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Telcontar
United Kingdom16710 Posts
On August 04 2011 22:03 GreEny K wrote: So they withdrew because they claimed there was a lot of lying during the meetings, or because they couldn't pay the players? Probably both. | ||
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b_unnies
3579 Posts
On August 04 2011 22:03 sleepingdog wrote: Sry but no. They are paid to show good results, if they can achieve that by NOT practicing, so be it. At least Tester is still one of the most stable code S players, who cares if Hero, Yongwha, Sage and so on practice their heart out when they can't even get to code A. And I'm paid to show results at my job too, if I can get it done in 1 hour its fine, if I need 3 hours for it, well, tough crap but nobody will care. I just has to be done. but the exact point is that they havent shown any good results...? | ||
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PantsB
United States77 Posts
On August 04 2011 21:49 lord_nibbler wrote: Wages of $5,000 for 45 days? I thought TSL was too poor to pay their players anything? What is going on here? From what I understand, those wages (on top of providing for housing) are higher than in the west... 5000 combined I believe. Which would prorate to a salary of roughly 20K a year. | ||
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brachester
Australia1786 Posts
On August 04 2011 22:03 sleepingdog wrote: Sry but no. They are paid to show good results, if they can achieve that by NOT practicing, so be it. At least Tester is still one of the most stable code S players, who cares if Hero, Yongwha, Sage and so on practice their heart out when they can't even get to code A. And I'm paid to show results at my job too, if I can get it done in 1 hour its fine, if I need 3 hours for it, well, tough crap but nobody will care. I just has to be done. Most stable code S? -_- The thing is they were not showing good resutls + not putting effors to improve the result = no $$$ | ||
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sleepingdog
Austria6145 Posts
On August 04 2011 22:04 b_unnies wrote: but the exact point is that they havent shown any results...? Fruitdealer no, I agree there. Tester yes, as long as he is stable code S I think he has every right to do whatever he wants. I mean, look at how many pros try to even get to code A, let alone code S. Claiming that you are not satisfied with a code S player is just....weird. | ||
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Veldril
Thailand1817 Posts
I think the problem lies in that the contract, if there is any to begin with, does not state about fining players who do not practice. So withholding players' salaries like this is not correct. | ||
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GreyKnight
United States4720 Posts
On August 04 2011 22:07 sleepingdog wrote: Fruitdealer no, I agree there. Tester yes, as long as he is stable code S I think he has every right to do whatever he wants. I mean, look at how many pros try to even get to code A, let alone code S. Claiming that you are not satisfied with a code S player is just....weird. true but trickster has been cheesing the entire time to keep his spot not dissing him. | ||
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JoeAWESOME
Sweden1080 Posts
 Hopefully he can find a new home so he can become the best player of all time | ||
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sleepingdog
Austria6145 Posts
On August 04 2011 22:08 GreyKnight wrote: true but trickster has been cheesing the entire time to keep his spot not dissing him. Again, if we are talking legal here, it's purely about results. Once he drops to code A due to insufficient practice, they can fire him and w/e. As long as somebody is paid to show results and he shows them, I don't see a problem there. And to me, staying code S and not even having to play up/down is indeed "showing results" Also, Tester ANNOUNCED that he doesn't want to practice hard BEFORE TSL hired him. In fact, that was the reason why he left oGs. So it's not valid to claim that he is supposed to practice hard despite of that. | ||
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floor exercise
Canada5847 Posts
I don't have much sympathy for FD and trickster, two players who have made it abundantly clear they don't want to work hard anymore causing even more problems for teams. | ||
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brachester
Australia1786 Posts
On August 04 2011 22:07 sleepingdog wrote: Fruitdealer no, I agree there. Tester yes, as long as he is stable code S I think he has every right to do whatever he wants. I mean, look at how many pros try to even get to code A, let alone code S. Claiming that you are not satisfied with a code S player is just....weird. No, Tester got to the Ro8 after he left, which has nothing to do with this The only reasons they were able to stay in Code S because the system was made so that it's really hard for Code S player to drop down to Code A. Notice how all the Code S players droped down recently after the format change (MKP, Sc, FD,........), coincidence? Staying in code S is not an achievement to be expected from the amount of money they're paying them, yet they still refused to put more effort to practice | ||
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nxiety
United States36 Posts
On August 04 2011 22:10 floor exercise wrote: The SC2con sounds like a bunch of old bw players looking after each other haha. I don't have much sympathy for FD and trickster, two players who have made it abundantly clear they don't want to work hard anymore causing even more problems for teams. To be fair, personally speaking my motivation for working hard would be seriously diminished by not getting paid. | ||
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zeru
8156 Posts
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poorbeggarman
139 Posts
