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On May 22 2011 13:21 TT1 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 13:09 windsupernova wrote:On May 22 2011 13:03 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 12:45 gozima wrote:On May 22 2011 12:19 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 12:10 Dawski wrote:
TT1 i love you and all but you gotta work on your communication haha. The way you made it sound in your response was that you are the representative of the entire foreigner community and that we all feel that we can't even compete in the first rounds of the tourney. Shouldve used better words like you did in your response with "enough of a skill difference to be a bad investment". Sometimes small things like that can piss people off when your trying to represent them.
and you have to admit but that world lineup that you said he was in denial about...was pretty fricken stacked and i also believe it would have a chance vs the top koreans ofc i was, the only players that would be able to compete vs koreans are the ones training in korea, all the other players would never be able to win consistently vs the top players If this trend continues [foreigners not being able to make any type of commitment to train in Korea], the SC2 scene will just end up being like the BW scene, with Korea dominating everyone. It kind of makes me sad. It's unfortunate that western pros see absolutely no incentive to compete with the best because of all the "easy" money that's available to them in the West. yup, the leap in skill has been HUGE in korea ever since sc2 came out, i could safely say that a few of the foreigners were better than the top koreans in the earlier days of sc2(i actually thought idra had a good chance of winning one of the 1st 2 gsl seasons if he had a bit of luck) but ever since they started setting up proteam houses theyve been improving at a much faster rate than us, their understanding/execution of the game is just evolving much faster than us and sadly if were not able to have to same type of infrastructure(which i dont see happening anytime soon) that the koreans have were just gonna end up falling behind even more Thanks TT1 for giving us your honest opinion and I do agree with you. If Western Pros don't step up the skill gap will only get bigger and bigger and we will have a BW situation again. theres only so much individual players can do, need $$$/sponsorship support bro
Well it comes down to the dedication of the player. If Mr. Yong asks Jaedong to practice 100 games for an upcoming match he's gonna do it and not complain. If you look at other players (not gonna call anyone but you know who practices and who doesn't regularly) that participate in star2 tournaments I don't believe for 10 seconds they do that or would unless put under the spotlight.
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On May 22 2011 13:10 Mephiztopheles1 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 13:03 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 12:45 gozima wrote:On May 22 2011 12:19 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 12:10 Dawski wrote:
TT1 i love you and all but you gotta work on your communication haha. The way you made it sound in your response was that you are the representative of the entire foreigner community and that we all feel that we can't even compete in the first rounds of the tourney. Shouldve used better words like you did in your response with "enough of a skill difference to be a bad investment". Sometimes small things like that can piss people off when your trying to represent them.
and you have to admit but that world lineup that you said he was in denial about...was pretty fricken stacked and i also believe it would have a chance vs the top koreans ofc i was, the only players that would be able to compete vs koreans are the ones training in korea, all the other players would never be able to win consistently vs the top players If this trend continues [foreigners not being able to make any type of commitment to train in Korea], the SC2 scene will just end up being like the BW scene, with Korea dominating everyone. It kind of makes me sad. It's unfortunate that western pros see absolutely no incentive to compete with the best because of all the "easy" money that's available to them in the West. yup, the leap in skill has been HUGE in korea ever since sc2 came out, i could safely say that a few of the foreigners were better than the top koreans in the earlier days of sc2(i actually thought idra had a good chance of winning one of the 1st 2 gsl seasons if he had a bit of luck) but ever since they started setting up proteam houses theyve been improving at a much faster rate than us, their understanding/execution of the game is just evolving much faster than us and sadly if were not able to have to same type of infrastructure(which i dont see happening anytime soon) that the koreans have were just gonna end up falling behind even more I'm just curious, do you think progaming houses like the Root and the one in Sweden are enough to close the gap or do you think coaches, a more strict and regulated approach to the game and(or) stuff like that is necessary?
