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On July 02 2012 22:55 SeaSwift wrote:Show nested quote +On July 02 2012 22:48 Mehukannu wrote:
Internationally TvZ is still pretty screwed though and as usual Korean stats are affected by one guy winning a lot more than the international one due to low amount of data it has. We are still better to go with international one since it does have 3000 tournament matches played rather than mere 300 spread among all the match-ups. One person is still highly unlikely to skew the matchup. Most of the occasions in which Koreans play many games in one month are abroad. In the GSL you just don't play enough games to really skew the data by a massive amount.
There was 111 games played on TvP, which means that one win will change the winrate about 1% It is same for the TvZ too. It is even worse in PvZ which has only 84 matches played. I don't know about you, but to me 1% change per win is pretty darn huge change on the statistics.
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On July 02 2012 23:04 CaptainCrush wrote:Show nested quote +On July 02 2012 23:02 mEtRoSG wrote:
in gsl terran got 35% winrate vs zerg in the month of june....this graph is bs Was just going to say the same... something wrong with the numbers here.
gsl is around 50 games
those graphs cover alot more tournaments, just check the games number on the graph. gsl ones are included
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United Kingdom38257 Posts
On July 02 2012 22:50 Adreme wrote:Wait what else are these actually based on then Code A/S and maybe the Korean weekly which shouldnt be enough to push average?
Probably has ESV, maybe some EWM. Would have KSL but the season is over (and maybe over forever TT)
Might even have PL lol
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On July 02 2012 23:05 ChriseC wrote:Show nested quote +On July 02 2012 23:04 CaptainCrush wrote:On July 02 2012 23:02 mEtRoSG wrote:
in gsl terran got 35% winrate vs zerg in the month of june....this graph is bs Was just going to say the same... something wrong with the numbers here. gsl is around 50 games those graphs cover alot more tournaments, just check the games number on the graph. gsl ones are included
this
Yea, These are KR stats. Not GSTL/GSL only stats.
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On July 02 2012 22:54 graNite wrote:
What tournaments does the TLPD cover?
TLPD international includes most big and small tournaments (TSL4 Qualifiers, Weeklies, MLG/IPL/GESL etc). TLPD korea has GSL, Proleagues, Korean Weeklies etc.
However, it's missing for example the Code A Qualifiers (as far as I can tell?). That's games with about 200-300 players I suppose which are completely missing...
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On July 02 2012 22:27 Hypemeup wrote:Show nested quote +On July 02 2012 22:23 Whole wrote:
Seems that Korean Terrans were busy figuring out the new TvZ while International Terrans were busy complaining about balance. The new TvZ looking at korean terrans games are various all-ins? Nice! Not to mention that all high end Korean Ts also complain about Z 
Yes though they still win more, funny how that works out huh? Though timings also work too.
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On July 02 2012 23:02 mEtRoSG wrote:
in gsl terran got 35% winrate vs zerg in the month of june....this graph is bs
On July 02 2012 23:04 Kenshi235 wrote:
I don't believe the TvZ winrate in Korea ~50/50. I'm calling bs on this. I'd like to know who regularly posts this and what games these are derived from.
The statistics you see on the GSL page has games from 15 of may and forward and this is June only. That and the sample size from just GSL is kinda small (~100 games in 1,5 month) so calling these statistics out over the GSL statistics is quite stupid.
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On July 02 2012 23:04 CaptainCrush wrote:Show nested quote +On July 02 2012 23:02 mEtRoSG wrote:
in gsl terran got 35% winrate vs zerg in the month of june....this graph is bs Was just going to say the same... something wrong with the numbers here.
You surely realize there is more then just GSL in Korea right?
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I love reading the comments on these TLPD Winrate threads lol I don't understand how people can look at these graphs and determine balance in the matchups -.-
These graphs only show winrates not balance, and they certainly don't show that many matchups have become really boring to watch and to play imo.
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On July 02 2012 22:50 Adreme wrote:Wait what else are these actually based on then Code A/S and maybe the Korean weekly which shouldnt be enough to push average?
Korean database is not all about GSL anymore, but there's Proleague and ESV. ESV is really wild because the race distribution is varied from week to week, and Terran play ESV a lot. Moreover, there're lots of walkovers that have people go straight to ro16, ro8. Proleague is wild because the level of game is lower, and players are sent to play on just one map, so they have time to practice on that map specifically.
International looks skew because TSL4, DreamHack, MLG and the bunch are counted as International Tournaments.
Teaja is the other factor for Terran this month. Excluding TvT, he has gone 13-6 in TvZ and TvP, which although doesn't sound much, but since there're only ~200 games in Korean database, it skew couple percents in Terran favors.
So yeah, although Terran is losing in some tournament like GSL, TSL, Dreamhack, as long as Terran can hold ground in ESV, and Proleague, the stats will still looks balance.
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Would be pretty cool if someone made the effort to show the winrate distribution of "important games" (major tournaments, etc.) since Starcraft II's release.
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Lololol it didn't take much time for our dear Korean Terrans to get back on top.
If only foreigners weren't so trashy now :'(
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I always enjoy when people quote Korean Terrans on balance... I wonder why they're so upset, after 2 years of complete Terran dominance in which GomTV was GOMTVT it's no surprise that when the Zergs have a fighting chance, the games auto imbalanced. They're playing this game for money, they couldn't give a shit about whether they're biased or not, the more it favours them the more they can win.
So let us please stop quoting professional Korean Terran players going "it's so hard". Good, that's the idea of the game.
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On July 02 2012 23:07 moe475 wrote:TLPD international includes most big and small tournaments (TSL4 Qualifiers, Weeklies, MLG/IPL/GESL etc). TLPD korea has GSL, Proleagues, Korean Weeklies etc. However, it's missing for example the Code A Qualifiers (as far as I can tell?). That's games with about 200-300 players I suppose which are completely missing...
if that's true it's really important, because terran got smacked brutally in the code a prelims.
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On July 02 2012 23:02 mEtRoSG wrote:
in gsl terran got 35% winrate vs zerg in the month of june....this graph is bs
GSL =/= Korean stats. There are more tournaments than that.
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there has to be something hinky in this, every single tournament there has been terran has been doing terrible, you only need to look at tlpd invidual leagues and its quite obvious that the situation is horrible for terrans, so these statistics are somehow rigged
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On July 02 2012 22:31 Tarotis wrote:Show nested quote +On July 02 2012 22:29 Gentso wrote:
Foreigners can't typically create extremely solid styles on their own like the hellion opener. Only person who's been effective at something like that is Stephano. So when the game gets changed they have to wait for Koreans to figure everything out first. MaNa? NaNiwa? HuK? All of them have created their own builds which are partly used in Korea aswell.
Ehhhhh, Naniwa had that two base collosus timing for a while and I'm not familiar with mana or huk creating a style of play that changed the meta game. I'm talking abut seriously figuring out something completely solid with timings figured out for attacks and defense that other people shift to. For the most part, foreigners create some personal builds that take games here and there but nothing too significant.
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On July 02 2012 23:24 Satiinifi wrote:
there has to be something hinky in this, every single tournament there has been terran has been doing terrible, you only need to look at tlpd invidual leagues and its quite obvious that the situation is horrible for terrans, so these statistics are somehow rigged
satinii i loved you in wc3 but plz stop whining in sc2 ! ^^
theres nothing rigged about those stats and anyone can easily see the individual games in tlpd
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The graph doesn't represent my view of the balance. They must be fake.
oh you guys 
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Game looks very balanced atm
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EPT
