EPT'TSL expelled from SC2 Conference' - Page 10
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legaton
France1763 Posts
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poorbeggarman
139 Posts
On August 04 2011 21:35 hyptonic wrote: By stories I meant there decisions to leave there teams. I did not mean to imply testimonies. They have given their reason to S2Con but we haven't gotten them. You using things that don't even exist to us shows that you are blindly attacking TSL. FruitDealer/Tester are teamhoppers in the sense that is their 3rd SC2 team now (oGs -> TSL -> ST). They have played on more teams than any other SC2 player I'm pretty sure. Their reasons for leaving oGs? Too much practicing and not enough play time. Reason for leaving TSL? Not getting paid because they didn't practice. You have to see this from both perspectives. This story will stay unsolved until we learn the true agreement between TSL and FD/Tester Very much like how EG got attacked in the Puma incident, sometimes its just more relaxing to jump to conclusions, I'm enjoying it somewhat. Regardless of what FD/Tester did etc, 1.Spontaneously witholding wages 2.Manager lied about sponsor funding 3.Slandering players 4.Using images of former players Plus the handling of Puma drama, TSL management sounds awfully shady to me. The SC2 Player's Association thinks so too. Unless we consider the possibility of them being corrupt? Aha, more drama. | ||
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GreyKnight
United States4720 Posts
On August 04 2011 21:46 legaton wrote: Silly Fruitdealer and Tester, if you wanted to get paid while not practicing and showing bad results, you could have called Alex Garfield from EG. what are you implying? lol :D | ||
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hyptonic
2155 Posts
On August 04 2011 21:45 Antoine wrote: can somebody please do a full translation of this? moonmeh from r/starcraft did a speed translation Okay gonna go through TSL's reponse bit by bit(prime) * 스타크래프트2 협의회 탈퇴이유 The reason for leaving the association. -협의회 회의 안건자체가 명예훼손과 과장이 심했고 거짓도 상당수 있었습니다. There was a lot defamation and exaggeration during the meeting along with a lot of lies -회의 목적이 '중재 회의'임에도 불구하고 협의회 회의에 준비해간 사용내역 및 금액등 에 대해 이운재감독의 의사를 무시하였습니다. Despite the fact that it was supposed to be an arbitary meeting, the comittee ignored much of Coach Lee's statements and intentions. -확고한 주관없는 회의과정 The lack of a strong unbiased discussion process 서기수 선수의 안건만으로 너무 빠른 판결이 난 것에 유감 이였습니다. 협의회 결정에 대해서는 이의제기를 할 수 없었습니다. The fact that this was judged so quickly by Tricker's views is regretful. We could not appeal the decision done by the comittee. TSL과 저에 대한 의견발표를 한 뒤 판결이 나도 늦지 않다고 봅니다. I believe that the decision could have been made after TSL and I making an announcement on our opinion 또한 중재회의 결과 발표 후, 협의회에 이의 신청을 할 수 없다고 결정을 내린 뒤 3일 후, 이의 신청이 가능하다는 등 뒤로 합의를 하는 것이 가장좋다. 등등 협의회가 주관이 없고 편파적이라고 판단했습니다. (bwah so much technical terms) In addition, afer the results we came to the conclusion it would be impossible to appeal and judged that it would be better if after making a decision we were able to appeal after 3 days as it makes it less biased and prejudiced. * 김원기, 서기수 선수의 마지막달 연봉이 지급되지 않은 이유 The reason why FD and Tricker did not recieve their final payment. -불성실한 태도와 팀웍을 헤치는 행동, 팀 리빌딩에 참여 및 관심이 없다고 하는 등의 행동으로 감독 및 TSL선수들은 연봉지급을 할 필요가 없다고 판단하였습니다. 그러한 기간이 한달가량입니다. Due to their attitude actions which hurt their team mates such as not being interested in team rebuilding and ect, the coach and the players decided that there would be no need to give the final payment. That duration was for a month -이러한 두 선수들의 행동이 연봉보다 소속 선수들의 생활비가 먼저라 판단하였습니다. Thus we decided that before the 2 player's payment, the livelihood of the TSL players would come first. 당시 운영비가 모자라 추가 대출을 받는 상황이라 더더욱 그렇습니다. 팀운영에 지출된 내역에는 한점 부끄럼없습니다. This was worse due how we were low on maintenance fees and getting additional loans. I am not ashamed of how I did my team organization. *초상권 Model, in this case the ads -초상권에 대해서는 이적한 선수입장을 고려하여 지급을 의사를 밝혔습니다. 