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VirgilSC2
United States6151 Posts
The last thing Protoss needs is a "harass" unit that can't kill workers. Also, if your big thing about the Oracle is that we can see what is being produced, make the Stargate stop showing what it's making. It's the only building in the game (except the Nexus) that gives away what it's producing. I don't see why they can't just: Remove Thor/Warhound and Add Goliath Remove Swarm Host and add Lurker Fix Carrier and scrap Tempest | ||
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Proseat
Germany5113 Posts
I think they should simply replace the Thor with small Goliath-type units that have a stronger Thor-splash and keep the Carrier but make it behave more like in Broodwar (possibly even offering a range upgrade, which could be the weapon against Broodlord/Infestor). I am not too sold on Swarm Host yet. Keeping the Overseer that costs no supply but suddenly has great abilities needs to be balanced somehow. We'll see what else they'll come up with next. | ||
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Velr
Switzerland10940 Posts
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R0YAL
United States1768 Posts
On April 12 2012 06:57 VirgilSC2 wrote: Please for the love of all that is holy do not continue with the Oracle. The last thing Protoss needs is a "harass" unit that can't kill workers. Also, if your big thing about the Oracle is that we can see what is being produced, make the Stargate stop showing what it's making. It's the only building in the game (except the Nexus) that gives away what it's producing. I don't see why they can't just: Remove Thor/Warhound and Add Goliath Remove Swarm Host and add Lurker Fix Carrier and scrap Tempest Because Browder says that if you want to use those units, go play bw because it's a great game. | ||
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RDaneelOlivaw
Vatican City State733 Posts
On April 12 2012 06:37 Shiori wrote: But why is this a problem? Zerg is at an advantage if they're not being pressured at all. As a Protoss player (can't speak for Terrans, but most I ask seem to agree) I'm constantly looking for opportunities to pressure the Zerg and delay that Hive as much as possible. If you're now telling me I'm not even going to be able to do this while taking a third base reliably, then how exactly is Protoss (or Terran) ever going to be on even footing once the BLs come out, since the Hive could feasibly be much earlier? Is it not enough that Zerg has a stranglehold on map control for the early portions of the game? Is it not enough that the onus is on the other player to stop you from droning to 80 and not the other way around? TL;DR: Zerg already forces the other races to do plenty. They don't need to be able to do it at yet another stage of the game. I mean, who in their right mind plays a turtle style all game against Zerg? It's suicide. Perhaps they would rebalance accordingly? ZvP is extremely boring because it plays out in such a similar fashion most games. Is it a bad thing that they are trying to inject life into the matchup? Where's the fun in watching Toss do timing attack into deathball vs the forced fast 3 base every game? | ||
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Cyanocyst
2222 Posts
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aintz
Canada5624 Posts
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Sparkfist
United States13 Posts
but we would still like to give the protoss some additional firepower in the air. The tempest is currently a very long-ranged aerial siege weapon that can strike both air and ground targets. Like what a carrier is supposed to do right? that they've made absolutely no effort on tweaking / fixing. Clearly making and balancing a whole new unit is so much easier z_Z....... | ||
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Velr
Switzerland10940 Posts
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Mantraz
Norway119 Posts
"We are also experimenting with an extremely long-ranged terran missile launcher that can be used to break siege tank lines to make terran-vs.-terran factory-based games more dynamic." I have faith but this seems a little bit too gimmicky and weird, tank lines aren't a problem, i would think rookies would get pretty far with viking/banshee to clear some tank lines. I'm also a bit concerned regarding the blinding cloud, if it's blatantly overpowered it'll be reduced or removed, but i can't see a scenario where it isnt, esp. ZvT (now with ultralisk charge...) | ||
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SolidMoose
United States1240 Posts
-Shredder might have been good, but I understand why they had to remove it. -I was skeptical about the warhound, I'm hoping they do keep the thor and perhaps improve its anti-air with an air spider mine. No thor would kill mech in TvZ -Replicant...definitely needed to go -Viper cloud only effecting bio is a huge help. This means it won't completely shit all over a Terran army because tanks can still fire, and this also helps mech staying in the matchup. The terran missile launcher sounds weird, and vipers regaining energy from minerals also sounds weird. | ||