On May 22 2011 13:10 Mephiztopheles1 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 13:03 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 12:45 gozima wrote:On May 22 2011 12:19 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 12:10 Dawski wrote:
TT1 i love you and all but you gotta work on your communication haha. The way you made it sound in your response was that you are the representative of the entire foreigner community and that we all feel that we can't even compete in the first rounds of the tourney. Shouldve used better words like you did in your response with "enough of a skill difference to be a bad investment". Sometimes small things like that can piss people off when your trying to represent them.
and you have to admit but that world lineup that you said he was in denial about...was pretty fricken stacked and i also believe it would have a chance vs the top koreans ofc i was, the only players that would be able to compete vs koreans are the ones training in korea, all the other players would never be able to win consistently vs the top players If this trend continues [foreigners not being able to make any type of commitment to train in Korea], the SC2 scene will just end up being like the BW scene, with Korea dominating everyone. It kind of makes me sad. It's unfortunate that western pros see absolutely no incentive to compete with the best because of all the "easy" money that's available to them in the West. yup, the leap in skill has been HUGE in korea ever since sc2 came out, i could safely say that a few of the foreigners were better than the top koreans in the earlier days of sc2(i actually thought idra had a good chance of winning one of the 1st 2 gsl seasons if he had a bit of luck) but ever since they started setting up proteam houses theyve been improving at a much faster rate than us, their understanding/execution of the game is just evolving much faster than us and sadly if were not able to have to same type of infrastructure(which i dont see happening anytime soon) that the koreans have were just gonna end up falling behind even more I'm just curious, do you think progaming houses like the Root and the one in Sweden are enough to close the gap or do you think coaches, a more strict and regulated approach to the game and(or) stuff like that is necessary?
i cant speak for the swedish house but the root house is more like a place where i can chill with 2 friends rather than it being a serious practice environment, im not doing anything i wasnt already doing at home so(and im actually practicing about the same amount as when i was in canada ).. it hasnt been very helpful gaming-wise but its allowed me to relax more and have a good time =]
gaming-wise its definetly nowhere near what i experienced living with all the foreigners in the gomtv house, now that was a fucking practice environment, im sure if any serious gamer were to live in that sort of environment they would improve ridiculously fast(sadly we only had 2 weeks)
essentially living conditions here >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in korea
but gaming conditions in the gomtv house >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> here, its uncomparable
its easy to have good gaming conditions tho, all u need is 5-6 top players(preferably 2 from each race)
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The time commitment is almost certainly the main reason, along with lack of free travel. Foreigners in other games like WC 3, CS, and DOTA go regularly to tournaments all across Europe, and to China, Korea, Malaysia, etc. when invited. But for SC 2 they don't seem to be interested. The difference between WC 3, CS, and DOTA tournaments and the GSL, including the GSL Super Tournament, is that they're not month-long, but week-long, or in some cases weekend-long affairs, and travel expenses are usually paid by the organizers.
It's quite obvious when comparing foreigners' response to the GSL WC and the actual GSL leagues what the reason for the rejections is. What's not obvious is what the GSL organizers intend to do about it, if anything.
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On May 22 2011 13:44 TT1 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 13:10 Mephiztopheles1 wrote:On May 22 2011 13:03 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 12:45 gozima wrote:On May 22 2011 12:19 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 12:10 Dawski wrote:
TT1 i love you and all but you gotta work on your communication haha. The way you made it sound in your response was that you are the representative of the entire foreigner community and that we all feel that we can't even compete in the first rounds of the tourney. Shouldve used better words like you did in your response with "enough of a skill difference to be a bad investment". Sometimes small things like that can piss people off when your trying to represent them.
