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is it just me that is worried that there are TOO many changes in HoTS? tbh I don't really mind if they ultimately make gameplay better, as it's not exactly unfair to pros since they will all have to adapt anyways
Also, changing the game like this at the damage of progamers being more "uncomfortable" and possibly watchin poorer games for a short time will eventually pay off in the long run.
Some things look sexy some things don't... will miss some things, but hopefully (and so far) it does seem things are going into a good doirection.
THE MAPS ARE INCREDIBLE!!! HLY SHIT~! For blizzard at least haha. They look playable <3
AND OMG some of them are BRIGHT! instead of dark
Also is it just me or will terran have abunch of factory units? and there are no "infantry" units for prrotoss, they are all mechanical or air or etc. xD Zerg units look sort of dumb but the game isn't out yet
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On October 22 2011 10:00 Warpath wrote:
As far as the terran units go, i think the warhound(coughgoliatchcough) looks pretty sick cool.
The transforming hellion, meh but i guess it fills the right role (making hellions survive lategame)
The shredder thing WOULD be awesome if it didn't shut down+no friendly fire. (none of the other races have friendly fire =[ )
Protoss Psi Storm says hello =[
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On October 22 2011 10:19 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:
is it just me that is worried that there are TOO many changes in HoTS? tbh I don't really mind if they ultimately make gameplay better, as it's not exactly unfair to pros since they will all have to adapt anyways
Also, changing the game like this at the damage of progamers being more "uncomfortable" and possibly watchin poorer games for a short time will eventually pay off in the long run.
Some things look sexy some things don't... will miss some things, but hopefully (and so far) it does seem things are going into a good doirection.
THE MAPS ARE INCREDIBLE!!! HLY SHIT~! For blizzard at least haha. They look playable <3
AND OMG some of them are BRIGHT! instead of dark
Also is it just me or will terran have abunch of factory units? and there are no "infantry" units for prrotoss, they are all mechanical or air or etc. xD Zerg units look sort of dumb but the game isn't out yet
A bunch of factory units?
They're going to have Hellion, Siege Tank and War Hound. If you build a fusion core and an army and want to waste 600 minerals, you can also have one Thor.
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1:59 I see moving destructible rocks?
Or am I seeing things?
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On October 22 2011 10:17 Yosen3002 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 10:15 Demonhunter04 wrote:On October 22 2011 10:12 Liquid`Jinro wrote:
Which is why they should be added in the first place -.- But....without spider mines, is mech viable in TvP? Well the Shredder kinda is supposed to be the new spidermine and the thor replacement and the helliontransform will make mech an any matchup way more viable which imho is the whole point of these terran changes in the first place.
Good point :D.
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The op is so shitty
User was temp banned for this post.
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So I've put some thought in to the units (Zerg player in cae I have some bias I've not noticed) and thought I'd share them:
First I love the idea of being able to get Ultralisks in to battle at last, seems like it should be a lot of fun. At first I was worried that it might make it to easy to *ambush* an army with Ultralisks to prevent escape or positioning of any kind but when I realised they have to actually get in to position first then burrow I realised this basically just helps Ultra's that are stuck practically and that's actually fairl awesome. I approve.
Second, the Swarm Host while it seems a little weak I can definately see where they're coming from with the design to be constantly chipping away at and forcing your opponent to be wary constantly during a siege situation and I really like the "feel" of it.
I think it might end up being too short range for what it's intended use is (protecting some of these you can draw Tank fire to move in at any time, and supplement pushes) so if that's the case I'd maybe like something where they shoot the little things forward a few feet instead of just releasing them so the Swarm Host itself can be further back.
It's also worth noting that in the video available they burrowed all at once, burrowing them one at a time could actually be more dangerous against Siege Tank compositions. I'll have to see how it works out but I'm tentatively happy with this one, and I don't think the damage or health needs adjusting just yet for the little thingies.
The Viper feels like it should be an amazing unit but also one hell of a new weakness. Timing pushes designed to hit the first Viper could be deadly and I don't think we yet have confirmation if this comes from Spire or Lair, if it's Spire that's a 400 gas investment for detection to be able to step outside of your base and expo and that would be a lethal change to Zerg play.
