• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 09:44
CEST 15:44
KST 22:44
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror4[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters10
Community News
5.0.17 Patch Notes - October 7, 20264Weekly Cups Results (Sep 28-Oct 4)0SC4ALL: II SC2 Complete Invited Player Lineup10StarCraft II 5.0.17 PTR Patch Notes (Sept 30, 2026)78Weekly Cups (Sept 21-27): herO and ByuN double2
StarCraft 2
General
StarCraft II 5.0.17 PTR Patch Notes (Sept 30, 2026) 5.0.17 Patch Notes - October 7, 2026 How do you feel about the mass reverts in the 5.0.17 PTR? [Old] StarCraft 3 Reportedly in Development Weekly Cups Results (Sep 28-Oct 4)
Tourneys
ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament 2026 GSTL Grand Finals Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond)
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[M] (2) Sweltering Sands [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 546 Catch the Train The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 545 And Drops and Rifts Mutation # 544 Double Trouble
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion Fantasy returning? Sagi.gg Launcher Released BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ SC4ALL II Brood War Complete Invited Player Lineup
Tourneys
[ASL22] Semifinal A [ASL22] Semifinal B [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL22] Ro8 Day 4
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Replay Review Process - What do you do?
Other Games
General Games
General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Total Annihilation Zero
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25! Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Artificial Intelligence Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread
Fan Clubs
Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion! Diablo Animated Series on Netflix
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
Escaping Into Video Games: G…
TrAiDoS
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
[meme] I finally understa…
LUCKY_NOOB
Regacy Esports:Our Goa…
regacyesports
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 9010 users

For Pros, Heart of the Swarm Means Fear of Failure - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 Next All
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
March 12 2013 20:34 GMT
#21
On March 13 2013 05:16 Tenks wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 13 2013 05:14 Canucklehead wrote:
On March 13 2013 05:12 Tenks wrote:
On March 13 2013 05:11 renaissanceMAN wrote:
On March 13 2013 05:08 Tenks wrote:
On March 13 2013 04:23 Canucklehead wrote:
Like artosis said on sotg before, it will mean the end to some patch zergs.



If that Flash vs Life game is any indication on the multi tasking and skill required for Zerg in HOTS I weep for foreigners


cannot wait.



Same. I've watched a ton of WoL and that single game, on launch day of HOTS, was still one of the most exciting games of SC2 I've seen.


Same. I have no doubt that flash vs life at the launch event will be listed as one of the best games of 2013 at the end of the year.



Unless now that is just run of the mill TvZ in HOTS, Which I can only pray is true

Granted it was two of the best players for their respected races


Its also awesome to see because players like Flash are so good at pushing the limits of what an unit or group of units can do. I remember when people asked him about SC2 and how he liked playing it, he said he liked how responsive all the units were and wanted to see what he could do with them. I love that mentality that the units don’t limit him and he will bring them to their full potential. It is really refreshing for the community that really loves to crap on the game an claim it limits them.

The community thinks: Blizzard needs to break up the death ball.

Flash thinks: I will break the death ball.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Whitley
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States238 Posts
March 12 2013 20:43 GMT
#22
On March 13 2013 05:08 Tenks wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 13 2013 04:23 Canucklehead wrote:
Like artosis said on sotg before, it will mean the end to some patch zergs.



If that Flash vs Life game is any indication on the multi tasking and skill required for Zerg in HOTS I weep for foreigners


Anywhere with a VOD of this? I really wanna see!
ROFLOLLER
Profile Joined September 2010
Poland65 Posts
March 12 2013 20:49 GMT
#23
On March 13 2013 05:43 Whitley wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 13 2013 05:08 Tenks wrote:
On March 13 2013 04:23 Canucklehead wrote:
Like artosis said on sotg before, it will mean the end to some patch zergs.



If that Flash vs Life game is any indication on the multi tasking and skill required for Zerg in HOTS I weep for foreigners


Anywhere with a VOD of this? I really wanna see!

http://fr.twitch.tv/starcraft/b/376430397 (beginning at 1h35)
Whitley
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States238 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-12 20:54:59
March 12 2013 20:54 GMT
#24
On March 13 2013 05:49 ROFLOLLER wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 13 2013 05:43 Whitley wrote:
On March 13 2013 05:08 Tenks wrote:
On March 13 2013 04:23 Canucklehead wrote:
Like artosis said on sotg before, it will mean the end to some patch zergs.



If that Flash vs Life game is any indication on the multi tasking and skill required for Zerg in HOTS I weep for foreigners


Anywhere with a VOD of this? I really wanna see!

http://fr.twitch.tv/starcraft/b/376430397 (beginning at 1h35)


thanks! youre the best!
ScienceGroen
Profile Joined July 2012
United States43 Posts
March 12 2013 21:17 GMT
#25
Plansix:

The community thinks: Blizzard needs to break up the death ball.

Flash thinks: I will break the death ball.


