EPT... I'm sorry, why is this not a fair comparison?
BW Teams playing Starcraft 2 - Page 104
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raviy
Australia207 Posts
... I'm sorry, why is this not a fair comparison? | ||
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Demonhunter04
1530 Posts
On October 30 2011 10:10 VirgilSC2 wrote: I think he was saying Polt is a SlayerS terran killer Ah ok that makes more sense..but Polt hasnt played vs other SlayerS terrans except for a single game vs Taeja... | ||
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Talin
Montenegro10532 Posts
On October 30 2011 10:06 cklrkzk wrote: Polt,Super tournament winner,killer of the SlayerS terrans and MMA. So basically he won a tournament, and BW progamers (or people who weren't even progamers) won all the other ones, let's give this a rest it's really not an argument you can ever win. -_- | ||
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MuK_x
743 Posts
On October 30 2011 10:20 Demonhunter04 wrote: Ah ok that makes more sense..but Polt hasnt played vs other SlayerS terrans except for a single game vs Taeja... are you sure?Polt managed to BoxeR in GSL season 3. | ||
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Bobster
Germany3075 Posts
On October 30 2011 09:44 VPCursed wrote: ? are u fucking serious? THORZAIN NANIWA STEPHANO lol, don't bother with these people. When Stephano became noticeable and gained notoriety, the haters said that he hadn't won anything of note yet. "Let's see him win a big tournament during the next... year or so, let's see him win against Koreans." When Stephano won IPL3 two weeks later, the haters said it was a fluke and winning against MMA was a fluke and MMA was tired.Also, those Koreans weren't the best Koreans. "Winning only one tournament doesn't prove anything. He won't win anything again. Winning against those Koreans doesn't prove anything." When Stephano won ESCW a week after that, the haters said the opponents he beat were weak. Only Mana. Only MarineKingPrime. "MarineKingPrime didn't play his best. This doesn't prove anything. He has to win a GSL." Fuck it, I'm sick and tired of people moving the goalposts just to keep their fucking precious Koreans on a pedestal and refuse a non-Korean the same kind of respect. Jesus fucking Christ, you people will never be happy. Stephano could win a GSL and you would find something to bitch about, to downplay, to attempt and discredit him, make his victory mean less. Sick and tired of it. | ||
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zarepath
United States1626 Posts
EDIT: Huk didn't play at anything close to a pro BW level. | ||
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Silidons
United States2813 Posts
On October 30 2011 08:44 PrinceXizor wrote: Or that he connected more with SC2 than BW. OR that his skill continued to improve from his BW days, Or that he picked the race in SC2 thats advancing at the fastest pace strategy wise, OR that he's not actual Super good and the scene is still growing, OR any number of reasons that is less insulting to the forums in which you are posting. I'm sorry that the most well thought out answer is the most insulting, that's how life is sometimes. Do you think he would be as good if he didn't play BW? Who is the best player who didn't play BW? There are none in any major tournaments that are decent at all. WC3 players don't count because that also took skill to play. | ||
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figq
12519 Posts
On October 30 2011 10:05 VirgilSC2 wrote: Stephano comes from WC3 actually. What you are right about is that young players can just be good at RTS without ever having played BW, obviously. Which also means if they begin playing BW they could be good at it. I'm very curious how Stephano would do in BW. He might have been the savior of the foreign BW scene, if he was in BW instead of SC2, who knows.This whole "BW Players are better" argument is just silly. Starcraft 2 is only a year old, and chances are most players who are old enough to compete professionally were around to at least play Brood War. We're already starting to see SOME SC2 players of immense skill come from non-RTS backgrounds, such as Leenock, Stephano, and the other younger players in the scene. Give it another year, two, maybe even three and we'll start to see more and more young talent that pick up the game without having played Brood War, I guarantee it. But, no, the "BW Players are better" argument is not silly, as it doesn't claim BW-experience is required for someone to be good. Rather, it claims the top BW players are better in SC2 than those who played BW and were worse. Now, the SC2 scene is in relative nice and friendly balance - with players of all kinds being at a good stance, like ex-BW B-teamers, old legends, WC3 players etc; though the very very top is mostly ex-BW progamers of low tiers. The argument is that right now - not in 5 years or a decade - if the BW top players actually come to this SC2 scene, they would smash and wreck it to complete genocide. That's not really such a silly argument, having already the proof that good BW players always become top SC2 players. And I think it only remains to be seen if the BW players would even be interested enough to stay in such a scene, and how SC2 will develop as a game - would it allow to show the true difference in skill, which in BW is gigantic. | ||