and you have to admit but that world lineup that you said he was in denial about...was pretty fricken stacked and i also believe it would have a chance vs the top koreans ofc i was, the only players that would be able to compete vs koreans are the ones training in korea, all the other players would never be able to win consistently vs the top players If this trend continues [foreigners not being able to make any type of commitment to train in Korea], the SC2 scene will just end up being like the BW scene, with Korea dominating everyone. It kind of makes me sad. It's unfortunate that western pros see absolutely no incentive to compete with the best because of all the "easy" money that's available to them in the West. yup, the leap in skill has been HUGE in korea ever since sc2 came out, i could safely say that a few of the foreigners were better than the top koreans in the earlier days of sc2(i actually thought idra had a good chance of winning one of the 1st 2 gsl seasons if he had a bit of luck) but ever since they started setting up proteam houses theyve been improving at a much faster rate than us, their understanding/execution of the game is just evolving much faster than us and sadly if were not able to have to same type of infrastructure(which i dont see happening anytime soon) that the koreans have were just gonna end up falling behind even more I'm just curious, do you think progaming houses like the Root and the one in Sweden are enough to close the gap or do you think coaches, a more strict and regulated approach to the game and(or) stuff like that is necessary? Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 13:10 Mephiztopheles1 wrote:On May 22 2011 13:03 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 12:45 gozima wrote:On May 22 2011 12:19 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 12:10 Dawski wrote:
TT1 i love you and all but you gotta work on your communication haha. The way you made it sound in your response was that you are the representative of the entire foreigner community and that we all feel that we can't even compete in the first rounds of the tourney. Shouldve used better words like you did in your response with "enough of a skill difference to be a bad investment". Sometimes small things like that can piss people off when your trying to represent them.
and you have to admit but that world lineup that you said he was in denial about...was pretty fricken stacked and i also believe it would have a chance vs the top koreans ofc i was, the only players that would be able to compete vs koreans are the ones training in korea, all the other players would never be able to win consistently vs the top players If this trend continues [foreigners not being able to make any type of commitment to train in Korea], the SC2 scene will just end up being like the BW scene, with Korea dominating everyone. It kind of makes me sad. It's unfortunate that western pros see absolutely no incentive to compete with the best because of all the "easy" money that's available to them in the West. yup, the leap in skill has been HUGE in korea ever since sc2 came out, i could safely say that a few of the foreigners were better than the top koreans in the earlier days of sc2(i actually thought idra had a good chance of winning one of the 1st 2 gsl seasons if he had a bit of luck) but ever since they started setting up proteam houses theyve been improving at a much faster rate than us, their understanding/execution of the game is just evolving much faster than us and sadly if were not able to have to same type of infrastructure(which i dont see happening anytime soon) that the koreans have were just gonna end up falling behind even more I'm just curious, do you think progaming houses like the Root and the one in Sweden are enough to close the gap or do you think coaches, a more strict and regulated approach to the game and(or) stuff like that is necessary? i cant speak for the swedish house but the root house is more like a place where i can chill with 2 friends rather than it being a serious practice environment, im not doing anything i wasnt already doing at home so(and im actually practicing about the same amount as when i was in canada ).. it hasnt been very helpful gaming-wise but its allowed me to relax more and have a good time =] gaming-wise its definetly nowhere near what i experienced living with all the foreigners in the gomtv house, now that was a fucking practice environment, im sure if any serious gamer were to live in that sort of environment they would improve ridiculously fast(sadly we only had 2 weeks) essentially living conditions here >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in korea but gaming conditions in the gomtv house >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> here, its uncomparable its easy to have good gaming conditions tho, all u need is 5-6 top players(preferably 2 from each race)
I see, thanks for the insight 
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I think the main problem is that in korea all you have are GSL's and if you get knocked out early or in the preliminary rounds then you are basically doing nothing for a month and a half. Korea needs more online tournaments and/or another big league like BW has MSL and OSL. then you might see more foreigners willing to move.
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On May 22 2011 13:54 Azarkon wrote:
The time commitment is almost certainly the main reason, along with lack of free travel. Foreigners in other games like WC 3, CS, and DOTA go regularly to tournaments all across Europe, and to China, Korea, Malaysia, etc. when invited. But for SC 2 they don't seem to be interested. The difference between WC 3, CS, and DOTA tournaments and the GSL, including the GSL Super Tournament, is that they're not month-long, but week-long, or in some cases weekend-long affairs, and travel expenses are usually paid by the organizers.
