• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 10:47
CET 16:47
KST 00:47
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners11Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros10[ASL20] Finals Preview: Arrival13TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting12
Community News
[TLMC] Fall/Winter 2025 Ladder Map Rotation10Weekly Cups (Nov 3-9): Clem Conquers in Canada4SC: Evo Complete - Ranked Ladder OPEN ALPHA8StarCraft, SC2, HotS, WC3, Returning to Blizzcon!45$5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship7
StarCraft 2
General
RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview Mech is the composition that needs teleportation t [TLMC] Fall/Winter 2025 Ladder Map Rotation Weekly Cups (Nov 3-9): Clem Conquers in Canada Craziest Micro Moments Of All Time?
Tourneys
Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL Revival: Season 3 Constellation Cup - Main Event - Stellar Fest Tenacious Turtle Tussle Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2)
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 499 Chilling Adaptation Mutation # 498 Wheel of Misfortune|Cradle of Death Mutation # 497 Battle Haredened Mutation # 496 Endless Infection
Brood War
General
FlaSh on: Biggest Problem With SnOw's Playstyle What happened to TvZ on Retro? BW General Discussion Brood War web app to calculate unit interactions [ASL20] Ask the mapmakers — Drop your questions
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0 [BSL21] RO32 Group D - Sunday 21:00 CET [BSL21] RO32 Group C - Saturday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Current Meta Simple Questions, Simple Answers PvZ map balance How to stay on top of macro?
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Clair Obscur - Expedition 33 Beyond All Reason Should offensive tower rushing be viable in RTS games?
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Artificial Intelligence Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! Korean Music Discussion Series you have seen recently...
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NBA General Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Dyadica Gospel – a Pulp No…
Hildegard
Coffee x Performance in Espo…
TrAiDoS
Saturation point
Uldridge
DnB/metal remix FFO Mick Go…
ImbaTosS
Reality "theory" prov…
perfectspheres
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1751 users

Call to Action: May 2 Balance Testing - Page 20

Forum Index > SC2 General
640 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 18 19 20 21 22 33 Next All
Holo82
Profile Joined April 2013
Austria107 Posts
May 03 2013 12:02 GMT
#381
On May 03 2013 20:50 syno wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 03 2013 20:47 scypio wrote:
On May 03 2013 20:37 FrozenProbe wrote:
it's not coinflippy, if you use a reaper and don't understand the proxy oracle you should just quit the game because is not for you, and with the early gas you can just do the standard mine drops that's pretty good.

Everyone is using the reaper in TvP, just update your build orders to hots.


Yeah, they use the reaper and die to mcs/stalker(+blink) attacks. I do enjoy the game and I will continue to play, thank you.

I have no idea why are you so vile, perhaps you should take a walk or something.

So you're saying if i see that T has a Reaper, all i have to do is a msc + blink stalker attack to win?

You should post that in the strategy section.



Actually if u do reaper expand as terran, u will not exactly die to ,but loose like 5 -10 workers and all marines u have, if the loveley toss decides to chronoboost a zealot, a stalker, and a msc and move out with this force. The reaper means that 2-3 marines less exists, and you will at the very least get two free supply depots + potential addon from the rax.

If the terran doesnt manage to get rid of the stalker by surrounding it with scvs, and finishing the bunker,
he looses the game like 100 % in the first 5 minutes, if the toss comes to the great idea of building a second and a third stalker (with no warpgate, just build and walk into the terrans base, and snipe the poor marines that come out of the rax one by one :D).

Actually i just saw a game in gstl, where a cc first build was killed off by a probe scout... (one probe made the terran use 5 scvs and loose one in the action of defending. the toss than did triple expand, and killed the terran after 12 minutes or so, but he could have just build a couple of stalkers and run up too).
GGDeMoN
Profile Joined April 2011
109 Posts
May 03 2013 12:03 GMT
#382
Personally i think terran should be able to build missile turrets without the use of an ebay, its exactly the same as it was for zerg in wol, they couldnt afford a evo chamber as early as DT's come in etc so they make it that they can use spores without the evo, this should be the same for terran imo as getting a ebay at like 5:30 with a gas opener just dosent work out to fit everything else you need, and you cant even tell wtf toss are doing these days.. you scout a robo and all of a sudden DT's or oracles are coming in your base.. seriously...?
FrozenProbe
Profile Joined March 2012
Italy276 Posts
May 03 2013 12:07 GMT
#383
It's just impossible to talk about balance with terran players.
GGDeMoN
Profile Joined April 2011
109 Posts
May 03 2013 12:10 GMT
#384
its exactly the same with the others races.
ETisME
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
12517 Posts
May 03 2013 12:11 GMT
#385
On May 03 2013 20:37 FrozenProbe wrote:
it's not coinflippy, if you use a reaper and don't understand the proxy oracle you should just quit the game because is not for you, and with the early gas you can just do the standard mine drops that's pretty good.