That said though the ability to create detectors from Purely energy after it's up should definately strengthen the Zerg army though I worry that with the loss of Overseer's we may have just lost some of the scouting tools necessary for early mid game pushes, as speed Overseer's are one of the few usually mostly reliable ways to get some information and I don't see the Viper replacing that role, nor any of the new changes either.
Burrowed Banelings moving, so long as it's obvious I think should be ok but I could see this being far too efficient. Baneling landmines and Banelings themselves are already pretty darn good.
Replicator for Protoss I actually want to like, but I don't see it making it live as is. It certainly won't be able to copy workers I don't think by the time it goes live, but even without that the ability to combine any unit at all in to your army instantly (pending opponents tech of course) just seems like it'd be a balance nightmare.
Oracle, seems like an interesting little unit and I actually like this one. The mineral patch changes actually effect Terran the most as a Spine or Photon Cannon seem like they'd make fairly short work of the mineral prevention (unless the buildings were stunned too I guess) but it seems like a way to get fairly guarenteed economic damage done.
The contaminate thingy though, depending on how the ability works out that'll either be kinda useful for a "raiding spell caster" or utterly pointless. I'm hoping it ends up useful without being OP. Being able to deny entire tech tree's to Zerg by contaminating one building seems a little harsh, though I'm hoping something like denying static defense to allow them to move through a base or facilitate a drop remains in.
The Tempest seems like it's fixing a problem I'm not sure was really there to begin with and since they seemed very careful to say that it's not currently finished basically I don't really know what I can say beyond see how it works out.
Cannon on buildings seems useful ish early game and maybe helpful in gaining a little extra defense against drops so shall be interested to see how that one works out but as an idea it sounds pretty ok. I think this helps to fill a gap left from the removal of the KA where a Protoss army didn't want to split up but couldn't necessarily warp in enough at home to clear a drop, so hopefully taking a bit of an energy hit to provide some basic defense might end up being useful.
Mass recall I'm more nervous about though, it seems like it'll open up a lot of options for an attack every few minutes with your whole army and just pull back and repeat. Seems like it'd be capable of doing fairly extensive damage over time with very little risk. I think if this was a unique upgrade that was fairly cheap and available to only one Nexus at a time though that'd negate a lot of the initial fear I have with it while opening up more attack options. That said, I might be completely wrong and it might turn out that it works out to be generally not very useful so we'll see, but I'd hate to see the Mass Recall ability just removed with the loss of the Mothership.
The Terran changes I'm too tired to cover right now...Hellion seems a bit lacklusters, Shredder won't make it live as is I don't think. Reaper self healing could make it a more useful harassment option without being OP (damage then retreat for regeneration and go again) and I think that kind of micro heavy and attention heavy harass option is a good direction for the game to go.
We shall see how things work out but those are my initial with some consideration thoughts.
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On October 22 2011 10:21 Vehemus wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 10:19 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:
is it just me that is worried that there are TOO many changes in HoTS? tbh I don't really mind if they ultimately make gameplay better, as it's not exactly unfair to pros since they will all have to adapt anyways
Also, changing the game like this at the damage of progamers being more "uncomfortable" and possibly watchin poorer games for a short time will eventually pay off in the long run.
Some things look sexy some things don't... will miss some things, but hopefully (and so far) it does seem things are going into a good doirection.
THE MAPS ARE INCREDIBLE!!! HLY SHIT~! For blizzard at least haha. They look playable <3
AND OMG some of them are BRIGHT! instead of dark
Also is it just me or will terran have abunch of factory units? and there are no "infantry" units for prrotoss, they are all mechanical or air or etc. xD Zerg units look sort of dumb but the game isn't out yet A bunch of factory units? They're going to have Hellion, Siege Tank and War Hound. If you build a fusion core and an army and want to waste 600 minerals, you can also have one Thor.
Oh i guess u're right. Well the third unrevealed unit looks mechanical too though.
Also the Thor thing is lol... o.o but it sounds REALLY fun. They should make it fire nukes too LOL (yea ok bad game design but would be fun). But i guess its ability is like the same thing as a nuke xD
Meh no more Thor Hellion I guess o.o well it was a bland unit composition I guess.
