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On January 31 2012 07:21 Frankon wrote:Stephano was put in a no-win situation.He either forfeit (and get screwed by the tournament official who made up rule on the fly - read the MrBitter response in the orginal thread). He plays the game by alternating 6pools and 12 drone rushes - he would still be screwed by the tournament officials cause: Quoting: Show nested quote +...we have to be an organization that puts the fans first. Given that principle, I came to the decision to penalize Stephano and move him to 4th place,... . I dont think fans would like four 6 pools or drone rushes... So he might have been penalized too. To be honest all tournaments need sound rules. There were no rules posted about this tournament - only the format and map pool.
OR!!!!
Or... or or or or!!!
1. He either TRIES!
OR!
2. He either recognizes ahead of time (responsibly) that joining two tournaments simultaneously might drain his energy and so he might not have the stamina to compete in both at the same time, and makes the mature decision to only play in one.
Whoops.
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On January 31 2012 07:24 Ninjahoe wrote:
To everyone comparing this to the naniwa incident, it's VERY diffrent in a key point.
This game actually mattered.
And the other game at Gsl mattered to me which have paid a ticket to see... but who cares about the viewer right?
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On January 31 2012 07:23 Zairair wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 07:23 Tobberoth wrote:On January 31 2012 07:21 Zairair wrote:
Rick Perry forfeited his Republican Nomination because he was losing (as Stephano was already at a disadvantage and was losing because he was tired). Should Rick Perry be kicked out of Texas Governor because he was unprofessional (punishing Stephano and giving him 4th place when he earned 2nd place)? Rick Perry gave up and gets nothing. In the same manner, it makes perfect sense that if you forfeit a tournament, you forfeit it and get nothing. Gets nothing is not the same as "loses what he earned".
Of course he loses what he earned since he didn't play the finals, so he didn't earn it, he forfeited. It's like writing a report for school and demand some of the points because you wrote a few pages before you gave up.
He didn't play through to the end, I see no reason for the tournament to respect his earlier wins when he can't respect that they want a proper final.
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Smaller tournament or not that is quite unprofessional to do that in an event you accepted. Stephano should show some respect to the tournament organizers who seemed to be quite accommodating by delaying it for him. I am disappointed.
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On January 31 2012 07:26 Tobberoth wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 07:23 Zairair wrote:On January 31 2012 07:23 Tobberoth wrote:On January 31 2012 07:21 Zairair wrote:
Rick Perry forfeited his Republican Nomination because he was losing (as Stephano was already at a disadvantage and was losing because he was tired). Should Rick Perry be kicked out of Texas Governor because he was unprofessional (punishing Stephano and giving him 4th place when he earned 2nd place)? Rick Perry gave up and gets nothing. In the same manner, it makes perfect sense that if you forfeit a tournament, you forfeit it and get nothing. Gets nothing is not the same as "loses what he earned". Of course he loses what he earned since he didn't play the finals, so he didn't earn it, he forfeited. It's like writing a report for school and demand some of the points because you wrote a few pages before you gave up. He didn't play through to the end, I see no reason for the tournament to respect his earlier wins when he can't respect that they want a proper final.
But Rick Perry did not lose anything that he earned. So why can't you boot him out of Texas?
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On January 31 2012 07:24 Ninjahoe wrote:
To everyone comparing this to the naniwa incident, it's VERY diffrent in a key point.
This game actually mattered.
Mattered to who ?
For Naniwa, the game mattered to the spectators, and not to him.
Here the game mattered to stephano (in terms of money) and to the spectators (it's a final).
No one is bitching that stephano lost money (not even him), so it's just about the spectators in the end.
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I don't think that this is that big of a deal. Stephano doesn't seem to care that he forfeited, just leave it at that. He didn't feel up to it and took the penalty that the tournament gave him. This really shouldn't be a big deal unless he's trying to make it a big deal. Yes it's a bit unprofessional, but what would be really unprofessional would be if he was complaining. Judging by his tweets I don't think he's too broken up about it.