Everyone is using the reaper in TvP, just update your build orders to hots.

that's a terrible argument. Don't resort to personal attack when you don't have anything to back up your arguments.
why not tell us how would you respond if you are the terran after doing the reaper opening?
其疾如风,其徐如林,侵掠如火,不动如山,难知如阴,动如雷震。
Sakkreth
Profile Joined February 2011
Lithuania1096 Posts
May 03 2013 12:11 GMT
#386
On May 03 2013 21:03 GGDeMoN wrote:
Personally i think terran should be able to build missile turrets without the use of an ebay, its exactly the same as it was for zerg in wol, they couldnt afford a evo chamber as early as DT's come in etc so they make it that they can use spores without the evo, this should be the same for terran imo as getting a ebay at like 5:30 with a gas opener just dosent work out to fit everything else you need, and you cant even tell wtf toss are doing these days.. you scout a robo and all of a sudden DT's or oracles are coming in your base.. seriously...?


As protoss u scout incoming drop, position ur units inside mineral line and still take damage... seriously... ?
WhiteRa, NaNiWa, Creator, sOs, Krr, ForGG, MMA, Zest ||
scypio
Profile Joined December 2011
Poland2127 Posts
May 03 2013 12:15 GMT
#387
On May 03 2013 21:07 FrozenProbe wrote:
It's just impossible to talk about balance with terran players.


Hey I'm random
I play random | I like Hots | INnoVation | sOs | Tefel TOP1!
TheDwf
Profile Joined November 2011
France19747 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-03 12:19:55
May 03 2013 12:17 GMT
#388
On May 03 2013 21:02 Holo82 wrote:
Actually if u do reaper expand as terran, u will not exactly die to ,but loose like 5 -10 workers and all marines u have, if the loveley toss decides to chronoboost a zealot, a stalker, and a msc and move out with this force. The reaper means that 2-3 marines less exists, and you will at the very least get two free supply depots + potential addon from the rax.

? No. Reaper reactor expand is safe against pokes, one Bunker highground is enough to stop this and the Reaper can even kill the Zealot coming across the map. Walls are not mandatory, and actually skipping them at the beginning of the game is probably better.
GGDeMoN
Profile Joined April 2011
109 Posts
May 03 2013 12:17 GMT
#389
On May 03 2013 21:11 Sakkreth wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 03 2013 21:03 GGDeMoN wrote:
Personally i think terran should be able to build missile turrets without the use of an ebay, its exactly the same as it was for zerg in wol, they couldnt afford a evo chamber as early as DT's come in etc so they make it that they can use spores without the evo, this should be the same for terran imo as getting a ebay at like 5:30 with a gas opener just dosent work out to fit everything else you need, and you cant even tell wtf toss are doing these days.. you scout a robo and all of a sudden DT's or oracles are coming in your base.. seriously...?


As protoss u scout incoming drop, position ur units inside mineral line and still take damage... seriously... ?


well then your terrible, if you scout a mine drop you shud lose 1-2 probes MAX and then kill the 2 mines and maybe even the medivac.
Deleted User 137586
Profile Joined January 2011
7859 Posts
May 03 2013 12:17 GMT
#390
On May 03 2013 21:07 FrozenProbe wrote:
It's just impossible to talk about balance with terran players.


Or you said silly things and people pointed them out to you. Your call, really.
Cry 'havoc' and let slip the dogs of war
Lukeeze[zR]
Profile Joined February 2006
Switzerland6838 Posts
May 03 2013 12:24 GMT
#391
David kim and his "careful" approach :D
Terran & Potato Salad.
Xequecal
Profile Joined October 2010
United States473 Posts
May 03 2013 12:30 GMT
#392
On May 03 2013 19:53 Snowbear wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 03 2013 19:51 murphs wrote:
They can make the oracle move at 100 speed, it still only takes 1 missile turret to be immune. Oh and you get immunity to DTs too.

