EPTThis type of match "dumping" is not even against the rules of the GSL. There should only be intern consequences.
CocA Incident Handled Correctly? - Page 18
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ThyHate
240 Posts
This type of match "dumping" is not even against the rules of the GSL. There should only be intern consequences. | ||
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fraktoasters
United States617 Posts
On November 17 2011 10:05 ohampatu wrote: I wish people stop calling this match fixing, its not. This is the same thing that happened to WhiteRa, in which his opponent was praised a Hero and even interviewed. Matchfixing would imply that he through the match for some kinda gain. There was no gain. Just wanted a Game 3. Pro's do this all the time, they plan around their maps, and will lose/create stupid builds/not try on maps they dont plan on winning. This kind of thinking really bothers me. All people can see is right in front of their eyes. First of all, match fixing is when someone throws a game, period. It's not required that there be an obvious gain for someone. So this is match fixing. Second, how do you even know that Coca doesn't have anything to gain? What if Byun and Coca made an agreement that Coca would do this and then the next time they play, Byun would give him the series? (this kind of match fixing agreement does happen in other sports). You don't know, maybe Slayers knows, maybe they don't but they want to cut it off before these small agreements turn into a big web of lies. And the "other people do it too so it's ok" argument is a pretty bad one. | ||
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SpoR
United States1542 Posts
On November 17 2011 19:59 Rekrul wrote: it's impressive how consistently retarded you are, you never miss a beat That's a nice argument you have there. | ||
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figq
12519 Posts
On November 18 2011 07:00 fraktoasters wrote: No, sometimes things aren't right in front of your eyes, and you have to put them in full context to comprehend them. Next thing you know, you end up throwing in jail someone who was shooting a gun at another man, even if they were just filming a movie, because: "shooting people is bad, okay??!?!".This kind of thinking really bothers me. All people can see is right in front of their eyes. | ||
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latan
740 Posts
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KingVietKong
United States170 Posts
On November 18 2011 07:16 figq wrote: No, sometimes things aren't right in front of your eyes, and you have to put them in full context to comprehend them. Next thing you know, you end up throwing in jail someone who was shooting a gun at another man, even if they were just filming a movie, because: "shooting people is bad, okay??!?!". Your analogy is... incomprehensibly bad. It doesn't fit this situation at all, has nothing to do with what we're talking about, and you even went so far as to only quote one line from the guy's post then claim superiority. Also at what FUCKING POINT is someone going to shoot another person on a movie set then be put to jail? That's some seriously convoluted bullshit you've spouted there. Don't even try to say "It's a rhetorical question" or something of that ilk, it's just bad. Half assing an analogy doesn't all of a sudden legitimize your point. What context is there for match throwing that is legitimate, especially in the midst of a tournament? Was his family held hostage by byun's cronies and he had to throw the game to save their lives? I'm betting not. There is no justification for this behavior, especially in a tournament whose results have real consequences. Nothing makes this okay. The response was just and while it may have impacts on Coca, whether or not it has long term impacts on him is for him to decide. He can make the most of this time and practice his ass off and come right back, but if he's going to practice anti-competitive behavior in a spectator sport he doesn't deserve to be a part of it. | ||
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Hnnngg
United States1101 Posts
On November 18 2011 07:36 latan wrote: CoCa represents slayers and he forfeited a tournament win, that is a win that would've counted for slayers too, not just him. He didn't forfeit a win, a win was still in his grasp for game 3. Making a bo3 an actual 3 matches doesn't seem too harmful for a weekly. | ||
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parkin
1079 Posts
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Ballack
Norway821 Posts
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Kaien
Belgium178 Posts
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ETisME
12285 Posts
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StarBrift
Sweden1761 Posts
On November 17 2011 10:05 ohampatu wrote: Pro's do this all the time, they plan around their maps, and will lose/create stupid builds/not try on maps they dont plan on winning. No they dont. Because it would actually be ridiculously stupid to just forfeit a game that you have a chance to win. No matter how small tht percentage is. Because obviously you still get that map you want even after you lost. If you're arguing that people need to conserve their stamina for a single bo3 then those people need to uninstall the game cause they're not made out to play it competetively. The argument that he did this for practise is also ridiculous. Coca can get the same or better practise outside of tournaments. He wouldn't actually lose a tournament game on purpose to get a practise game against another player. I agree that this is not match fixing though. It's stupid and illogical but its not match fixing. | ||
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KenZo-
Faroe Islands190 Posts
