EPTDesignated Balance Discussion Thread - Page 424
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llIH
Norway2144 Posts
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Emzeeshady
Canada4203 Posts
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Bagi
Germany6799 Posts
Which means they come out at the 14-15 minute mark, fast enough to counter any standard 3base marine/tank WOL style timings. "If u didn't know." | ||
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Emzeeshady
Canada4203 Posts
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Bagi
Germany6799 Posts
What is this "something better" that you speak of? Assuming I go bio upgrades and vehicle weapons WOL-style, what magical transition can I do that isn't bio/mine? Because obviously mines need to be nerfed and tanks can take their place just fine. | ||
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Emzeeshady
Canada4203 Posts
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aksfjh
United States4853 Posts
On April 07 2013 02:18 Emzeeshady wrote: I am sorry I meant you DONT have to do an all in. As for something better I was thinking of sky terran but you can also transition to bio/mine (which is useful all fucking game now) if he overcommits to vipers. Lol "skyterran." As if that's an actual legitimate strategy. Let me know when those diamond league GSLs are happening. | ||
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Emzeeshady
Canada4203 Posts
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Bagi
Germany6799 Posts
On April 07 2013 02:18 Emzeeshady wrote: I am sorry I meant you DONT have to do an all in. As for something better I was thinking of sky terran but you can also transition to bio/mine (which is useful all fucking game now) if he overcommits to vipers. You DO have to do an all in if you want to attack that early with tanks. That's just how the unit works, its expensive and you have to get a critical mass of them if you want to stand a chance against any kind of zerg ground army. It's not only an all-in, its a really weak one. So now that we've established that tank all-ins suck ass and that tanks suck ass in general once vipers are out, what is left for the unit? They can work with turtle mech with a gazillion turrets but with bio mines are infinitely better support all game long. Going mines early makes for good defense but also allows the terran to plain aggressive from the start, due to how cheap yet mobile mines are. You saying "tanks are fine, mines need nerfing" is just plain wrong. Mines may be too strong, but tanks are absolutely not "fine" and they will continue to suck and go unused even if you nerf the mine. | ||
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Emzeeshady
Canada4203 Posts
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Toadvine
Poland2234 Posts
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wswas
16 Posts
i'm not tellling anyone to build tanks i'm just saying tanks are good vs zerg. vipers are a way softer counter to tanks than broodlords. people just don't make them anymore ever since mines made tanks completely unnecessary. that doesn't mean that tanks would be useless if mines weren't so op beyond belief. to the guy saying they have a cooldown: so fucking what. in large enough numbers they will obliterate anything that comes close. also you can't set them off reliably because the long 'lockon time' makes it easy for the bio ball to kill the units which would set them off. one way around this is to use infested terrans and swarm hosts. both of those would be needed in large numbers or you will run into the same problem as before. having them in large numbers is a significant investment in both money but more importantly in supply to counter 75/25. and it doesn't even work all that well plus makes you more susceptible to drops. there is no time where zerg can dictate the flow of the game other than weird allins that abuse greedy play. also terran now is stronger in every single phase of the game. even lategame zerg can't keep up with the new ravens. now if mines weren't so silly then it would be much more difficult for terran to set up for lategame because you couldn't just make 75/25 and mmm all game but would actually have to spend their cash on fighting units instead of making 5 ocs and still having the better army. | ||
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Emzeeshady
Canada4203 Posts
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-NegativeZero-
United States2142 Posts
On April 07 2013 02:37 Emzeeshady wrote: I would say in terms of excitement. Bio > tank centric styles although variety is nice. They're exciting in different ways - micro vs strategy/positioning. | ||
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Bagi
Germany6799 Posts
On April 07 2013 02:33 Emzeeshady wrote: Why do you want to attack with them. Just defend with them while dropping and secure more bases while transitioning to a more bio/sky centric army. You seem to think this is WOL. You don't have a timer on you as Terran anymore. You CAN play for the late game. Or maybe I'll just make units that don't suck and are capable of both defending and attacking? The ability to move out and punish your opponent is a dozen times more important than a slightly more powerful defensive position. It's not like unupgraded tanks make for that strong defense in the first place. Face it, the unit makes for shitty support in its current form. Also saying that the tank is fine as a pure defensive tool where you build a few of them tarnishes the legacy of the BW tank. | ||
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Emzeeshady
Canada4203 Posts
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Emzeeshady
Canada4203 Posts
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Bagi
Germany6799 Posts
I guess I shouldn't waste my time, because it was clear from the first post that you just want terran nerfed. | ||
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Emzeeshady
Canada4203 Posts
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aksfjh
United States4853 Posts
On April 07 2013 03:03 Emzeeshady wrote: It is hard to argue versus you because you have no proof in which to argue against. You just say the tank is bad in every way. As for wanting Terran nerfed I just would really like a mine nerd. Turbo medivacs could maybe use a tweak but I would be very happy with just the mines getting looked at. Like I said before though Void Rays should be top priority. Funny how the key things that should be nerfed for Terran are pretty much the only new things Terrans are using in HotS. You want the race to go back to the end of WoL, even though that was a VERY bad time for the race. And we have proof from WoL about tanks. Two base timings went out of style with the larger maps, 14-15 minute hives became standard, and banshees proved to be more effective at defense than tanks leading up to 3 base. | ||
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