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On October 22 2011 10:20 iLike413 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 10:00 Warpath wrote:
As far as the terran units go, i think the warhound(coughgoliatchcough) looks pretty sick cool.
The transforming hellion, meh but i guess it fills the right role (making hellions survive lategame)
The shredder thing WOULD be awesome if it didn't shut down+no friendly fire. (none of the other races have friendly fire =[ ) Protoss Psi Storm says hello =[
Actually back when i didnt know that, I stormed a shit ton of templars to kill some zerglings messing around. Was a tough way to discover the friendly fire...
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On October 22 2011 10:17 sc2holar wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 10:13 bovineblitz wrote:
I get the distinct feeling that Protoss is underpowered given these changes. We wanted a harass unit not an overseer that can forcefield minerals. We wanted air that's reasonably decent at fighting vikings. 200/200 to steal one unit that costs less than that, then deal with microing multiple race's units? Can't make colossi vs zerg? Any zerg unit can detect which makes sniping obs easy and burrow too strong?
Idk, I was hoping to get some sort of worker killing unit and this is just like getting kicked in the balls instead. i think its some kind of sick joke. Warp prism drops usualy just force the opponent to pull workers of mining until their troops arrive to snipe zealots. So blizzard gave toss another overpriced unit that only denies mining for a short amount of time. i dont find it very funny.
I think Dustin Browder jsut loses to Toss on the ladder. Does anyone feel like they still sound like noobs calling the death ball too strong?? I feel like Zerg and Terran have since evolved and Protoss is not like some unstoppable force. That being said I wish we had a fucking unit that can harass efficiently unlike the weird workaround ways we have now immortal/zealot warp prism drops... Oh wait they give us another weird workaround forcefielding the minerals LAWL
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On October 22 2011 09:23 Reborn8u wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 09:15 VoirDire wrote:On October 22 2011 09:14 Shikyo wrote:On October 22 2011 09:13 j0ker wrote:
lmao about zergs bitching about detection. god forbid you have to make a few 25 mineral static defense AA units. 75 minerals, maths hello? And it's very easy to move out with them against say, Banshee expand. 125 actually. Drone costs 50. I really think this whole +50 to the cost every building for zerg is a bunch of B.S. This would only be the case if the drone didn't mine anything until it morphed into the building, plus the fact that you have larva inject and can produce 10 drones at a time pretty early in the game, that alone compensates for this.
Of course, zerg buildings actually cost a NEGATIVE amount of minerals, since you've already mined more than they cost.
The clear and logical conclusion from this is that the more buildings you build the more minerals you will have.
How come no zerg thought of that genius strategy? Clearly no zerg has a brilliant mind like yours to make extra minerals and larva out of nothing!
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On October 22 2011 10:23 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 10:21 Vehemus wrote:On October 22 2011 10:19 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:
is it just me that is worried that there are TOO many changes in HoTS? tbh I don't really mind if they ultimately make gameplay better, as it's not exactly unfair to pros since they will all have to adapt anyways
Also, changing the game like this at the damage of progamers being more "uncomfortable" and possibly watchin poorer games for a short time will eventually pay off in the long run.
Some things look sexy some things don't... will miss some things, but hopefully (and so far) it does seem things are going into a good doirection.
THE MAPS ARE INCREDIBLE!!! HLY SHIT~! For blizzard at least haha. They look playable <3
AND OMG some of them are BRIGHT! instead of dark
Also is it just me or will terran have abunch of factory units? and there are no "infantry" units for prrotoss, they are all mechanical or air or etc. xD Zerg units look sort of dumb but the game isn't out yet A bunch of factory units? They're going to have Hellion, Siege Tank and War Hound. If you build a fusion core and an army and want to waste 600 minerals, you can also have one Thor. Oh i guess u're right. Well the third unrevealed unit looks mechanical too though. Also the Thor thing is lol... o.o but it sounds REALLY fun. They should make it fire nukes too LOL (yea ok bad game design but would be fun). But i guess its ability is like the same thing as a nuke xD Meh no more Thor Hellion I guess o.o well it was a bland unit composition I guess.