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Megaliskuu
United States5123 Posts
On October 30 2011 10:25 zarepath wrote: Huk, Stephano didn't play BW. Just fuel for the fire. EDIT: Huk didn't play at anything close to a pro BW level. He was B thats good enough to go pro in sc2 lol. And yes the lack of respect for stephano is really shitty, guy wins 2 major tournaments, while its not gsl, in the sphere of foreigner gamers, he is the best. | ||
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Musou
1375 Posts
On October 30 2011 09:01 PrinceXizor wrote: the probable i see with flash bisu and jaedong in SC2 is that they are older, and would have to play catchup for 3-4 years of SC2 experience that everyone will have (minimum) by the time the switch for them happens, they will be older and unable to perform at the level required of them to completely dominate, especially with new young talent funneling into SC2. so will a flash 3-4 years from now be as dominant in SC2 as he was in BW a year ago? I don't think he would be. meanwhile players like baby, who have the talent to be a great in BW, have plenty of time to catch up in SC2 age wise, as well as much more of a reason to switch now-ish. I hope this is a joke.. or you just didn't do your research before posting. You realize despite all of Flash's accomplishments that he is only 19, right? He's younger than most of the current SC2 pros. Nestea is 30 and still dominates. What makes you think even in 3-4 years that Flash would be unable to perform at that level? | ||
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VPCursed
1044 Posts
On October 30 2011 10:24 Bobster wrote: lol, don't bother with these people. When Stephano became noticeable and gained notoriety, the haters said that he hadn't won anything of note yet. "Let's see him win a big tournament during the next... year or so, let's see him win against Koreans." When Stephano won IPL3 two weeks later, the haters said it was a fluke and winning against MMA was a fluke and MMA was tired.Also, those Koreans weren't the best Koreans. "Winning only one tournament doesn't prove anything. He won't win anything again. Winning against those Koreans doesn't prove anything." When Stephano won ESCW a week after that, the haters said the opponents he beat were weak. Only Mana. Only MarineKingPrime. "MarineKingPrime didn't play his best. This doesn't prove anything. He has to win a GSL." Fuck it, I'm sick and tired of people moving the goalposts just to keep their fucking precious Koreans on a pedestal and refuse a non-Korean the same kind of respect. Jesus fucking Christ, you people will never be happy. Stephano could win a GSL and you would find something to bitch about, to downplay, to attempt and discredit him, make his victory mean less. Sick and tired of it. ye, im not going to argue, there is no reason too, the facts are there.. they just refuse to look or refute it. | ||
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Demonhunter04
1530 Posts
On October 30 2011 10:23 cklrkzk wrote: are you sure?Polt managed to BoxeR in GSL season 3. I feel bad for BoxeR....but he's pretty far from the top now. | ||
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Loki57
United States292 Posts
On October 30 2011 10:24 Bobster wrote: lol, don't bother with these people. When Stephano became noticeable and gained notoriety, the haters said that he hadn't won anything of note yet. "Let's see him win a big tournament during the next... year or so, let's see him win against Koreans." When Stephano won IPL3 two weeks later, the haters said it was a fluke and winning against MMA was a fluke and MMA was tired.Also, those Koreans weren't the best Koreans. "Winning only one tournament doesn't prove anything. He won't win anything again. Winning against those Koreans doesn't prove anything." When Stephano won ESCW a week after that, the haters said the opponents he beat were weak. Only Mana. Only MarineKingPrime. "MarineKingPrime didn't play his best. This doesn't prove anything. He has to win a GSL." Fuck it, I'm sick and tired of people moving the goalposts just to keep their fucking precious Koreans on a pedestal and refuse a non-Korean the same kind of respect. Jesus fucking Christ, you people will never be happy. Stephano could win a GSL and you would find something to bitch about, to downplay, to attempt and discredit him, make his victory mean less. Sick and tired of it. Stop acting like you're on some mission from god to "keep the haterz down." The people who say these things (myself included) are just trying to rationalize when fanboys are calling him top 3 zergs in the world which I keep hearing repeatedly about him. Is he a good player? Obviously. Has he made alot of money in the past month? Sure. Is he anywhere near winning a GSL? Not a chance. The kid has potential but he very clearly has a long way to go as evidenced by the latest MLG. Nobody is trying to "sell him short," we're just simply trying to be realistic about his skill level. | ||
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snakeeyez
United States1231 Posts
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setzer
United States3284 Posts
