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Please discuss IdrA and Sen in Code S January in this thread. | ||
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Disposition1989
Canada270 Posts
On December 14 2011 19:28 Redox wrote: There are numerous examples of people NOT playing their heart out no matter what in high profile tournemants. This includes Idra btw, who has just been invited for unclear reasons into code S. why dont you wait for a clear reason then? | ||
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LimeNade
United States2125 Posts
On December 14 2011 19:28 Redox wrote: There are numerous examples of people NOT playing their heart out no matter what in high profile tournemants. This includes Idra btw, who has just been invited for unclear reasons into code S. BECAUSE you are being completely IGNORANT to the korean culture and pro gaming. They CANNOT show weakness on this issue with the background issues they have had lately in the industry. Pro gaming is a SPORT in korea its televised, its still growing, THEY are trying to still GET fans from brood war to come over to Sc2 and dont need some little brat not even giving them a show to get fans to pay for PRIZES that naniwa needs to even have anything to play for. | ||
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
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Derrida
2885 Posts
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poorcloud
Singapore2748 Posts
On December 14 2011 19:26 Ace.Xile wrote: I'm kind of curious, do people like you expect players to just start putting on shows, and instead of being actual professionals becoming purely entertainers. Common sense would say that there was really nothing to gain from the game with nestea, so people essentially are pissed because Naniwa didn't see the point as just trying to go out and act like the game mattered, at what point are people going to realize they're just treading the line before playing a game professionally to compete, and playing a game to just entertain people despite it's lack of significance. So we should not expect F1 drivers to not bother to race on the last day of the race if it dosen't matter anymore? So the driver is justified in just leaving after the first lap of the race since he dosen't feel like it? I don't understand why everyone says its the tournaments fault for having meaningless games when EVERY PROFESSIONAL SPORTS LEAGUE IN THE WORLD has such meaningless games. All of us want E-sports to be considered legitimate. To make it professional, you have to enforce such rules. Harsh for Naniwa though, a warning would have been good enough. Some players may not like the format. You give proper feedback, not throw away the game... | ||
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Surili
United Kingdom1141 Posts
Don't make professionals play meaningless matches. The word pro means to do something as a job, ie to be paid for it (monetary or reward). To say that he isn't fit to be a progamer when he was playing a game that he wasn't playing for money (or any reward) is inconsistent. | ||
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Serpico
4285 Posts
On December 14 2011 19:30 baoluvboa wrote: Difference between unprofessionalism and playful entertainment. So the player that's on the losing end is suddenly ok and how they're treated is irrelevant? I remember people bitching about how nestea was practicing for the games the night prior and naniwa robbed him of all that effort, but making the other player feel bad by /dancing isnt important now? Also "entertainment" is in the eye of the beholder. I was entertained by the probe rush. | ||
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Ace.Xile
United States286 Posts
On December 14 2011 19:29 Ghanburighan wrote: People like me.. I wonder what that means. I've written about this before here, but it's simple. We don't accept the Nestea v Naniwa games as meaningless. There was a storyline in play, it determined the loser of the group, it contributed to ELO/GSL points that determines future tournament invites and there were tons of people tuning in to watch that scheduled match. They should have played their hearts out, rather than saved strategies to get more money. I mean at this point you're pretty much just expecting that the driving force for competitive e sports should be putting on a good show regardless of situation, which is kind of... anti professionalism in itself, or at least in terms of competitiveness. It just seems like you're expecting the players to make games epic and worry more about how the viewers will view them, and you almost hate on players who think more competitively. | ||
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aebriol
Norway2066 Posts
On December 14 2011 19:30 Angelbelow wrote: Thanks for the clarification, what was the Choya situation? I dont know what happened with him. Choya was playing rock paper scissors on the ladder in order to get rid of his bonus pool, so his points would be up to date. Because the bonus pool forces you to play a relatively high number of ladder games in order to be placed in the ladder where your skill dictates you should be. He was caught. He apologized. He was banned for 1 season of the next tournament (GSTL ). | ||
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Deleted User 137586
7859 Posts
On December 14 2011 19:32 Surili wrote: And i was just about to ask my brother to get me a premium plus pass for christmas, gonna go tell him not to now. Don't make professionals play meaningless matches. The word pro means to do something as a job, ie to be paid for it (monetary or reward). To say that he isn't fit to be a progamer when he was playing a game that he wasn't playing for money (or any reward) is inconsistent. You know what else is inconsistent, expecting people to read your posts if you don't read theirs. | ||