다만, TSL 소속일 때 생산된 컨텐츠이며, 곧바로 수정이 불가능하였고, 수정을 하는데 시간이 들 수 밖에 없었습니다. About the ads, due to those players leaving we brought up the idea of changing it, but due to the fact that the content was created while they were in TSl and the fact that it takes a while to modify the ads made it that it would take a lot of time to change the ads. 현재 일부 컨텐츠에 대해선 비용을 들여 수정이 완료된 상태입니다. Currently this is finished by modifying the conten by utilizing money. (god this sound awkward) TSL선수 및 감독은 위 사실에 동의하고 있습니다. 선수들 또한 이러한 결정을 내린 스타2협의회 탈퇴에도 동의하고 있으며 현재 GSL, GSTL 등 차기대회 일정에 맞추어 연습에 매진하고 있습니다. 좋지 않은 소식을 전하게 되어 유감이며 걱정해주시는 많은 분들께 고맙다는 말씀을 드리고 싶습니다. The players of TSL and the coach agree with those statements above and addition agree with leaving the association and currently busy with focusing on GSL and GSTL. Sorry to give this regretful news and thank you to those who were worried about us. 덧붙이자면 대회를 앞두고 있는 선수들에게 GSL경기맵 공지는 아주 중요합니다. 왜 GSL공식맵에 대한 공지를 TSL선수에게만 늦게주는 지 아쉽습니다. TSL감독 이운재 In addition(As an after thought) to the players preparing for the tournaments, the patches for the maps are very important. The fact that you always give these information late only to TSL players is very disappointing. TSL Coach Lee DISCLAIMER I AM NOT A JOURNALIST AND MAY HAVE SOME MISTAKES. CHECK MILKIS WHEN HE PUTS HIS UP | ||
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lord_nibbler
Germany591 Posts
I thought TSL was too poor to pay their players anything? What is going on here? From what I understand, those wages (on top of providing for housing) are higher than in the west... | ||
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DreamOen
Spain1400 Posts
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Shableh
Canada40 Posts
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Namu
United States826 Posts
On August 04 2011 21:49 lord_nibbler wrote: Wages of $5,000 for 45 days? I thought TSL was too poor to pay their players anything? What is going on here? From what I understand, those wages (on top of providing for housing) are higher than in the west... that's why TSL's pulling loans from banks to pay for all this. and the coach+other players felt it was unfair to pay FD and tester when they were slacking & with bad attitude. However, strictly speaking, it was still wrong to withhold wages/lie about funding... | ||
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marttorn
Norway5211 Posts
I dunno how significant it really is that TSL is no longer part of this conference thing, SlayerS isn't and they're doing just fine. I kind of am just waiting for the news that TSL is disbanding though, unfortunately (;_;) I dunno how they'll survive from here. Cliiiiiiiiiideee!!!! | ||
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Sanjuro
Indonesia252 Posts
the SC2Con does not wish to cripple the competition in Korea and is not considering any sanctions regarding their participation in leagues. We will continue to use monetary disciplinary actions to punish teams and players who bring the scene into disrepute, and will do our best to create an environment where it isn't just one manager who controls the players, but the players leading themselves forward. i am sure that the SC2Con can influence Gomtv to carry out their verdict, but they choose not to sanction them from competing in the GSL, their sanctions are in monetary actions, like Fining players or Teams | ||
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asendent88
United Kingdom63 Posts
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RogerX
New Zealand3180 Posts
Sure is alot of drama nowadays in the community | ||
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Cartel
Canada255 Posts
TSL can't catch a break. | ||
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Kaiwa
Netherlands2209 Posts
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b_unnies
3579 Posts
