not careful.


Not much different from terran getting his army stormed or fungaled without babysitting. All races have its moments of unforgivingness. Game is always balanced around high level of play. Blizzard sometimes helps us lower league players but in most cases if you see fungal you need to react in time to dodge it. If you see a widow mine - same thing.
awesomoecalypse
Profile Joined August 2010
United States2235 Posts
July 08 2013 19:05 GMT
#154
I meant June. And aligulac is quite horrid and not accepted by anyone. TLPD is much more accurate.


TLPD current top five:
Sen
Stephano
Socke
M00nGLade
Nerchio

Aligulac current top five:
INoVation
Life
MVP
Polt
Hyun

Anyone who "accepts" that TLPD is somehow more accurate is probably on meth. Does anyone on earth really believe that if the TLPD top 5 played the Aligulac top 5 that they wouldn't be utterly stomped? Because if so, I've got this awesome bridge for sale.
He drone drone drone. Me win. - ogsMC
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
July 08 2013 19:05 GMT
#155
On July 09 2013 04:02 Wingblade wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2013 04:00 Rhaegal wrote:
On July 09 2013 03:54 Wingblade wrote:
On July 09 2013 03:45 Rhaegal wrote:
Terran had lowest winrate in May, and despite what they say, this is a nerf to every matchup, and banshees were shit vs P and Z for reasons other than the cloak cost.


This will just make TvT an early game cluster fuck, and have minimal effect vs P or Z.

Now Hellbats will be a hassle just to make vs early chargelot compositions, if you don't get the upgrade they are worthless. So what's our option? A banshee that can be nullified by nexus cannon? Awesome! good job blizzard, yet again. You guys buffed Queens when the matchup was 50/50, now you nerf Terran when they are performing the worst of all races. Keep up the good work guys!


My meme got deleted, but the idea is the same. Terran had the HIGHEST winrate in May. Not sure what you are looking at.

http://aligulac.com/reports/


I meant June. And aligulac is quite horrid and not accepted by anyone. TLPD is much more accurate.


Where are TLPD's statistics then? I haven't seen them. And on what basis is Aligulac horrid and not accepted? Because it doesn't support your viewpoint?

That is how all statistics are validated on TL, by who's view they support. Where have you been?
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Qwerty85
Profile Joined June 2012
Croatia5536 Posts
July 08 2013 19:05 GMT
#156
On July 09 2013 04:03 Zoku wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2013 03:55 Aunvilgod wrote:
On July 09 2013 03:22 KawaiiRice wrote:
jesus christ not cloakshees........ would rather play vs hellbats


I think I speak for all people who are not high masters when I ask you to elaborate.


Most likely a preference thing for Kawaiirice, but the idea is, in the same way that the hellbat made TvT kinda stupid, the banshee buff will do the same thing.


Banshees require much more micro, they get shut down easier, are heavier investment and don't deal such a huge damage in seconds.
See.Blue
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
United States2673 Posts
July 08 2013 19:06 GMT
#157
Would much rather see a tank buff, but still nice changes.
aZealot
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
New Zealand5447 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-08 19:08:16
July 08 2013 19:08 GMT
#158
Good change. The HB nerf and the way it's done makes sense. The Banshee buff is a light one. Kudos, Blizzard!
KT best KT ~ 2014
TiTanIum_
Profile Joined August 2011
Brazil1335 Posts
July 08 2013 19:08 GMT
#159
3 port banshee, new meta.
Wingblade
Profile Joined April 2012
United States1806 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-08 19:08:52
July 08 2013 19:08 GMT
#160
On July 09 2013 04:05 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 09 2013 04:02 Wingblade wrote:
On July 09 2013 04:00 Rhaegal wrote:
On July 09 2013 03:54 Wingblade wrote:
On July 09 2013 03:45 Rhaegal wrote:
Terran had lowest winrate in May, and despite what they say, this is a nerf to every matchup, and banshees were shit vs P and Z for reasons other than the cloak cost.


This will just make TvT an early game cluster fuck, and have minimal effect vs P or Z.

Now Hellbats will be a hassle just to make vs early chargelot compositions, if you don't get the upgrade they are worthless. So what's our option? A banshee that can be nullified by nexus cannon? Awesome! good job blizzard, yet again. You guys buffed Queens when the matchup was 50/50, now you nerf Terran when they are performing the worst of all races. Keep up the good work guys!


My meme got deleted, but the idea is the same. Terran had the HIGHEST winrate in May. Not sure what you are looking at.

http://aligulac.com/reports/


I meant June. And aligulac is quite horrid and not accepted by anyone. TLPD is much more accurate.


Where are TLPD's statistics then? I haven't seen them. And on what basis is Aligulac horrid and not accepted? Because it doesn't support your viewpoint?

That is how all statistics are validated on TL, by who's view they support. Where have you been?


I had suspected as much. I just didn't expect that much bias, I thought TL was way better than that. The worst part is he is using "statistics" that he has yet to even cite.
PartinG fanboy to the max, Rain/Squirtle/Dear/Scarlett/Bbyong are cool too. I don't always watch Dota2 but when I do I have no clue what's going on. GOGO POWER RANGERS
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