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On January 31 2012 07:15 aristarchus wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 07:11 Gheed wrote:
I don't get why this is such a big deal. If he's tired, he's tired. Are you going to force him to play? Would you rather have him 6 pool 4 times and then go to sleep or just forfeit and sleep? This keeps getting said. It might be that he was actually dead tired and would have played miserably if he tried to play. That would also have been extremely disappointing to the people watching, and would have gotten criticism, but he would have seemed more sympathetic because he was trying so hard. But it's possible he really was that insanely tired. But if so, that's not an excuse. It just means he did the really dumb, irresponsible thing when he signed up for the tournament or didn't forfeit earlier, rather than when he forfeited. Either way, he did some very bad.
Well people would have sympathise to stephano and ONOG would have a lot of criticisim to let a player dead tired to play at 4 am and ruin a final with 4 6 pools in a row.
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On January 31 2012 07:18 Itsmedudeman wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 07:16 1Eris1 wrote:On January 31 2012 07:13 Itsmedudeman wrote:On January 31 2012 07:11 1Eris1 wrote:On January 31 2012 07:09 Itsmedudeman wrote:On January 31 2012 07:07 1Eris1 wrote:On January 31 2012 07:05 Morrisson wrote:On January 31 2012 07:04 1Eris1 wrote:On January 31 2012 07:00 Laurens wrote:
if it's 2:45 AM and he has to wait for a 3rd place game, then play a BO7...
vs a macro player like Kas that'd take until at least 4 AM >.>
I suppose if Kas can stay up for it, so can Stephano, but still.. Why the hell did he sign up for the tournament than if he knew it might run that late? Maybe not THAT late, most of the time, late mean 1am.... Wow what a crap excuse. What about the tournament workers and casters who stayed up all night long to put on the tournament? What about the other players? Kas was up even later than Stephano btw I can run 30 km. Why can't you? That's basically the logic you're using here. If stephano felt he was unfit he was unfit. I honestly have no idea what's so hard to understand from stephano's perspective. You think he purposely wanted to abuse his power and get easy money without playing the finals BY GIVING UP A CHANCE AT 700 MORE DOLLARS FOR ONE SERIES? What kind of dumb comparison is that? I didn't sign up to run 30 km, Stephano did. I think he made an agreement, broke it, and deserves to get punished for it. So if you sign up for a marathon you should finish it no matter what and if you get tired people have the right to bitch at you. Okay. ROFL Why do you keep comparing this to a marathon? Marathon's are usually voluntary stuff where there is no money involved, this is completely different. I never said you shouldn't be allowed to forfeit (where the hell are you getting that from?), but if you do, you should be punished because you failed to uphold your agreement. Obviously you can't force him to do something, but there is a thing called reprecussions in the world. He lost 700 dollars because they bumped him to 4th place and I think that's perfectly reasonable as he did not perform.
And I'm saying that was a good thing...wtf. I'm arguing against the people who think Stephano shouldn't have been punished
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It's unfortunate anytime a player must forfeit from a tournament, even more so when it is the finals. Regarding the the situation, ONOG did the best they could with the circumstance at hand. They were able to have a finals play out. As Chill stated earlier, I agree that tournaments should address this issue and have a plan ready in case a scenario such as this were to occur again. As for the players, I understand that they want to compete in many online tournaments for prize money, fame, etc., however, they should try to be more cautious not to overbook themselves for tournaments causing delays and other issues for the tournament organizers.
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imo he should have been banned from the tournament without prize money, but he doesn't deserve negative comments from the community, because it's his own choice to draw a line somewhere.
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Why isnt the ONOG caster sentence about french people in the OP ?
"stephano the french pride - french doing what the french do best and surrender, keeping the record in surrendering"
I mean, if you want drama, this is pretty good too
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Seems like foreign teams need to recruit better managers. Everything about the matter in hand seems unprofessional.
On January 31 2012 07:20 tekos44 wrote:
Why isnt the ONOG caster sentence about french people in the OP ?
"stephano the french pride - french doing what the french do best and surrender, keeping the record in surrendering"
I mean, if you want drama, this is pretty good too
Wow did that really happen? This is very disappointing. Not really a good way to promote esports & the foreign scene.
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Stephano was put in a no-win situation.
He either forfeit (and get screwed by the tournament official who made up rule on the fly - read the MrBitter response in the orginal thread).
He plays the game by alternating 6pools and 12 drone rushes - he would still be screwed by the tournament officials cause:
Quoting:
...we have to be an organization that puts the fans first. Given that principle, I came to the decision to penalize Stephano and move him to 4th place,... . I dont think fans would like four 6 pools or drone rushes... So he might have been penalized too.
To be honest all tournaments need sound rules. There were no rules posted about this tournament - only the format and map pool.
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Rick Perry forfeited his Republican Nomination because he was losing (as Stephano was already at a disadvantage and was losing because he was tired). Should Rick Perry be kicked out of Texas Governor because he was unprofessional (punishing Stephano and giving him 4th place when he earned 2nd place)?
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ONOG did the only thing they could. Good decision.