This is my favorite. Also thanks to ROFLOLLER for the VoD link. Really looking forward to watching that. Flash is the best player on the planet when he's playing against the second best player on the planet. His play skyrockets in crunch time.
Account252508
Profile Joined February 2012
3454 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-12 22:14:59
March 12 2013 22:11 GMT
#26
--- Nuked ---
HardlyNever
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States1258 Posts
March 12 2013 22:19 GMT
#27
I think the idea that this is a time for fringe players, particularly foreigners, to gain an upper-hand is wishful thinking. The same systems and mechanisms that put Koreans at the top are still there, and will continue to be there. While there might be a couple months were it is a free-for-all as new cheeses are discovered, safer builds are found, and what "standard" play is becomes established (we won't even think about maps..), soon rather than later, the Koreans will be back in dominance.

The infrastructure has to change for foreigners to have a chance, not the game.
Out there, the Kid learned to fend for himself. Learned to build. Learned to break.
maartendq
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Belgium3115 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-13 12:41:23
March 13 2013 12:20 GMT
#28
On March 13 2013 05:49 ROFLOLLER wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 13 2013 05:43 Whitley wrote:
On March 13 2013 05:08 Tenks wrote:
On March 13 2013 04:23 Canucklehead wrote:
Like artosis said on sotg before, it will mean the end to some patch zergs.



If that Flash vs Life game is any indication on the multi tasking and skill required for Zerg in HOTS I weep for foreigners


Anywhere with a VOD of this? I really wanna see!

http://fr.twitch.tv/starcraft/b/376430397 (beginning at 1h35)

That game is just insane!

EDIT: if this is going to be the standard level of play in pro SC2: HOTS, we're gonna have great viewer experience. That was almost inhuman.
shadymmj
Profile Joined June 2010
1906 Posts
March 13 2013 12:41 GMT
#29
It's a well written article, but I disagree with some of the points. For one, no, ROOT gaming will not have a ghost of a chance with their current lineup. Or any foreign team for that matter.

I believe HotS will be even harder to predict than WoL. Players come and go, champions come and go. MVP won 4 times out of 20. That's good, but not impressive (on paper), especially when you've seen the dominant year(s) of oov, savior and flash. I wouldn't put my money on anyone. Certainly not on symbol, nestea, etc.
There is no such thing is "e-sports". There is Brood War, and then there is crap for nerds.
GrapeApe
Profile Joined March 2011
1053 Posts
March 13 2013 13:10 GMT
#30
The Tiger Woods/PGA comparison was a terrible one :\
GOIMBA.com <--- eSports betting :)
ETisME
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
12889 Posts
March 13 2013 13:20 GMT
#31
On March 13 2013 05:12 Tenks wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 13 2013 05:11 renaissanceMAN wrote:
On March 13 2013 05:08 Tenks wrote:
On March 13 2013 04:23 Canucklehead wrote:
Like artosis said on sotg before, it will mean the end to some patch zergs.



If that Flash vs Life game is any indication on the multi tasking and skill required for Zerg in HOTS I weep for foreigners


cannot wait.



Same. I've watched a ton of WoL and that single game, on launch day of HOTS, was still one of the most exciting games of SC2 I've seen.

Didn't they made it quite clear that they were show matches?
Don't expect too much
其疾如风,其徐如林,侵掠如火,不动如山,难知如阴,动如雷震。
Confuse
Profile Joined October 2009
2238 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-13 13:28:22
March 13 2013 13:25 GMT
#32
On March 13 2013 22:10 GrapeApe wrote:
The Tiger Woods/PGA comparison was a terrible one :\


Can you offer a better comparsion? Seemed reasonable to me. Professional sports is consistent because the rules change very infrequently. In WoL, we saw players fall and rise on the patch changes.

Also, Blizzard makes me sad because of this. Giving pros more of a heads up on patches would have made this mass patching system at least bearable ~_~
If we fear what we do not understand, then why is ignorance bliss?
NicolBolas
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States1388 Posts
March 13 2013 13:25 GMT
#33
On March 13 2013 07:11 monkybone wrote:
Some abilities were rewarded too much in WoL, like controlling a BL infestor army decently. People were in uproar for a year about the infestor and its role. Yes, Zergs using infestors well were rewarded for that, but it's not the game people wanted. Golf is not all about who smacks the ball the farthest, just as sc2 should not just be about "beautiful fungals".

It's actually not the players privilege to retain their success based on what should have been niche skills, but due to balanced turned out to be a major factor. They will have to evolve together with the game as it evolves based on the decisions of blizzard.

I have no sympathy for the players who had their crutches taken away. Only those who can walk will have continued success in this new expansion.


Perhaps, but then again SC1 was the same way. Tank placement is a "niche skill" too, yet most Terran matchups revolved around it. If you couldn't put your STs in the right place, you lost.