It's true that the shredder is produced from the factory but it's basically static defense. You can't use it with your army.
Although from what I understand you can drop it from a medivac as long as you send the medivac away. But technically, you're right, since the shredder also comes from the factory.
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On October 22 2011 09:23 two.watup wrote:
Everyone saying that the toss can replicate Drones and SCVs is just admitting that Hatches and Orbitals are better than what toss has.
How can you make that argument and not feel incredibly silly.
This.
At some point I was saying to myself: WHY DON'T YOU SWITCH RACE THEN? o_o
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Don't get too up in arms about balance guys, HotS has a long way to go yet. Remember how many changes were made during WoL beta, hell even after the beta?
Though even as a Zerg player, most of the Protoss changes appear quite underwhelming and just gimmicky. Just ultimately appear like they will be pretty useless on ladder
The changes between SC1 and SC:BW were much nicer, just add a few cool units (nothing gimmicky) and add to the campaign. DONE.
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The Zerg units seem the most interesting and the most fun to use
The Terran units seem mega-boring but will serve useful in the game
The Protoss units seem boring and unusable in a real match, however I am enjoying the Arc Cannon and Mass Recall on Nexus.
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Here's a thought:
buff gateway units,
remove forcefield from sentries replace it by some form of snare
make pylons upgradeable to dark pylons which can cast forcefield defensively
This way you make protoss way less dependant on forcefield and put an end to any forcefield abuse.
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LOL collapsable rocks, sounds epic actually!
I'm not sure how i like the mineral harass thing for protosss... i mean a unit designed with an ability JUST For that? i mean ideally there should be a way for it to serve the same purpose but be able to do other things too (like a sentry drop stopping mining, but u can use the sentries and their ff for other uses)
o yea the war hound looks SORT of cool in a way but overall looks stupid lol. make it look more like a mech warrior at least? xD
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On October 22 2011 10:24 R3demption wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2011 10:17 sc2holar wrote:On October 22 2011 10:13 bovineblitz wrote:
I get the distinct feeling that Protoss is underpowered given these changes. We wanted a harass unit not an overseer that can forcefield minerals. We wanted air that's reasonably decent at fighting vikings. 200/200 to steal one unit that costs less than that, then deal with microing multiple race's units? Can't make colossi vs zerg? Any zerg unit can detect which makes sniping obs easy and burrow too strong?
Idk, I was hoping to get some sort of worker killing unit and this is just like getting kicked in the balls instead. i think its some kind of sick joke. Warp prism drops usualy just force the opponent to pull workers of mining until their troops arrive to snipe zealots. So blizzard gave toss another overpriced unit that only denies mining for a short amount of time. i dont find it very funny. I think Dustin Browder jsut loses to Toss on the ladder. Does anyone feel like they still sound like noobs calling the death ball too strong?? I feel like Zerg and Terran have since evolved and Protoss is not like some unstoppable force. That being said I wish we had a fucking unit that can harass efficiently unlike the weird workaround ways we have now immortal/zealot warp prism drops... Oh wait they give us another weird workaround forcefielding the minerals LAWL
thou maybe its got a 3 minute life span on the min force fields....kinda like the auto turret and its insanely long cooldown
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On October 22 2011 09:54 Eisenheim wrote:
New use for Replicant in PvP !
Protoss A => Basic X Gateways with Blink stalker + Replicant
Protoss B => Many Tech (lot of investment) Gateway + Immo/Colossi + High Upgrade
Protoss A use Replicant for Immo/Colossi and get the upgrades of Protoss B.
Yeah, that's cool, i love theorycraft.
We really need THE Voice for replicant : *click* yo dawg, *click* i heard you love inception, *click* so i put...
Except it can't replicate Massive units and costs 200/200.
Yeah I love theorycraft too.
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Did Day [9] Just BM Sen LOL? He called out Killers name and told them to give Killer a Cheer when Sen was the one who won.
Isn't it usually protocol to tell the audience to 'give it up' for the winner?
That's what they've been doing all night i think.. (lol Day [9] Sneaking the Revenge in)
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EPT