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rd
United States2586 Posts
On April 12 2012 06:52 HaXXspetten wrote: Somewhat, yes, but people please, that kind of thinking will only lead to depression, give Blizzard some time to try and clear things up, I'm sure they'll come up with something good in the end. After all, every single game/expansion they've ever released thus far has been awesome, I see no reason why they'd botch it now just because of indecision. You give them way too much credit. If anything, I'd encourage people to voice their complaints on the SC2 forums in the hopes it's more likely to catch their attention. Sitting back and hoping they throw a few dozen knives in the dark and hit the target is not reassuring in the least. | ||
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Drowsy
United States4876 Posts
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Arco
United States2090 Posts
On April 12 2012 06:57 VirgilSC2 wrote: Please for the love of all that is holy do not continue with the Oracle. The last thing Protoss needs is a "harass" unit that can't kill workers. Because proxy warpin Zealots/Dark Templar aren't enough? Or Warp Prisms to ferry in Zealots/Stalkers/High Templar/Dark Templar/Immortals/Archons? Or Colossus to abuse cliffs to snipe workers like the natural on Tal'darim? Or units like Blink Stalkers/Phoenix/Void Rays? Just not quite enough worker killing units huh? You're in over your head. The Oracle is a cool unit with a lot of potential. | ||
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Shield
Bulgaria4824 Posts
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VirgilSC2
United States6151 Posts
On April 12 2012 07:00 R0YAL wrote: Because Browder says that if you want to use those units, go play bw because it's a great game. So then why is he trying to add them to HotS under the guise of different units? | ||
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ThePlayer33
Australia2378 Posts
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R0YAL
United States1768 Posts
On April 12 2012 07:05 Drowsy wrote: For sure 100% switching to zerg if they're really going to put the oracle in this game. All the zerg units seem really god damn cool and all the other races units are kinda dumb. Mass recall feels really stupid at first, but then I remember that tvp is always decided by 1 big engagement and realize maybe mass recall isn't so dumb afterall. It may be okay for tvp but it would break PvZ in an unfixable way because there's only two possible outcomes. 1) Protoss pushes out 2) Zerg is forced to make units 3) Protoss Recalls 4) Instant indirect damage with no repercussions OR 1) Protoss pushes out 2) Zerg didn't make units or units are too late 3) Protoss wins A scenario where you can just push out and either outright win, or retreat with a guaranteed zero losses while at the same time doing indirect damage to the opponent, is incredibly bad design. The only way Mass Recall could ever find a place in the game would be as a tier 3 ability. It can still be on the Nexus but it needs to be unlocked by tech. | ||
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Roe
Canada6002 Posts
On April 12 2012 06:46 Endymion wrote: I can't think of a unit in the game that can be perceived as being more one dimensional initially though... All the vultue is good for on paper is its speed really, so it's labeled as a scout. However, when you combine its speed and its attack it becomes good at harassing.. combine its speed with its low cost and it becomes a sponge for tvt tank battles.. combine it with drops and it becomes even more powerful. Idk, i feel like it should be a boring unit but instead it's incredibly versatile, sorry if it's a bad example for you =/ btw is contaminate still even in the game? for some reason i thought they took it out lol well those are pretty simple things to think about. why not apply that to swarm host? you can drop it in enemy lines, you can put them above ramps so your enemy walks into a swarm of stuff. you can put maybe 5-6 of them behind the enemy (lets say terran) army, then when you force them to kite backwards they run into another army, or you lure the marines up front, letting the swarm hosts attack the tanks at the back, which pulls marines back which lets something like mutas take out tanks from the front. idk, that's all i can think of. the problem is simply there's not much inherent room for micro, where there is a lot of micro from the vulture. | ||
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rd
United States2586 Posts
On April 12 2012 07:06 Tump wrote: Because proxy warpin Zealots/Dark Templar aren't enough? Or Warp Prisms to ferry in Zealots/Stalkers/High Templar/Dark Templar/Immortals/Archons? Or Colossus to abuse cliffs like the natural on Tal'darim? or Blink Stalkers/Phoenix/Void Rays? Just not quite enough worker killing units huh? You're in over your head. The Oracle is a cool unit with a lot of potential. ...Lol? Sounds like you're in over your head. I don't even think half those strategies exist in <diamond. Please don't make someone list why you're wrong. | ||
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