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That Rick Perry analogy is ridiculous. Taking away his governership would be akin to ONOG taking Stephano's prize money from IPL.
Do you guys honestly think before you formulate your arguements?
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On January 31 2012 07:26 Zairair wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 07:26 Tobberoth wrote:On January 31 2012 07:23 Zairair wrote:On January 31 2012 07:23 Tobberoth wrote:On January 31 2012 07:21 Zairair wrote:
Rick Perry forfeited his Republican Nomination because he was losing (as Stephano was already at a disadvantage and was losing because he was tired). Should Rick Perry be kicked out of Texas Governor because he was unprofessional (punishing Stephano and giving him 4th place when he earned 2nd place)? Rick Perry gave up and gets nothing. In the same manner, it makes perfect sense that if you forfeit a tournament, you forfeit it and get nothing. Gets nothing is not the same as "loses what he earned". Of course he loses what he earned since he didn't play the finals, so he didn't earn it, he forfeited. It's like writing a report for school and demand some of the points because you wrote a few pages before you gave up. He didn't play through to the end, I see no reason for the tournament to respect his earlier wins when he can't respect that they want a proper final. But Rick Perry did not lose anything that he earned. So why can't you boot him out of Texas?
Because he didn't earn anything as part of the Republican nomination?
Your analogy is horrible.
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The front page has been lacking a good drama thread lately. I could see why this is newsworthy, Need that traffic man, things are becoming stagnant
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They should have told him that he must play or forfeit all prize money. He'd at least stay up and get owned to keep his $$$
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On January 31 2012 07:19 1Eris1 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 07:18 Itsmedudeman wrote:On January 31 2012 07:16 1Eris1 wrote:On January 31 2012 07:13 Itsmedudeman wrote:On January 31 2012 07:11 1Eris1 wrote:On January 31 2012 07:09 Itsmedudeman wrote:On January 31 2012 07:07 1Eris1 wrote:On January 31 2012 07:05 Morrisson wrote:On January 31 2012 07:04 1Eris1 wrote:On January 31 2012 07:00 Laurens wrote:
if it's 2:45 AM and he has to wait for a 3rd place game, then play a BO7...
vs a macro player like Kas that'd take until at least 4 AM >.>
I suppose if Kas can stay up for it, so can Stephano, but still.. Why the hell did he sign up for the tournament than if he knew it might run that late? Maybe not THAT late, most of the time, late mean 1am.... Wow what a crap excuse. What about the tournament workers and casters who stayed up all night long to put on the tournament? What about the other players? Kas was up even later than Stephano btw I can run 30 km. Why can't you? That's basically the logic you're using here. If stephano felt he was unfit he was unfit. I honestly have no idea what's so hard to understand from stephano's perspective. You think he purposely wanted to abuse his power and get easy money without playing the finals BY GIVING UP A CHANCE AT 700 MORE DOLLARS FOR ONE SERIES? What kind of dumb comparison is that? I didn't sign up to run 30 km, Stephano did. I think he made an agreement, broke it, and deserves to get punished for it. So if you sign up for a marathon you should finish it no matter what and if you get tired people have the right to bitch at you. Okay. ROFL Why do you keep comparing this to a marathon? Marathon's are usually voluntary stuff where there is no money involved, this is completely different. I never said you shouldn't be allowed to forfeit (where the hell are you getting that from?), but if you do, you should be punished because you failed to uphold your agreement. Obviously you can't force him to do something, but there is a thing called reprecussions in the world. He lost 700 dollars because they bumped him to 4th place and I think that's perfectly reasonable as he did not perform. And I'm saying that was a good thing...wtf. I'm arguing against the people who think Stephano shouldn't have been punished
uhh, where in that first post did I say Stephano should not have been punished ??