It's quite obvious when comparing foreigners' response to the GSL WC and the actual GSL leagues what the reason for the rejections is. What's not obvious is what the GSL organizers intend to do about it, if anything.
The new schedule that gom has makes it alot easier to travel to weekend tournaments and the MLG winners/top 4 will have their trips paid for, this isn't in affect for the super tournament but in future GSL seasons it shouldn't be as much of an issue.
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On May 22 2011 13:44 TT1 wrote:
i cant speak for the swedish house but the root house is more like a place where i can chill with 2 friends rather than it being a serious practice environment, im not doing anything i wasnt already doing at home so(and im actually practicing about the same amount as when i was in canada ).. it hasnt been very helpful gaming-wise but its allowed me to relax more and have a good time =]
gaming-wise its definetly nowhere near what i experienced living with all the foreigners in the gomtv house, now that was a fucking practice environment, im sure if any serious gamer were to live in that sort of environment they would improve ridiculously fast(sadly we only had 2 weeks)
essentially living conditions here >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in korea
but gaming conditions in the gomtv house >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> here, its uncomparable
its easy to have good gaming conditions tho, all u need is 5-6 top players(preferably 2 from each race)
Yup, you would need about 6 months to really start seeing the results. :/
Our environment is a lot more lax and easy going.
It's more of a money issue.
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On May 22 2011 14:09 HEROwithNOlegacy wrote:
I think the main problem is that in korea all you have are GSL's and if you get knocked out early or in the preliminary rounds then you are basically doing nothing for a month and a half. Korea needs more online tournaments and/or another big league like BW has MSL and OSL. then you might see more foreigners willing to move.
There are only 3 MSL and 3 OSL a year so that isn't a factor since there are more than 6 GSL a year.
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On May 22 2011 12:19 TT1 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 12:10 Dawski wrote:
TT1 i love you and all but you gotta work on your communication haha. The way you made it sound in your response was that you are the representative of the entire foreigner community and that we all feel that we can't even compete in the first rounds of the tourney. Shouldve used better words like you did in your response with "enough of a skill difference to be a bad investment". Sometimes small things like that can piss people off when your trying to represent them.
and you have to admit but that world lineup that you said he was in denial about...was pretty fricken stacked and i also believe it would have a chance vs the top koreans ofc i was, the only players that would be able to compete vs koreans are the ones training in korea, all the other players would never be able to win consistently vs the top players
Again, you keep speaking for everyone and making these sweeping statements. I really think you need to stop pretending you're the mouthpiece of the foreign community and speak for yourself.
I really think a lot of foreigners who haven't even been to Korea, e.g. TSL3 finalists Naniwa and Thorzain, would not say that they can "never win consistently vs the top players".
Being a pro player doesn't let you speak for everyone. The only person you can speak for is yourself, period.
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Wow. Personally, I think foreigners just need to overcome this "Koreans are the best" attitude. While true, it's mostly because most foreigners are too lazy to practice as much as Koreans, except HuK, IdrA, Jinro, and a few others. I commend them for practicing and streaming so much. 
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On May 22 2011 02:33 Karthane wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 02:29 Jombozeus wrote:Mr. Chae also spoke about his opinion on providing code S spot for foreign players. "I don't think GSL is same level as MLG. I believe foreign fans also think same as me. There is notable difference between the seed for Koreans to MLG Championship and the seed for foreigners to GSL code S Are we really saying that Inca is more skillful than say naniwa? Code S is being VERY disappointing for Mr. GOMTV to make such a statement. Also considering that koreans dropped like flies in the Chinese Gigabyte tournament, their bragging rights is down the drain. Obviously there may be a certain few players that don't fit stereotype, but i think we can all agree that Code S is the highest level of SC2 that a viewer can watch right now.
