EPT[MLG] Providence - Finale - Page 4
| Forum Index > SC2 General |
We have issued a clarification to this article after discussion with staff, read here - Heyoka | ||
|
Aurorajp
Canada43 Posts
| ||
|
weedhydra
28 Posts
| ||
|
S2Lunar
1051 Posts
The two tournaments are completely different, with Providence being much much more competitive, with dozens of the best Koreans and foreigners. At Dallas there were very few good players and no Koreans. The open bracket was much much easier back then, I think that Leenocks win at Providence is tons more impressive than NanI's win at Dallas. Makes no sence to me... Also Leenock had ONE 2-1 game at Providence, against MMA... you may want to reword that.. | ||
|
jmbthirteen
United States10734 Posts
On November 28 2011 18:04 bennyaus wrote: All of Liquid's 'homegrown' player results (let's exclude Puma, HuK, Hero, Zenio from this because they have done most of their SC2 development outside of EG and Liquid) are better than all of EG's 'homegrown' player results, in both this tournament and over the course of the entire year. Fact. Liquid does not have a team house and does not pay their players as much as EG. Fact. Incontrol, Strifecro, LZgamer, and to a lesser extent, Axslav, do not really deserve to be considered pro-gamers based on results given they are consistently beaten by people who get comparatively no support for their e-sports careers. I believe that is the point. I think Idra would be considered the most accomplished of the "homegrown" on both teams. And what the write up left out is DeMusliM who has benefited GREATLY from the team house. He just hasnt been at the last two MLGs, but at Raleigh, he tore it up and got a Code A seed. He's also done very well in NASL (only loss due to no show) and pulled a top 8 at i44 after a break no less. EG did about as well as I expected at this past MLG. I think Idra and Huk can do better, but they still got top 8 in a ridiculous field. And Puma was on a tear until he had to face Idra. The rest of the team just isn't on that level, not many players are. People used to say EG was only Idra. Then just Idra and Puma. Then just Idra, Puma and Huk. Now they are just Idra, Puma, Huk and DeMusliM. Seriously, how far is this going to go? Not many teams can stack up against that. Let's be honest here, what is the last thing Jinro or TLO did? Liquid is being carried by Ret, Hero and to a slightly lesser extent Sheth. And only Ret is a 'homegrown' guy. Tyler, TLO and Jinro haven't done anything in months. I love those guys, but its the truth. Just like for Incontrol, StrifeCro, LZgamer, Axslav and Machine. EG has decisions to make on their roster. I'd say Incontrol (love him or hate him, he does so much for that team outside his play. his coaching is very underrated imo) and Machine are safe. They have still only been in the house for what 5 months now? And more recently they have moved to the EU and KR ladders and Geoff was saying Puma sets them up with practice partners on KR. Team houses aren't overnight things, they take time. And some players just wont cut it. To say the house hasn't been worth it, is well, dumb. Its too soon to tell. EG is arguably the strongest non Korean team right now and if thats because their top 4 carry them, well is that really a bad thing? | ||
|
dcemuser
United States3248 Posts
He spends like 50% of the upper portion of the article talking badly about North American middle of the road players like dde, State, and the EG players. Apparently he hasn't ever looked at the MLG open bracket before because their performances are nothing new. We know they're pretty good, they're just not on the same level as the 'top' foreigners. The EG team house section is frankly awful. As I was reading this I was like "holy shit how is this trash on the front page of TL?". I usually have massive respect for the TL writers and I love the TL articles, but this is just awful. You focus so much on the high and mighty 'gods' like Nestea and MVP that anyone who isn't at least in the top 10 foreign players is trash to you. Additionally, you completely forgot Demulism, who went into the team house right after recovering from his injury. His play has been amazing since then but he wasn't available to attend MLG. You really need to rethink your perspective and consider who you are hurting with sections like that. There will always be a tier of players, and if you consider everyone outside the top 2% terrible and trashy, then you'll never be a worthy writer for anything besides GSL articles. | ||
|
seiferoth10
3362 Posts
Other than that good article, but that section just seemed like a publicity stunt to me. Really need to reconsider some writers. | ||
|
Frankon
3054 Posts
On November 28 2011 18:16 blade55555 wrote: I also disagree with the team house statement. I bet if Idra didn't have the team house he would still be playing his 4 hours a day like he did on his own. I imagine just having people who play starcraft around you is a lot more motivating then being home by yourself (or with family). Pretty much I disagree with your whole EG thing but whatever if that's what you think ok. Otherwise well written article  Am I the only one who read that part as "Idra and Puma have benefited from the teamhouse. The rest of EG rooster didn't" Still I must admit that i dont agree with the part "I can't shake the feeling that they would do well regardless of where they were living" in confusecrib post. If it wasn't for the The EG | ||
|
jmbthirteen
United States10734 Posts
On November 28 2011 18:34 Frankon wrote: Am I the only one who read that part as "Idra and Puma have benefited from the teamhouse. The rest of EG rooster didn't" Still I must admit that i dont agree with the part "I can't shake the feeling that they would do well regardless of where they were living" in confusecrib post. If it wasn't for the The EG Yeah i think you are the only one that reads it like that. It says that they are carried by Huk and Puma (who don't live in the team house) and Idra (who was always this good, but just in a slump for a bit). And I disagree on this notion that the rest of the house hasn't shown improvement. StrifeCro went way further then I thought he would. Also he qualified for IEM NY, as did Axslav. Machine has been doing better as well. He and Axslav always do well in the Playhem tournaments. We need to remember where these players were before the teamhouse. And LZgamer shouldn't be mentioned as a teamhouse guy as he doesn't live in it. Its also funny how incontrols result was "down right disturbing" because he lost to State (who finished top 32 when over 20 Koreans came and State is a pretty good player) and StrifeCro, a teammate who knows inc's play inside out. Inc gets a lot of shit but people forget that he beat Choya at the same tournament where Tyler did, who still gets praise for doing it. | ||