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On January 31 2012 07:25 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 07:21 Frankon wrote:Stephano was put in a no-win situation.He either forfeit (and get screwed by the tournament official who made up rule on the fly - read the MrBitter response in the orginal thread). He plays the game by alternating 6pools and 12 drone rushes - he would still be screwed by the tournament officials cause: Quoting: ...we have to be an organization that puts the fans first. Given that principle, I came to the decision to penalize Stephano and move him to 4th place,... . I dont think fans would like four 6 pools or drone rushes... So he might have been penalized too. To be honest all tournaments need sound rules. There were no rules posted about this tournament - only the format and map pool. OR!!!! Or... or or or or!!! 1. He either TRIES! OR! 2. He either recognizes ahead of time (responsibly) that joining two tournaments simultaneously might drain his energy and so he might not have the stamina to compete in both at the same time, and makes the mature decision to only play in one. Whoops.
OR people could realize that shit like this happens and can't always be seen before ahead of time. Seriously, who here hasn't had appointments on the same day, and then had to give one up because something extended longer than it should have or for whatever other reason? And he did "try". He probably went on several hours longer than he wanted to playing in the semis.
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On January 31 2012 07:27 Tobberoth wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 07:26 Zairair wrote:On January 31 2012 07:26 Tobberoth wrote:On January 31 2012 07:23 Zairair wrote:On January 31 2012 07:23 Tobberoth wrote:On January 31 2012 07:21 Zairair wrote:
Rick Perry forfeited his Republican Nomination because he was losing (as Stephano was already at a disadvantage and was losing because he was tired). Should Rick Perry be kicked out of Texas Governor because he was unprofessional (punishing Stephano and giving him 4th place when he earned 2nd place)? Rick Perry gave up and gets nothing. In the same manner, it makes perfect sense that if you forfeit a tournament, you forfeit it and get nothing. Gets nothing is not the same as "loses what he earned". Of course he loses what he earned since he didn't play the finals, so he didn't earn it, he forfeited. It's like writing a report for school and demand some of the points because you wrote a few pages before you gave up. He didn't play through to the end, I see no reason for the tournament to respect his earlier wins when he can't respect that they want a proper final. But Rick Perry did not lose anything that he earned. So why can't you boot him out of Texas? Because he didn't earn anything as part of the Republican nomination? Your analogy is horrible.
So why are you guys such bad manner to Stephano? You guys are asking him to be burned at the stake and be labeled as unprofessional for his whole career? Is that justified?
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On January 31 2012 07:26 Tobberoth wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 07:23 Zairair wrote:On January 31 2012 07:23 Tobberoth wrote:On January 31 2012 07:21 Zairair wrote:
Rick Perry forfeited his Republican Nomination because he was losing (as Stephano was already at a disadvantage and was losing because he was tired). Should Rick Perry be kicked out of Texas Governor because he was unprofessional (punishing Stephano and giving him 4th place when he earned 2nd place)? Rick Perry gave up and gets nothing. In the same manner, it makes perfect sense that if you forfeit a tournament, you forfeit it and get nothing. Gets nothing is not the same as "loses what he earned". Of course he loses what he earned since he didn't play the finals, so he didn't earn it, he forfeited. It's like writing a report for school and demand some of the points because you wrote a few pages before you gave up. He didn't play through to the end, I see no reason for the tournament to respect his earlier wins when he can't respect that they want a proper final.
He earned the money. The 2nd place player gets the money for 2nd place, though, so by not playing the finals he failed to come in second and lost that money.
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On January 31 2012 07:22 Itsmedudeman wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 07:18 s4life wrote:On January 31 2012 07:16 Itsmedudeman wrote:On January 31 2012 07:15 s4life wrote:On January 31 2012 07:07 Itsmedudeman wrote:On January 31 2012 06:19 s4life wrote:On January 31 2012 06:03 nicknup wrote:
Tennis players forfeit games in tournaments they have commited to participate due to injuries and beeing tired and no one bash then. Sure, things out of control are pretty reasonable excuses not to play -- like a pulled muscle f.e. -- but come on, Stephano accepted the invitation and knew perfectly well what he was getting into, he should have planned for it.. on top of that made wait for him an hour or so.. that's just him being completely unprofessional. No, you can forfeit if you're exhausted and can't continue. Same thing as stephano. Of course you can, but in that case you absolutely pay a price for it. A professional tennis player getting exhausted and forfeiting because of it is a huge deal, it means the player is pretty irresponsible with his training, preparation and on top of that show lack of temperance. He won't get any invites anytime soon. No, actually, no one bitches about it. They point out that they have to work at their conditioning, but no one is gonna walk up to them and tell them they're unprofessional and should be punished. Actually, yes, tired players who quit because of it absolutely lose the respect of their peers, fans and organizers.. that's how it works in any sport. Djokovic retired from a major a few years back due to exhaustion. I don't ever remember a single article or thread written about how he's unprofessional and that he should be punished.