no, it's really not. koreans were outclassing foreigners more convincingly in the beta, as of now they are not, as a community, better than anyone else. there's certain players that really stand out and are exceptional, but MC can and has been beaten by foreigners, as well as nestea, MVP, july, nada and whoever else that beats everyone else in the korean scene. foreigners have won match ups against the best koreans that their fellow korean players cannot come close to doing, like white ra beating MC in PvP and dimaga beating Nestea in ZvZ . they don't outclass foreigners the way someone like, not even including bonjwas, someone like Effort could laughably outclass Idra, his foreigner teammate in BW. it's not the same thing
i think it's cool for the communities to have global competition, but i don't think code S is some kind of special privilege the way you might think a foreigner getting invited into a BW team would be. their best players are some of the best in the world, but the general competition isn't any better, the prize money isn't that much higher if you don't win top 8 code S, and the costs as well as dedication of your time to fund a trip to live a month in korea are much MUCH higher than staying in your room and winning online tournaments.
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On May 22 2011 03:01 AndreiDaGiant wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 03:00 Bear4188 wrote:
I find it amusing that he says MLG champion doesn't deserve code S and then you look at the past MLG champions.
HuK: currently residing in code S
IdrA: GSL Open and code S participant until he left Korea
Jinro: two-time GSL semifinalist
Naniwa: ??? That is a really good point...
What? Thats not a point at all, if anything it goes against what he is trying to say. Obviously the GSL commentator person is not saying a Person who Wins MLG is not good enough for Code S, that would be ridiculous. Do you think he believes that if Nestea went to MLG, and won, he would suddenly not be good enough for Code S? What he is saying is that Going through qualifiers to get into code A, getting through Code A, Then winning up and down matches is harder than winning one of the ..5? MLG events. I mean look at it this way, Every single code S player who has tried his luck at MLG has won an MLG tournament. Also is not Huk the only one who has actually qualified to the current code S? Which again is arguably a lot harder than it was to get into Code S to begin with.
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On May 22 2011 14:15 Subversion wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 12:19 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 12:10 Dawski wrote:
TT1 i love you and all but you gotta work on your communication haha. The way you made it sound in your response was that you are the representative of the entire foreigner community and that we all feel that we can't even compete in the first rounds of the tourney. Shouldve used better words like you did in your response with "enough of a skill difference to be a bad investment". Sometimes small things like that can piss people off when your trying to represent them.
and you have to admit but that world lineup that you said he was in denial about...was pretty fricken stacked and i also believe it would have a chance vs the top koreans ofc i was, the only players that would be able to compete vs koreans are the ones training in korea, all the other players would never be able to win consistently vs the top players Again, you keep speaking for everyone and making these sweeping statements. I really think you need to stop pretending you're the mouthpiece of the foreign community and speak for yourself. I really think a lot of foreigners who haven't even been to Korea, e.g. TSL3 finalists Naniwa and Thorzain, would not say that they can "never win consistently vs the top players". Being a pro player doesn't let you speak for everyone. The only person you can speak for is yourself, period.
im not being a mouthpiece im just being honest, if you want to live in ur lil fictitious fairy land then be my guest
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Lol at the people arguing with tt1.
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On May 22 2011 13:35 Baarn wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 13:21 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 13:09 windsupernova wrote:On May 22 2011 13:03 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 12:45 gozima wrote:On May 22 2011 12:19 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 12:10 Dawski wrote:
TT1 i love you and all but you gotta work on your communication haha. The way you made it sound in your response was that you are the representative of the entire foreigner community and that we all feel that we can't even compete in the first rounds of the tourney. Shouldve used better words like you did in your response with "enough of a skill difference to be a bad investment". Sometimes small things like that can piss people off when your trying to represent them.