On November 18 2011 08:33 ETisME wrote: hong kong gave 7 goals to china for them to get through the world cup qualifiers, no one (even in hk) spoke out against that. I think it's wrong to fix a match, sc2 football etc.. I mean, I know this has happened before in football, and has gotten a lot of attention sometimes, but u never see a team get disqualified for having forfeited a game, or say fixed it so that the other team could get in. I think throwing him out of code S is absolutely wrong, in any way. A clear warning, and maybe some intern punishment/fine imo. | ||
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MMello
279 Posts
Doesnt matter who he is.. he doesnt deserve to play at all for doing stuff like that. He shouldn't be allowed to play any MAJOR tourney period.. I thought this thread was made because the punishment wasnt strong enough... What are you guys thinking :S:S | ||
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dUTtrOACh
Canada2339 Posts
On November 18 2011 08:47 MMello wrote: I don't see a poll button saying Removed From E-Sports.. Doesnt matter who he is.. he doesnt deserve to play at all for doing stuff like that. He shouldn't be allowed to play any MAJOR tourney period.. I thought this thread was made because the punishment wasnt strong enough... What are you guys thinking :S:S Extremism at its finest. I think his punishment was quite fair. Some people think it was unfair, and demand a lesser punishment. You demand that he should have no career as a pro-gamer for 1 incident which he may not have considered to be bad when he did it. That's pretty fucked. That's like making 1 mistake in a job and never being able to do anything related to that line of work for the rest of your life. What the fuck, bro? | ||
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llKenZyll
United States853 Posts
But, I think that the way they handled this incident wasnt in a professional manner and they acted rather hastily. I think a suitable punishment would have been if they had just suspended the two from the tournament instead of, again, acting hastily. They probably acted hastily because of all the sudden drama that was drawn into the matter and the team felt pressured into doing something like they did. At the same time, they are setting an example because of the harsh punishment. Who would want to match fix now, seeing Cocoa being kicked off the team? So yeah, I don't know. I suppose its bad but it also has a good side to it. | ||
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jinorazi
Korea (South)4948 Posts
On November 18 2011 08:33 ETisME wrote: hong kong gave 7 goals to china for them to get through the world cup qualifiers, no one (even in hk) spoke out against that. are you saying match fixing is ok? or are you saying this isn't news worthy? it happens in boxing too, it happens in many, many sports but its all done discreetly. if caught, there are consequences since it is a bad thing to begin with. byun and coca are facing the consequences for their action, nothing more nothing less. i have no idea why people are saying, "its done all the time" and somehow think its alright. korean starcraft scene is not like the foreign starcraft scene when it comes to professionalism. | ||
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pt
United States813 Posts
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figq
12519 Posts
On November 18 2011 07:39 KingVietKong wrote: It's not in the midst of the tournament. It's first round of a replay-cast event, and of 16 matches only 6 were played, the others were walkovers, because the opponent didn't show up. Coca had busy schedule with the GSL and was going to forfeit too anyway, but wanted 3 games of practice vs Terran (next opponent was Protoss), so after winning game 2 he conceded to play one more ZvT. They disrespected the event by sending the replays, because this is more of a training session. But the end result in the bracket was going to be the same if they didn't send replays and just announce that Coca forfeits. They probably thought it was going to be entertaining, because the games were not staged, and fully competitive - and they were, for those of us who actually watched the event.Your analogy is... incomprehensibly bad. It doesn't fit this situation at all, has nothing to do with what we're talking about, and you even went so far as to only quote one line from the guy's post then claim superiority. Also at what FUCKING POINT is someone going to shoot another person on a movie set then be put to jail? That's some seriously convoluted bullshit you've spouted there. Don't even try to say "It's a rhetorical question" or something of that ilk, it's just bad. Half assing an analogy doesn't all of a sudden legitimize your point. What context is there for match throwing that is legitimate, especially in the midst of a tournament? Was his family held hostage by byun's cronies and he had to throw the game to save their lives? I'm betting not. There is no justification for this behavior, especially in a tournament whose results have real consequences. Nothing makes this okay. The response was just and while it may have impacts on Coca, whether or not it has long term impacts on him is for him to decide. He can make the most of this time and practice his ass off and come right back, but if he's going to practice anti-competitive behavior in a spectator sport he doesn't deserve to be a part of it. I hope my post didn't sound condescending, and apologize if it did. I understand it's very hard to put in perspective something without being aware of the details. It wasn't a comment addressed specifically at the author of the quote, but at the bulk of the posters who assume everything is clear, because they've only scratched the surface of the story. | ||
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Juvant
United States723 Posts
On November 18 2011 08:30 Kaien wrote: DeMusliM did the same for IdrA in another tournement When did this happen? And where is the confirmation? | ||
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