Yeah. Actually I really wonder how many TLers do or did a sport at a really high level, be it eSports or real sports, seeing how the well-being of the player is often completeley disregarded under the "HE OWES US THE SPECTACLE. HE MUST PLAY UNTIL HE DIES BY CARPAL TUNNEL. IT PLEASES US".
This situation has already been discussed in a blog and I feel the overall agreement was "Stephano has more than the right to forfeit. He handled this a bit roughly. He could have anticipated that he'd make finals in both tournaments. ONOG took the best decision for the viewers, but not for the players, as Stephano won the 2nd place's prize. And 80% of the posters like drama more than reflexion"
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On January 31 2012 07:24 Ninjahoe wrote:
To everyone comparing this to the naniwa incident, it's VERY diffrent in a key point.
This game actually mattered.
you think the naniwa game doesn't matter?
do you realize how many ppl are looking forward to watch that game?
that's the middle finger to all the fans
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United States5162 Posts
On January 31 2012 07:28 magnaflow wrote:
The front page has been lacking a good drama thread lately. I could see why this is newsworthy, Need that traffic man, things are becoming stagnant
Someone must have missed the whole Rekrul/Coach Lee thing...
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On January 31 2012 07:29 Zairair wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 07:27 Tobberoth wrote:On January 31 2012 07:26 Zairair wrote:On January 31 2012 07:26 Tobberoth wrote:On January 31 2012 07:23 Zairair wrote:On January 31 2012 07:23 Tobberoth wrote:On January 31 2012 07:21 Zairair wrote:
Rick Perry forfeited his Republican Nomination because he was losing (as Stephano was already at a disadvantage and was losing because he was tired). Should Rick Perry be kicked out of Texas Governor because he was unprofessional (punishing Stephano and giving him 4th place when he earned 2nd place)? Rick Perry gave up and gets nothing. In the same manner, it makes perfect sense that if you forfeit a tournament, you forfeit it and get nothing. Gets nothing is not the same as "loses what he earned". Of course he loses what he earned since he didn't play the finals, so he didn't earn it, he forfeited. It's like writing a report for school and demand some of the points because you wrote a few pages before you gave up. He didn't play through to the end, I see no reason for the tournament to respect his earlier wins when he can't respect that they want a proper final. But Rick Perry did not lose anything that he earned. So why can't you boot him out of Texas? Because he didn't earn anything as part of the Republican nomination? Your analogy is horrible. So why are you guys such bad manner to Stephano? You guys are asking him to be burned at the stake and be labeled as unprofessional for his whole career? Is that justified?
I've said no such thing. I've said you shouldn't expect to get second place when you refuse to play a final.
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Overall, I just wish players had a better sense of how their actions are going to be perceived by their fans and the spectators/community as a whole. Stephano fans wanted to see their player play hard and do well, not get to the finals and then blow it off. To me, it's disrespectful and unprofessional.
And maybe it's unfair that players are judged like that, or that fans (myself included) feel almost entitled to seeing their favorite players play, but there you go. Regardless of the legitimacy of those feelings, this will negatively impact Stephano's standing with the community as a whole.
Similarly (and probably more importantly), you're foolish if you think event organizers won't look at this and think twice before inviting Stephano to their own event. As it was, Stephano let the shoe drop right at the end and left the event organizers to scramble to arrange the last few matches and figure out what they're going to do for their audience. I give the ONOG team big props for keeping their heads and still pulling off a great event.
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EPT
