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David Kim comments on Hellbat drops - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
934 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 45 46 47 Next All
Mahanaim
Profile Joined December 2012
Korea (South)1002 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-11 02:19:15
June 11 2013 02:19 GMT
#21
Completely agree.
Dayvie knows stuff guys.
Celebrating Starcraft since... a long time ago.
snakeeyez
Profile Joined May 2011
United States1231 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-11 02:21:05
June 11 2013 02:19 GMT
#22
I think innovation did hellbat drops every single match in tvt. The metagame is all about HPM for hellbats per minute.
Whitewing
Profile Joined October 2010
United States7483 Posts
June 11 2013 02:21 GMT
#23
I honestly think they should do that AND remove the bio tag from it, they do damage in drops too fast and tank damage too well (plus it makes no sense).

That said, it's definitely a step in the right direction.
Strategy"You know I fucking hate the way you play, right?" ~SC2John
Gamegene
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States8308 Posts
June 11 2013 02:21 GMT
#24
hellbats ruined the balance of TvT.

not necessarily game balance, but the traditional idea that the better player always wins. i really hope they make the matchup fun to play again :/
Throw on your favorite jacket and you're good to roll. Stroll through the trees and let your miseries go.
Integra
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
Sweden5626 Posts
June 11 2013 02:26 GMT
#25
TvT is really stale at the moment since the one who has the highest Hellbat drop per minute is the one who wins. The other matchups are not as bad but it gets really boring playing vs Terran who does only this over and over again.
"Dark Pleasure" | | I survived the Locust war of May 3, 2014
jellyjello
Profile Joined March 2011
Korea (South)664 Posts
June 11 2013 02:27 GMT
#26
Make it so that only hellions can be made from the factory, and hellbats can only be acquired by transforming hellions.
theMagus
Profile Joined February 2013
578 Posts
June 11 2013 02:29 GMT
#27
On June 11 2013 11:13 Wildmoon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 11 2013 10:56 jcroisdale wrote:
Something there not even considering is there late game utility. TvP when the terran goes mech, is so much stronger, because the hellbat is such an efficient harassment unit.

The early game attacks are hard, but late game is just as difficult.


I don't think mech in TvP is not in anyway strong in general.


how i wish mech would be great vs protoss. that's gonna fucking rock.
"Give away the stone. Let the oceans take and transmutate this cold and fated anchor. Let the waters kiss and transmutate these leaden grudges into gold. Let go."
purakushi
Profile Joined August 2012
United States3302 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-11 02:34:35
June 11 2013 02:33 GMT
#28
It is not about it being too strong necessarily. It is just silly, and the tweaking the damage does not change that.
T P Z sagi
geokilla
Profile Joined May 2011
Canada8247 Posts
June 11 2013 02:38 GMT
#29
WCS Season 1 is over and David Kim still wants to wait it out after watching how much damage the Hellbat drops do? This has been a problem since HOTS beta and has continued to been one. I got Hellbat dropped today and I didn't even bother going back home to defend my SCVs because I knew I would be too far behind. I just pushed into my opponent's natural and hoped for the best.

Honestly speaking, I think Hellbat drops are viable against all races right now. Just open with Hellbat drops and you're pretty much guaranteed to kill roughly a dozen workers if your opponent doesn't pull SCVs quick enough, whether they are playing Protoss, Zerg, or Terran.
aksfjh
Profile Joined November 2010
United States4853 Posts
June 11 2013 02:38 GMT
#30
On June 11 2013 11:21 Whitewing wrote:
I honestly think they should do that AND remove the bio tag from it, they do damage in drops too fast and tank damage too well (plus it makes no sense).

That said, it's definitely a step in the right direction.

While the bio tag was controversial in the beta, it turned out to be one of the things that brought them from crap to usefulness. There is a fine line for that distinction with the unit, so being cautious is the correct move.
FinalForm
Profile Joined August 2010
United States450 Posts
June 11 2013 02:38 GMT
#31
goddammit innovation
Whatson
Profile Blog Joined January 2012
United States5357 Posts
June 11 2013 02:39 GMT
#32
Hopefully they find some way to nerf it so that it's still a viable option in non-mirrors
¯\_(シ)_/¯
plogamer
Profile Blog Joined January 2012
Canada3132 Posts
June 11 2013 02:41 GMT
#33
They should not nerf the damage. If the problem is drops, then nerf drops.
Chewbacca.
Profile Joined January 2011
United States3634 Posts
June 11 2013 02:48 GMT
#34
On June 11 2013 10:52 SoOJuuu wrote:
took them long enough to figuire it out.
sigh
better late then never.