On August 04 2011 21:47 poorbeggarman wrote: Very much like how EG got attacked in the Puma incident, sometimes its just more relaxing to jump to conclusions, I'm enjoying it somewhat. Regardless of what FD/Tester did etc, 1.Spontaneously witholding wages 2.Manager lied about sponsor funding 3.Slandering players 4.Using images of former players Plus the handling of Puma drama, TSL management sounds awfully shady to me. The SC2 Player's Association thinks so too. Unless we consider the possibility of them being corrupt? Aha, more drama. 1. If FD/Tester don't practice then they dont meet the terms of their contract. They don't deserve to get paid. Do you expect to get paid if you dont show up for work? 2. SC2 Con say manager lied to TSL players that they're not receiving any money from sponsorship. Then how did Clide + SangHo return their money if they werent given it in the first place? You can't exactly say this was a lie or they were forced to return the money or else they wouldve left the team too. 3. Slandering players by saying that they dont practice? Obviously FD+Tester doesnt mind at all considering they said the exact same thing in interviews and therefore agrees with Coach Lee's assessment 4. Images of former players are advertisements. Who does the advertising? G.Skill, who also sponsors TSL. That lies with G.Skill's responsiblity to change the ads. Unless you're suggesting that G.Skill had no knowledge about the situation of the team (FD+Tester) they're giving thousands of dollars to. | ||
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rdj107
United States336 Posts
On August 04 2011 21:49 lord_nibbler wrote: Wages of $5,000 for 45 days? I thought TSL was too poor to pay their players anything? What is going on here? From what I understand, those wages (on top of providing for housing) are higher than in the west... Iirc Lee's floating tsl on loans atm and I guess decided to not give fd and trickster their last payments after they left, which is kind of an issue if there was an agreement to do so beforehand. This seems to just be a statement of condemnation though, so no legal issues. Just a sad situation really. However if his team is to the point of riding on loans lee should have just disbanded/merged with another team and made good deals for his players before anyone knew of their troubles. Keeping players until your team sinks is a terrible idea, as it will leave your players with little in the way of options. | ||
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PantsB
United States77 Posts
The rest of it definitely at least seems slimy but TSL are prima facie at fault for the first point alone | ||
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sleepingdog
Austria6145 Posts
On August 04 2011 21:59 b_unnies wrote: 1. If FD/Tester don't practice then they dont meet the terms of their contract. They don't deserve to get paid. Do you expect to get paid if you dont show up for work? Sry but no. They are paid to show good results, if they can achieve that by NOT practicing, so be it. At least Tester is still one of the most stable code S players, who cares if Hero, Yongwha, Sage and so on practice their heart out when they can't even get to code A. And I'm paid to show results at my job too, if I can get it done in 1 hour its fine, if I need 3 hours for it, well, tough crap but nobody will care. I just has to be done. | ||
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Technique
Netherlands1542 Posts
On August 04 2011 21:47 poorbeggarman wrote: Very much like how EG got attacked in the Puma incident, sometimes its just more relaxing to jump to conclusions, I'm enjoying it somewhat. Regardless of what FD/Tester did etc, 1.Spontaneously witholding wages 2.Manager lied about sponsor funding 3.Slandering players 4.Using images of former players Plus the handling of Puma drama, TSL management sounds awfully shady to me. The SC2 Player's Association thinks so too. Unless we consider the possibility of them being corrupt? Aha, more drama. EG was still wrong... And in this case TSL coach Lee is very wrong. | ||
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GreEny K
Germany7312 Posts
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