On January 31 2012 07:21 Frankon wrote:Stephano was put in a no-win situation. He either forfeit (and get screwed by the tournament official who made up rule on the fly - read the MrBitter response in the orginal thread). He plays the game by alternating 6pools and 12 drone rushes - he would still be screwed by the tournament officials cause: Quoting: Show nested quote +...we have to be an organization that puts the fans first. Given that principle, I came to the decision to penalize Stephano and move him to 4th place,... . I dont think fans would like four 6 pools or drone rushes... So he might have been penalized too. To be honest all tournaments need sound rules. There were no rules posted about this tournament - only the format and map pool.
There's such a thing as common sense. You're playing a tournament held for barcrafts in _America_. You should expect to play late at night in Europe, because that's when the actual barcraft happens. If you can't hold that promise, you shouldn't sign up. If you do decide to ruin their tournament by dropping out in the finals, instead of at the start, this is an entirely reasonable thing to do for an organisation.
These organizations provide entertainment and try to make money with it. Players fucking with that deserve nothing.
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On January 31 2012 07:18 s4life wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 07:16 Itsmedudeman wrote:On January 31 2012 07:15 s4life wrote:On January 31 2012 07:07 Itsmedudeman wrote:On January 31 2012 06:19 s4life wrote:On January 31 2012 06:03 nicknup wrote:
Tennis players forfeit games in tournaments they have commited to participate due to injuries and beeing tired and no one bash then. Sure, things out of control are pretty reasonable excuses not to play -- like a pulled muscle f.e. -- but come on, Stephano accepted the invitation and knew perfectly well what he was getting into, he should have planned for it.. on top of that made wait for him an hour or so.. that's just him being completely unprofessional. No, you can forfeit if you're exhausted and can't continue. Same thing as stephano. Of course you can, but in that case you absolutely pay a price for it. A professional tennis player getting exhausted and forfeiting because of it is a huge deal, it means the player is pretty irresponsible with his training, preparation and on top of that show lack of temperance. He won't get any invites anytime soon. No, actually, no one bitches about it. They point out that they have to work at their conditioning, but no one is gonna walk up to them and tell them they're unprofessional and should be punished. Actually, yes, tired players who quit because of it absolutely lose the respect of their peers, fans and organizers.. that's how it works in any sport.
Djokovic retired from a major a few years back due to exhaustion. I don't ever remember a single article or thread written about how he's unprofessional and that he should be punished.
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On January 31 2012 07:18 Kahlgar wrote:
people in the sc2 community are such drama queens
While that is partly true, I think it's also notable that quite a few SC2 pros lack the professionalism we are used to from BW. Whether that is not leaving in the finals of a tournament, not probe rushing to throw away a game, not surrendering at ~160 supply (Idra vs Jijaki) or not BMing each other in public is irrelevant.
Sadly pros are forgiven too quickly as there's too many tournaments to really punish them for behaving like that. Well, then again people like WhiteRa are loved for a reason, he's never changed -- and I mean that in the best way possible.
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On January 31 2012 07:21 Zairair wrote:
Rick Perry forfeited his Republican Nomination because he was losing (as Stephano was already at a disadvantage and was losing because he was tired). Should Rick Perry be kicked out of Texas Governor because he was unprofessional (punishing Stephano and giving him 4th place when he earned 2nd place)?
Rick Perry gave up and gets nothing. In the same manner, it makes perfect sense that if you forfeit a tournament, you forfeit it and get nothing.
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Pfff teamliquid troll QQ raj so much for nothing...
It was really late in France, and he already play an entired tournament before... it is normal than he can be tired.
Also, the stream was boring and between each game they had like 20min of wait with a picture and no talk.
Why this deserve a news ?
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On January 31 2012 07:20 tekos44 wrote:
Why isnt the ONOG caster sentence about french people in the OP ?
"stephano the french pride - french doing what the french do best and surrender, keeping the record in surrendering"
I mean, if you want drama, this is pretty good too
Wow really ? its the real drama here
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On January 31 2012 07:21 Zairair wrote:
Rick Perry forfeited his Republican Nomination because he was losing (as Stephano was already at a disadvantage and was losing because he was tired). Should Rick Perry be kicked out of Texas Governor because he was unprofessional (punishing Stephano and giving him 4th place when he earned 2nd place)?
What the heck?
Rick Perry was spending a shitload of money on his campaign and (thankfully) getting nowhere.
Terrible analogy.
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On January 31 2012 07:23 Tobberoth wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2012 07:21 Zairair wrote:
Rick Perry forfeited his Republican Nomination because he was losing (as Stephano was already at a disadvantage and was losing because he was tired). Should Rick Perry be kicked out of Texas Governor because he was unprofessional (punishing Stephano and giving him 4th place when he earned 2nd place)? Rick Perry gave up and gets nothing. In the same manner, it makes perfect sense that if you forfeit a tournament, you forfeit it and get nothing.
Gets nothing is not the same as "loses what he earned". Loses what he earned is worse. Losing what he earned is losing his Texas Governorship which no government official would choose to strip him of that title.
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The comparison between tennis players and this situation is ridiculous. And Djokovic is one of the whiniest players out there, and let me also remind you that he just won the longest match in a grand final in history. I think he learned from that experience and showed us his character this year. Stephano needs to learn from this MISTAKE and show us his character next tournament. No one likes a quitter.
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To everyone comparing this to the naniwa incident, it's VERY diffrent in a key point.
This game actually mattered.
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EPT