1. If FD/Tester don't practice then they dont meet the terms of their contract. They don't deserve to get paid. Do you expect to get paid if you dont show up for work? FD and Tester had no contract, similar to how Puma didn't have one. They stopped getting paid after a random get-together by Coach and other players so that implies that they had no pre-existing disciplinary rules regarding player performance and payment. 2. SC2 Con say manager lied to TSL players that they're not receiving any money from sponsorship. Then how did Clide + SangHo return their money if they werent given it in the first place? You can't exactly say this was a lie or they were forced to return the money or else they wouldve left the team too. Timeline dude, timeline. They could get paid one month and the next month manager lies to them saying they're not receiving any sponsor moneyyy. They could have no place to go? 3. Slandering players by saying that they dont practice? Obviously FD+Tester doesnt mind at all considering they said the exact same thing in interviews and therefore agrees with Coach Lee's assessment Professional players slandering themselves to ruin their own reputation and future, excellent. 4. Images of former players are advertisements. Who does the advertising? G.Skill, who also sponsors TSL. That lies with G.Skill's responsiblity to change the ads. Unless you're suggesting that G.Skill had no knowledge about the situation of the team (FD+Tester) they're giving thousands of dollars to. -초상권에 대해서는 이적한 선수입장을 고려하여 지급을 의사를 밝혔습니다. 다만, TSL 소속일 때 생산된 컨텐츠이며, 곧바로 수정이 불가능하였고, 수정을 하는데 시간이 들 수 밖에 없었습니다. About the ads, due to those players leaving we brought up the idea of changing it, but due to the fact that the content was created while they were in TSl and the fact that it takes a while to modify the ads made it that it would take a lot of time to change the ads. -----------so Coach Lee is saying it was their responsibility to change it but because "it takes awhile" they just chose to run with em anyway. Nope, doesn't sound like G.Skill's responsibility to me. | ||
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brachester
Australia1786 Posts
^^you meant skiing too much? | ||
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Telcontar
United Kingdom16710 Posts
On August 04 2011 22:07 sleepingdog wrote: Fruitdealer no, I agree there. Tester yes, as long as he is stable code S I think he has every right to do whatever he wants. I mean, look at how many pros try to even get to code A, let alone code S. Claiming that you are not satisfied with a code S player is just....weird. Though Code S status alone might be satisfactory, you need players capable and threatening to win titles to attract sponsors and fans. If you're highest earning players aren't pushing themselves to do that, then it just isn't worth it to accomodate them. It only causes friction within the team and could negatively affect the team morale. I'm not saying Coach Lee did the right thing by refusing keep his promise (and contracts?) and even lying to them, but you can understand why he did it. | ||
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b_unnies
3579 Posts
On August 04 2011 22:07 sleepingdog wrote: Fruitdealer no, I agree there. Tester yes, as long as he is stable code S I think he has every right to do whatever he wants. I mean, look at how many pros try to even get to code A, let alone code S. Claiming that you are not satisfied with a code S player is just....weird. Well I consider good result as winning the championship or meeting/exceeding expectations. Honestly I really think no progamer, trickster and fruitdealer included is going to be happy if they just lost a gsl series. If they didn't meet expectations because they don't practice then yes, they're not showing good results. | ||
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Zarahtra
Iceland4053 Posts
On August 04 2011 22:03 sleepingdog wrote: Sry but no. They are paid to show good results, if they can achieve that by NOT practicing, so be it. At least Tester is still one of the most stable code S players, who cares if Hero, Yongwha, Sage and so on practice their heart out when they can't even get to code A. And I'm paid to show results at my job too, if I can get it done in 1 hour its fine, if I need 3 hours for it, well, tough crap but nobody will care. I just has to be done. I very much doubt their 'contract' would work like this, as it would totally kill all team morale. There are 2 reasons to be in a team, for practise and for more stable income. The pracise part relies on everyone practising, fx while Tester might be fine in Code S, I'd still assume he was expected to practise, to help his teammates out. Also I can only say for Iceland, most people are contracted for x hours, not for x work. I don't know how it is in Korea though. | ||
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sleepingdog
Austria6145 Posts
On August 04 2011 22:14 Telcontar wrote: Though Code S status alone might be satisfactory, you need players capable and threatening to win titles to attract sponsors and fans. If you're highest earning players aren't pushing themselves to do that, then it just isn't worth it to accomodate them. It only causes friction within the team and could negatively affect the team morale. I'm not saying Coach Lee did the right thing by refusing keep his promise (and contracts?) and even lying to them, but you can understand why he did it. The problem is, that they didn't "stop" practicing, they joined the team intentionally, CLAIMING that they don't want the rigid ogs-practice-schedule. So you aquire players who state they don't want to practice hard and afterwards you fire them because they didn't practice hard? This just makes no sense...if I'm hired to work 30 hours a week, I can't possibly get fired because I refuse to work 40 hours. | ||
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sVnteen
Germany2238 Posts
but starcraft must survive !!!!!!!!  | ||
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