|
s3183529
Australia707 Posts
| ||
|
iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
calling out EG house.. ok. Well TL abandoned korea cause their results were even worse there so maybe the investment of TL / oGs was a bad idea as well? A worse idea even... but that'd be a dumb thing to say.. especially on an official article. We have had the house for 3 months and the results have gotten a helluva lot better but you are going to say it was a waste? get real. | ||
|
fisheer
Poland49 Posts
| ||
|
Inky87
United States533 Posts
On November 28 2011 18:49 iNcontroL wrote: wow calling out EG house.. ok. Well TL abandoned korea cause their results were even worse there so maybe the investment of TL / oGs was a bad idea as well? A worse idea even... but that'd be a dumb thing to say.. especially on an official article. We have had the house for 3 months and the results have gotten a helluva lot better but you are going to say it was a waste? get real. Don't worry, man. Anyone with half a brain understands that the EG house is a great thing for everyone involved and no doubt everyone on the team has improved because of it. The writer is completely clueless. | ||
|
FlukyS
Ireland485 Posts
On November 28 2011 18:49 iNcontroL wrote: wow calling out EG house.. ok. Well TL abandoned korea cause their results were even worse there so maybe the investment of TL / oGs was a bad idea as well? A worse idea even... but that'd be a dumb thing to say.. especially on an official article. We have had the house for 3 months and the results have gotten a helluva lot better but you are going to say it was a waste? get real. Well dude we may call out the EG house but id still rate EG as one of the nicest teams in SC2 and id still say you are one of the best personalities even with all the crap you get. Its just a case of picking up some players and trimming some other ones sadly. Like there are loads of players who would probably benefit a lot more than the current EG roster from a team house environment and become the next top player IMO. Like imagine Saladin who was doing awesome recently if he had the backing of a major organisation. | ||
|
Fishriot
United States621 Posts
On another note, does anyone know if the author of this post is just a volunteer writer, or if he/she is a paid staff member of TL? | ||
|
aiuradun
Denmark115 Posts
I do belive that the rapid rise / fall of players are a bit concerning It might be due to sc2 still being really young, but i am more inclined to say it lacks 1 extra macro mechanic and pherhaps even an extra layer of micro, however HOTS's new unit seems to provide some aditional units that would be quite micro intensive and or require more multi tasking, So what i would like to se in sc2's future pherhaps in legacy of the void would be one more macro mechanic for each of the 3 races to just make the game these % harder overall and would really seperate the good from the great | ||
|
mordk
Chile8385 Posts
The article makes a personal interpretation (which might be exaggerated, yes), about data that isn't false at all. Truth is EG's stars do well while the other's players results are going lower each tournament. I think the team house is way too young to be considered but that's just me, the author's opinion is different. I agree with the author though, in that Idra's, Puma's and Huk's performance would probably be the same if the team house didn't exist. As for Demuslim, we can only know once he actually starts playing in big tournaments again, I think he's really good and all, but we have to see it. What people need to do, is stop saying the article called the teamhouse "trash" or some other things I'm reading here, heads up: It didn't. Particularly talking about InControl... sigh... don't start the rabble dude, you're better than this... | ||
|
Yaki
France4234 Posts
| ||
|
trexbqs
Malaysia1731 Posts
Thanks. | ||
|
darkscream
Canada2310 Posts
Liquid does worse than EG you can't explain that! nice article except for the random pooping on EG though, every team has lower level players who don't produce top-end results and some who are "golden boys", liquid included >_> | ||
|
Zlasher
United States9129 Posts
A practice house does not results make. Like others have mentioned, Idra was slumping HARD around the time of Anaheim, and it brings him back up to the status at which we expect Idra, a truly top foreign contender in every tournament. Morrow has been non existant for months, Sjow, didn't he go two and out at MLG Providence? TLO? I think everyone in the house and not just that but the sponsors of that house will say its a worthy investment, to suggest that its not worth its cost just purely due to one MLG tournaments results, which were where you'd expect them to be, is a pretty ludicrous claim and sure adds to the fire of the whole TL EG rivalry just due to the fact that a full time TL Staffer writes this on a post-tournament writeup that hits the front featured section. Outside of that section, what is classified as an upset? Two players of generally regarded equal skill is an upset? If two koreans face each other specifically? Hero 2-1 over Puzzle? Oz 2-1 Ganzi? Puma over ANYONE? Do people regard Puma as an underdog or on even ground against top Korean players, as with Hero or Oz. Where does VileIllusion fit in all of this? A 15 year old who 2-0's  Future and 2-1's Fnatic's  KawaiiRice? Can that many people say they favored Illusion over Kawaiirice in Losers Round 7? And then his Championship bracket run of 2-0 over his teammate Spanishiwa who he had beaten in Open bracket round 1 two MLG's ago, followed by the streamed match that would bring him recognition where he 2-1's Sheth? | ||
| ||