On October 30 2011 10:06 VirgilSC2 wrote: Well below S-Class Brood War players? Really? It wasn't that long ago that fOrGG won an MSL. EDIT: Typed OSL instead of MSL Really? Three years is quite a long time ago and forgg never lived up to the potential he showed after winning MSL and switching from lecaf oz to KT. S-class is not the same as Code-S S-class does not constitute the top 32 players like Code-S S-class is the top4 or 5 players who are consistently at the the top of KeSPA ranking and always perform well in either MSL/OSL/Proleague. | ||
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PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
On October 30 2011 09:50 Garnet wrote: What do you mean by "older"? Flash (born 1992) is younger than almost every SC2 pro's. flash is 20 in 3 years when/if he switches over he will be 23, a few years later (when he actually get enough practice to play against people practicing for 5 years) he will be 25. with flash's wrist issues, will he continue to be just as dominant at 25 as he has been at 16-19, in a new game he's had alot less practice in against people with more practice? he's younger now than the old sc2 players who won't be around in a few years yeah, but he has about 0 chance of switching now, and years after, after he hits a big slump in BW is when he would likely switch, which is about when leenock would likely have become the best zerg player, and MMA the best Terran, is when flash woul begin his pro career. and i don't think he would be able to dominate, he would be a good player probably, but not dominate. ALSO ForGG has been playing for over a year now. he was playing back at release. he was NOT only playing for a few months. also people really shouldn't be coming into this thread (in the SC2 section) insulting SC2 syaing it takes no skill and is easy ect when they don't want people from SC2 going into BW and say it's dying. | ||
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bertu
Brazil871 Posts
On October 30 2011 10:35 Musou wrote: I hope this is a joke.. or you just didn't do your research before posting. You realize despite all of Flash's accomplishments that he is only 19, right? He's younger than most of the current SC2 pros. Nestea is 30 and still dominates. What makes you think even in 3-4 years that Flash would be unable to perform at that level? Yeah, lol. They are all very young. jaedong 21 flash 19 bisu 22 jangbi 22 fantasy 20 zer0 21 hydra 20 best 22 | ||
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setzer
United States3284 Posts
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PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
On October 30 2011 10:51 setzer wrote: PrinceXizor, Flash started out going 15-3 as a professional and making the semi-finals of Daum beaing BISU. That you think it will take him years to compete against less talented people (no question Flash is the most talented RTS player right now) is pretty absurd and based on no factual evidence. i think that no matter the overall skill of a player, they will not be able to compete without experience. yeah flash started out really well, as a professional, but how long did he have to play BW before he became a professional, I doubt he just started playing when he got his license. I believe that, by the time flash switches, the top SC2 players will be younger players like MMA and Leenock, and not nestea/mvp. and that flash has been havign wrist issues for a while. so when flash switches/ if he ever does, players will have been practicing SC2 for 5+ years. i do not believe that flash can close that gap in under a year. no matter who he is. and by then flash will be older, 24-25, which in combination with his lack of experience will prevent him from dominating the scene in sc2. why is this so hard to understand for some people? yeah if flash switched today he would dominate, but he has no reason to and he won't he won't switch until it's the best career move for him to switch. btw i've watched BW for 5 years so i'm not just some new sc2 kid. ^^ | ||
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Tenhou
1052 Posts
On October 30 2011 10:46 PrinceXizor wrote: flash is 20 in 3 years when/if he switches over he will be 23, a few years later (when he actually get enough practice to play against people practicing for 5 years) he will be 25. with flash's wrist issues, will he continue to be just as dominant at 25 as he has been at 16-19, in a new game he's had alot less practice in against people with more practice? he's younger now than the old sc2 players who won't be around in a few years yeah, but he has about 0 chance of switching now, and years after, after he hits a big slump in BW is when he would likely switch, which is about when leenock would likely have become the best zerg player, and MMA the best Terran, is when flash woul begin his pro career. and i don't think he would be able to dominate, he would be a good player probably, but not dominate. ALSO ForGG has been playing for over a year now. he was playing back at release. he was NOT only playing for a few months. also people really shouldn't be coming into this thread (in the SC2 section) insulting SC2 syaing it takes no skill and is easy ect when they don't want people from SC2 going into BW and say it's dying. So why is it exactly that Flash is dominating in the BW scene when he's so young and all the other older pros get more practice and experience than? He won his first championship as a 15 year old teenager. Why didn't your logic applied then? | ||
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