Terran players really are pathetic.


Then I request a banshee at 100 speed, since it only takes 1 turret, 1 spore and 1 cannon to be immune.


6 range vs. 4 range. A single colony/cannon/turret cannot cover a mineral line from a banshee, it can from an oracle.
monsta
Profile Joined November 2012
172 Posts
May 03 2013 12:33 GMT
#393
why no fungal buff against air units?? (fungal should 3shot a muta) would make ling infestor available in ZvZ but would allow to play ling muta bane.. and this buff woud help the zergs against skytoss (i think skytoss isnt op but kinda to ez to play);
ZenithM
Profile Joined February 2011
France15952 Posts
May 03 2013 12:33 GMT
#394
On May 03 2013 21:07 FrozenProbe wrote:
It's just impossible to talk about balance with terran players.

You're the only one in this thread making a big deal out of this, haha. Some anti-Terran shit got buffed, Terran players are not happy, deal with it...
MattD
Profile Joined March 2013
United Kingdom83 Posts
May 03 2013 12:34 GMT
#395
my experiance as high master/low gm zerg player the main problems seem to be

zvz - mutas
zvp - mutas too strong
zvp - protoss sitting behind 3 bases and massing voids is a viable strategy / void ray is too strong or zerg anti air is too crap whichever you want to cut it. (not saying you can;t beat it, just saying its tedious as fuck)
zvt - hellbats being healed by medivacs

i cant speak of the other matchups but i've heard and seen hellbats being strong in tvt
Holo82
Profile Joined April 2013
Austria107 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-03 12:43:06
May 03 2013 12:40 GMT
#396
On May 03 2013 21:17 TheDwf wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 03 2013 21:02 Holo82 wrote:
Actually if u do reaper expand as terran, u will not exactly die to ,but loose like 5 -10 workers and all marines u have, if the loveley toss decides to chronoboost a zealot, a stalker, and a msc and move out with this force. The reaper means that 2-3 marines less exists, and you will at the very least get two free supply depots + potential addon from the rax.

? No. Reaper reactor expand is safe against pokes, one Bunker highground is enough to stop this and the Reaper can even kill the Zealot coming across the map. Walls are not mandatory, and actually skipping them at the beginning of the game is probably better.


Do you really build a highground bunker after reaper expanding? And how do you get the potential zealot, do you scout with scv before the reaper? that makes the whole idea of building a reaper obsolete imo.
ACrow
Profile Joined October 2011
Germany6583 Posts
May 03 2013 12:46 GMT
#397
On May 03 2013 21:33 monsta wrote:
why no fungal buff against air units?? (fungal should 3shot a muta) would make ling infestor available in ZvZ but would allow to play ling muta bane.. and this buff woud help the zergs against skytoss (i think skytoss isnt op but kinda to ez to play);

The problem with fungal against muta is not that it's too weak if you hit, it's actually hitting it (due to projectile and mutas being FAST). You could change this by either making mutas slower (taking speed or acceleration away) or by making fungal projectile speed faster or by returing, heaven forbid, instant fungal. All these options take away micro, which is not good, and the last two option incur the risk of returning the dreaded mass infestor in the non Z matchups. If you have a different idea for a fungal buff that deals with mutas but that also doesn't make infestor a massable unit again, I'm sure many people are all ears.
Get off my lawn, young punks
syno
Profile Joined March 2011
Switzerland150 Posts
May 03 2013 12:48 GMT
#398
On May 03 2013 21:40 Holo82 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 03 2013 21:17 TheDwf wrote:
On May 03 2013 21:02 Holo82 wrote:
Actually if u do reaper expand as terran, u will not exactly die to ,but loose like 5 -10 workers and all marines u have, if the loveley toss decides to chronoboost a zealot, a stalker, and a msc and move out with this force. The reaper means that 2-3 marines less exists, and you will at the very least get two free supply depots + potential addon from the rax.

? No. Reaper reactor expand is safe against pokes, one Bunker highground is enough to stop this and the Reaper can even kill the Zealot coming across the map. Walls are not mandatory, and actually skipping them at the beginning of the game is probably better.