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Kennigit
Canada19447 Posts
On December 14 2011 19:15 Snowbear wrote: You are a mod from the teamliquid forums. You can deny the participation of someone in the forums if you found them to be unfit to be a forum poster. I think its a bit different since we are very upfront and open about that rule and there are literally tens of thousands of cases to study from... | ||
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Rannasha
Netherlands2398 Posts
On December 14 2011 19:30 Angelbelow wrote: Thanks for the clarification, what was the Choya situation? I dont know what happened with him. Choya win-trade on the ladder (by doing online rock-paper-scissors with his opponents to determine the winner), because it was the most time-efficient way to get MMR up. Now the ladder isn't GSL (similarly as to how the Korean Weekly tournament where Coca matchfixed was a different tournament), but GOM required a certain ladder rating before you could enter into the qualifiers. So in a way, Choya tried to cheat his way into the qualifiers. He was punished by a "slap on the wrist", mostly. He had to apologize and was banned from the GSTL for 1 season, but there were no reprecussions for his GSL run. | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
T/N : When GOM announced the new format of GSL tour 2012. They planned out total 2 seeds to Code S and 2 seeds to Code A. Two seeds are sponsor seeds which are given to Idra and Sen. Two seeds are up/down seeds that will be given out to top performing non-Korea players. Therefore Idra and Sen did not suddenly get in that Naniwa's punishment is a separate issue. Sen and Idra going to GSL doesn't have anything to do with Naniwa (according to Mr. Chae at least). Why are people making this about Naniwa? | ||
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zeru
8156 Posts
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Ace.Xile
United States286 Posts
On December 14 2011 19:32 poorcloud wrote: So we should not expect F1 drivers to not bother to race on the last day of the race if it dosen't matter anymore? So the driver is justified in just leaving after the first lap of the race since he dosen't feel like it? I don't understand why everyone says its the tournaments fault for having meaningless games when EVERY PROFESSIONAL SPORTS LEAGUE IN THE WORLD has such meaningless games. All of us want E-sports to be considered legitimate. To make it professional, you have to enforce such rules. Harsh for Naniwa though, a warning would have been good enough. Some players may not like the format. You give proper feedback, not throw away the game... But there's nothing professional about an organization saying that if you don't try 100% in every game despite the fact that it may be meaningless, we will ban you from our organization. That type of format is just pretty much forcing players to cater to viewers in situations like the naniwa nestea one, and actually pretty much pushing them in the direction of providing entertainment rather than competition. If the game is pointless, you're pretty much forced to attempt some sort of resemblance of a game, and at this point it becomes more forced acting rather than competitive play. | ||
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nam nam
Sweden4672 Posts
On December 14 2011 18:28 Fionn wrote: So? Jinro made Ro4 twice. Does that mean GOM should give him the spot for his better performances than Idra? So if you know you are about to fall out of Code S, quit the league and go to another country for a few months, then return to take your rightful place. Sounds logical. | ||
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aebriol
Norway2066 Posts
On December 14 2011 19:32 Surili wrote: And i was just about to ask my brother to get me a premium plus pass for christmas, gonna go tell him not to now. Don't make professionals play meaningless matches. The word pro means to do something as a job, ie to be paid for it (monetary or reward). To say that he isn't fit to be a progamer when he was playing a game that he wasn't playing for money (or any reward) is inconsistent. It is not. It happens in a ton of sports that players have to play meaningless placement matches. World cup in soccer for example. I don't understand why people think this is something unique to e-sports that players play meaningless matches? It happens in most sports that have a group stage ... (ie, not tennis or other tournaments that usually just have a direct knockout style). | ||
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flakmonkey
Australia254 Posts
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Snorkle
United States1648 Posts
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ThePlayer33
Australia2378 Posts
On December 14 2011 18:58 Mioraka wrote: It's their league, they can do whatever they want with it and owe no obligation. HOWEVER, with that being said, I don't like this decision AT ALL. If they want to take the hardcore approach, ban Naniwa, I don't feel like they should, but it's definitely reasonable and they have the rights to do it. But just handing out his Code S spots to Idra and Sen......they are good players, but I can't help but to feel they are just trying to capture foreign audience in a cheap way with this move. It all makes sense: Huk is out of Code S at least for now, and they need some foreigners to fill the void so foreigners will watch the games. It used to be Naniwa, but now with him gone they need someone, and they pick Idra. It's a cheap move, I LOVE Idra being in Code S. But its not fair at all. Pretty much all that | ||
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