People bitch when they make changes too quickly instead of letting the game evolve, and then people bitch when they let things play out for a bit.

Blizzard's chances of ever winning in the eyes of the community --> 0
bittman
Profile Joined February 2011
Australia8759 Posts
June 11 2013 02:49 GMT
#35
On June 11 2013 11:41 plogamer wrote:
They should not nerf the damage. If the problem is drops, then nerf drops.


I think David Kim seems to be leaning towards the fact that the problem isn't so much just hellbat drops in general, but rather perhaps the early timing of the hellbat drops.

Solutions may include
- Increased build time
- Upgrade requirements (on medivac speed boost or hellbat transform again) to delay the timing on drops.
- Maybe an increased cost for hellbats? Not as sure on this one.

I'd also prefer that they didn't mess with the damage, but rather how easy it is to access the hellbat drop. I'd prefer them to play with the numbers around the drop itself, as you suggested.
Mvp - Leenock - Dongraegu - MC - Gumiho - Keen - Polt - Squirtle - Jjakji - Genius - Seed - Life - sC - Dream || LG-IM - MVP - FXO
Thrillz
Profile Joined May 2012
4313 Posts
June 11 2013 02:51 GMT
#36
On June 11 2013 11:49 bittman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 11 2013 11:41 plogamer wrote:
They should not nerf the damage. If the problem is drops, then nerf drops.


I think David Kim seems to be leaning towards the fact that the problem isn't so much just hellbat drops in general, but rather perhaps the early timing of the hellbat drops.

Solutions may include
- Increased build time
- Upgrade requirements (on medivac speed boost or hellbat transform again) to delay the timing on drops.
- Maybe an increased cost for hellbats? Not as sure on this one.

I'd also prefer that they didn't mess with the damage, but rather how easy it is to access the hellbat drop. I'd prefer them to play with the numbers around the drop itself, as you suggested.


They would never touch speed boost, most likely it'll be damage nerf with reintroduction of BF upgrade.
HonorZ
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
France858 Posts
June 11 2013 02:54 GMT
#37
On June 11 2013 10:50 Dark.EX wrote:
Show nested quote +
We're looking into it.

Obviously we'd like to see how they turn out in the coming weeks, but initially we're thinking:

1. Too easy to execute
2. Especially in TvT, not a lot of risk to doing them (when you don't lose the Medivac)
3. Might be too early before defenses can be ready

Rather than jumping to conclusions right now, we'll keep a close eye on it and if in fact Hellbat drops do turn out too strong, we'll do something like rolling in some of their damage with the Infernal Pre igniter upgrade.

http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/9280218214?page=1

Personally, I completely agree with their stance.


I really really like the Pre Igniter Upgrade. This would make the upgrade really relevant. Lets have the normal HB shitty damage, and with the upgrade the current damages. Make the upgrade cheap, but long to research. Also, maybe reduce the health of the HB a little, but keeping the healing.
"If you don't drop sweat today you'll drop tears tomorrow"
HolyArrow
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7116 Posts
June 11 2013 02:55 GMT
#38
On June 11 2013 11:48 Chewbacca. wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 11 2013 10:52 SoOJuuu wrote:
took them long enough to figuire it out.
sigh
better late then never.


People bitch when they make changes too quickly instead of letting the game evolve, and then people bitch when they let things play out for a bit.

Blizzard's chances of ever winning in the eyes of the community --> 0


Since the community is full of people with different opinions, that should be obvious.
Scarecrow
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Korea (South)9174 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-11 02:59:39
June 11 2013 02:58 GMT
#39
On June 11 2013 10:56 jcroisdale wrote:
Something there not even considering is there late game utility. TvP when the terran goes mech, is so much stronger, because the hellbat is such an efficient harassment unit.

TvP mech is still a joke and unviable, no idea why you mentioned it. The main problem with hellbat drops is what it's done to TvT. Making hellbats mechanical rather than bio (so no healing) would be a decent fix.
Yhamm is the god of predictions
shin_toss
Profile Joined May 2010
Philippines2589 Posts
June 11 2013 02:59 GMT
#40
make the cargo size 8
AKMU / IU
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