It seems more a question of whether you like the "niche skill." Whether it creates good and interesting play dynamics.
So you know, cats are interesting. They are kind of like girls. If they come up and talk to you, it's great. But if you try to talk to them, it doesn't always go so well. - Shigeru Miyamoto
Account252508
Profile Joined February 2012
3454 Posts
March 13 2013 13:28 GMT
#34
--- Nuked ---
Butterednuts
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States859 Posts
March 13 2013 13:30 GMT
#35
I thought that it was pretty common sense that games phase in and out, and change with time. Obviously with change will bring some people up and some people down. The base mechanics of Heart of the Swarm are so similar to Wings of Liberty that there shouldn't be too big of a shift in who is dominant and who isn't. At the start things will be all over the place as pros have had varying exposure to the expansion, but as months pass things should start to look more and more normal.
Chameleons Cast No Shadows
JustPassingBy
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
10776 Posts
March 13 2013 13:33 GMT
#36
Article:
Composed mainly of North American players, ROOT Gaming has never been able to compete consistently against the top South Korean players that dominate the sport. But Heart of the Swarm could be an opportunity for smaller teams to make a move up the totem pole.


Anybody willing to bet on Root? I will give good odds.
KingofGods
Profile Joined July 2010
Canada1218 Posts
March 13 2013 13:46 GMT
#37
Why would EG get rid of Incontrol? Look how long LzGamer and Machine stayed on the roster and Incontrol does much more for EG than those other two.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
March 13 2013 13:52 GMT
#38
On March 13 2013 22:46 KingofGods wrote:
Why would EG get rid of Incontrol? Look how long LzGamer and Machine stayed on the roster and Incontrol does much more for EG than those other two.


Agreed. Regardless of results, he is the front man that a lot of teams wished they had. He has a dynamic personality that draws viewers an interest to any event or show he is involved with. Much like Artosis, Incontrol is one of those people that just makes you pumped to watch SC2.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
MCDayC
Profile Joined March 2011
United Kingdom14464 Posts
March 13 2013 14:06 GMT
#39
I liked the article, its a nice angle not really talked about outside of people complaining about patchzergs
VERY FRAGILE, LIKE A BABY PANDA EGG
Ravensong170
Profile Joined June 2012
United States858 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-13 14:13:54
March 13 2013 14:12 GMT
#40
I don't think its Korean mechanics that separate them from the top tier foreigners. The difference is that MOST(if not all) koreans have top level mechanics and an intuitive grasp of mechanics. But I think that a lot of their domination depends on their decision making and positioning.

I think there are a fair number of foreigners who have strong mechanics and very good micro like stephano, scarlett, thorzain, naniwa, vibe (BUT HE"S NA LOLROFLOMGHAXORZ, I'm talking about his mechanics and microing abilities, which are extremely good, vibe just makes a lot of dumb decisions in his games that cause him to fall behind, like he made hydras in a WOL tourney game thinking he had done more damage to a toss than he had and threw away a huge lead.that's the kinda stuff that keeps him behind in MLG's, but when's he's on he will take series now and then off koreans)

But Korean's practice regimen is more structured and rigid, more like a typical career or profession where for many foreigners its more self-motivated. As such koreans get exposed to (from their practice partners, coaches, and ladder) a wider array of scenarios, and they are more prepared for a them, knowing what works and what doesn't work for hundreds of cases. The baseline skill level, fundamentals and micro/macro alone isn't the largest gap that sits between top tier foreigners and koreans, its they are just so much more prepared for each match than foreigners are. (at least most of the time. Unless you are MKP losing to Trimaster in MLG last year 2-0. lol)
"what a terrible ass game, we should all kill ourselves." -EE-Sama
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
OSC
22:00
King of the Hill #264
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
OGKoka 259
MaxPax 154
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 65621
Calm 3667
Shuttle 3170
FanTaSy 1600
Bisu 1574
EffOrt 529
Mini 451
Soma 413
Rush 340
Stork 327
[ Show more ]
Hyuk 274
firebathero 248
Light 222
Snow 179
ZerO 151
Last 144
Soulkey 136
actioN 115
Zeus 103
Barracks 100
Dewaltoss 74
Killer 72
hero 57
Mong 56
Pusan 50
Shinee 46
Hyun 43
Bale 33
ToSsGirL 33
Free 28
Shine 28
sorry 25
PianO 22
Aegong 20
Sharp 20
yabsab 16
zelot 16
HiyA 12
Sacsri 11
Icarus 6
Noble 6
Dota 2
Gorgc6777
Dendi847
Counter-Strike
olofmeister1353
kRYSTAL_209
Heroes of the Storm
Lowko490
Other Games
gofns42440
singsing2110
B2W.Neo687
hiko426
crisheroes299
byalli276
DeMusliM223
Livibee182
Hui .168
Liquid`VortiX104
Rex96
Mew2King92
ZerO(Twitch)9
Organizations
StarCraft 2
IntoTheiNu 1213
Other Games
BasetradeTV222
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 6
[ Show 9 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 26
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Upcoming Events
OSC
8h 31m
Replay Cast
9h 16m
OSC
1d 9h
Big Brain Bouts
1d 20h
Rex vs INexorable
GgMaChine vs HeRoMaRinE
Reynor vs herO
AI Arena Tournament
2 days
BSL: Ladder Tournament
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
Patches Events
3 days
BSL Open Qualifier
3 days
BSL Open Qualifier
3 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Weekly
4 days
PiGosaur Cup
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Copium Cup

Ongoing

ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
Acropolis #5
Acropolis #5 - GSB
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual

Upcoming

Acropolis #5 - GSC
BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
HCC Season 3
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.