Do you really build a highground bunker after reaper expanding? And how do you get the potential zealot, do you scout with scv before the reaper? that makes the whole idea of building a reaper obsolete imo.

Because 1 early scout is enough, right?
Good Brain
ACrow
Profile Joined October 2011
Germany6583 Posts
May 03 2013 12:50 GMT
#399
On May 03 2013 21:40 Holo82 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 03 2013 21:17 TheDwf wrote:
On May 03 2013 21:02 Holo82 wrote:
Actually if u do reaper expand as terran, u will not exactly die to ,but loose like 5 -10 workers and all marines u have, if the loveley toss decides to chronoboost a zealot, a stalker, and a msc and move out with this force. The reaper means that 2-3 marines less exists, and you will at the very least get two free supply depots + potential addon from the rax.

? No. Reaper reactor expand is safe against pokes, one Bunker highground is enough to stop this and the Reaper can even kill the Zealot coming across the map. Walls are not mandatory, and actually skipping them at the beginning of the game is probably better.


Do you really build a highground bunker after reaper expanding? And how do you get the potential zealot, do you scout with scv before the reaper? that makes the whole idea of building a reaper obsolete imo.

The buty of a reaper expand is that you have basically perfect early game scouting, and on most maps (maybe even all in the current pool? a good Terran sure can comment) it is sufficient to start building the high ground bunker after you scouted the signs for an early poke with your reaper.
Get off my lawn, young punks
ZenithM
Profile Joined February 2011
France15952 Posts
May 03 2013 12:55 GMT
#400
I admit that as a Terran, I would trade our Banshee for this buffed Oracle :D
And I like banshees, and it's not often that I think other races' units are better.
Prev 1 18 19 20 21 22 33 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
WardiTV Korean Royale
12:00
Group Stage - Group A, Day 2
WardiTV900
TKL 264
Rex121
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
TKL 264
Rex 121
SteadfastSC 61
BRAT_OK 29
MindelVK 19
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 42968
Calm 3968
Rain 3769
Horang2 1245
Bisu 716
firebathero 463
Soma 252
Flash 245
Snow 178
Zeus 160
[ Show more ]
BeSt 96
Hyun 77
Soulkey 77
hero 73
Rush 70
Killer 54
Mind 48
sas.Sziky 45
Hyuk 33
Barracks 20
TY 17
Free 16
Terrorterran 14
Movie 13
Bale 10
Shine 10
JulyZerg 6
Dota 2
singsing4465
qojqva2857
Dendi1304
Counter-Strike
byalli462
oskar115
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King102
Other Games
B2W.Neo1324
hiko546
crisheroes415
Lowko323
RotterdaM237
Happy236
Liquid`VortiX139
Sick123
QueenE56
Trikslyr6
febbydoto5
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• poizon28 6
• Kozan
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
• intothetv
• Migwel
• IndyKCrew
StarCraft: Brood War
• Michael_bg 3
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• HerbMon 0
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 3386
League of Legends
• Nemesis4549
• TFBlade927
Other Games
• WagamamaTV346
Upcoming Events
CranKy Ducklings
18h 13m
RSL Revival
18h 13m
herO vs Gerald
ByuN vs SHIN
Kung Fu Cup
20h 13m
Cure vs Reynor
Classic vs herO
IPSL
1d 1h
ZZZero vs rasowy
Napoleon vs KameZerg
OSC
1d 3h
BSL 21
1d 4h
Tarson vs Julia
Doodle vs OldBoy
eOnzErG vs WolFix
StRyKeR vs Aeternum
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 18h
RSL Revival
1d 18h
Reynor vs sOs
Maru vs Ryung
Kung Fu Cup
1d 20h
WardiTV Korean Royale
1d 20h
[ Show More ]
BSL 21
2 days
JDConan vs Semih
Dragon vs Dienmax
Tech vs NewOcean
TerrOr vs Artosis
IPSL
2 days
Dewalt vs WolFix
eOnzErG vs Bonyth
Replay Cast
2 days
Wardi Open
2 days
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
3 days
BSL: GosuLeague
4 days
The PondCast
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
BSL: GosuLeague
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-11-07
Stellar Fest: Constellation Cup
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
SOOP Univ League 2025
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
CSCL: Masked Kings S3
RSL Revival: Season 3
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual

Upcoming

SLON Tour Season 2
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXVIII
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.