and you have to admit but that world lineup that you said he was in denial about...was pretty fricken stacked and i also believe it would have a chance vs the top koreans ofc i was, the only players that would be able to compete vs koreans are the ones training in korea, all the other players would never be able to win consistently vs the top players If this trend continues [foreigners not being able to make any type of commitment to train in Korea], the SC2 scene will just end up being like the BW scene, with Korea dominating everyone. It kind of makes me sad. It's unfortunate that western pros see absolutely no incentive to compete with the best because of all the "easy" money that's available to them in the West. yup, the leap in skill has been HUGE in korea ever since sc2 came out, i could safely say that a few of the foreigners were better than the top koreans in the earlier days of sc2(i actually thought idra had a good chance of winning one of the 1st 2 gsl seasons if he had a bit of luck) but ever since they started setting up proteam houses theyve been improving at a much faster rate than us, their understanding/execution of the game is just evolving much faster than us and sadly if were not able to have to same type of infrastructure(which i dont see happening anytime soon) that the koreans have were just gonna end up falling behind even more Thanks TT1 for giving us your honest opinion and I do agree with you. If Western Pros don't step up the skill gap will only get bigger and bigger and we will have a BW situation again. theres only so much individual players can do, need $$$/sponsorship support bro Well it comes down to the dedication of the player. If Mr. Yong asks Jaedong to practice 100 games for an upcoming match he's gonna do it and not complain. If you look at other players (not gonna call anyone but you know who practices and who doesn't regularly) that participate in star2 tournaments I don't believe for 10 seconds they do that or would unless put under the spotlight.
that's slave labor. No one wants to go back to how it was in broodwar and the koreans are specifically trying to avoid that kind of regiment.
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On May 22 2011 14:37 Serpico wrote:Show nested quote +On May 22 2011 13:35 Baarn wrote:On May 22 2011 13:21 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 13:09 windsupernova wrote:On May 22 2011 13:03 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 12:45 gozima wrote:On May 22 2011 12:19 TT1 wrote:On May 22 2011 12:10 Dawski wrote:
TT1 i love you and all but you gotta work on your communication haha. The way you made it sound in your response was that you are the representative of the entire foreigner community and that we all feel that we can't even compete in the first rounds of the tourney. Shouldve used better words like you did in your response with "enough of a skill difference to be a bad investment". Sometimes small things like that can piss people off when your trying to represent them.
and you have to admit but that world lineup that you said he was in denial about...was pretty fricken stacked and i also believe it would have a chance vs the top koreans ofc i was, the only players that would be able to compete vs koreans are the ones training in korea, all the other players would never be able to win consistently vs the top players If this trend continues [foreigners not being able to make any type of commitment to train in Korea], the SC2 scene will just end up being like the BW scene, with Korea dominating everyone. It kind of makes me sad. It's unfortunate that western pros see absolutely no incentive to compete with the best because of all the "easy" money that's available to them in the West. yup, the leap in skill has been HUGE in korea ever since sc2 came out, i could safely say that a few of the foreigners were better than the top koreans in the earlier days of sc2(i actually thought idra had a good chance of winning one of the 1st 2 gsl seasons if he had a bit of luck) but ever since they started setting up proteam houses theyve been improving at a much faster rate than us, their understanding/execution of the game is just evolving much faster than us and sadly if were not able to have to same type of infrastructure(which i dont see happening anytime soon) that the koreans have were just gonna end up falling behind even more Thanks TT1 for giving us your honest opinion and I do agree with you. If Western Pros don't step up the skill gap will only get bigger and bigger and we will have a BW situation again. theres only so much individual players can do, need $$$/sponsorship support bro Well it comes down to the dedication of the player. If Mr. Yong asks Jaedong to practice 100 games for an upcoming match he's gonna do it and not complain. If you look at other players (not gonna call anyone but you know who practices and who doesn't regularly) that participate in star2 tournaments I don't believe for 10 seconds they do that or would unless put under the spotlight. that's slave labor. No one wants to go back to how it was in broodwar and the koreans are specifically trying to avoid that kind of regiment.
I disagree with calling it slave labor. Some games require more time spent to master. Star 2 you can go to univ and still make a living. You still need to practice though and the more the better.
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On May 22 2011 02:14 Tanatos wrote:
Mr. Chae also spoke about his opinion on providing code S spot for foreign players. "I don't think GSL is same level as MLG. I believe foreign fans also think same as me. There is notable difference between the seed for Koreans to MLG Championship and the seed for foreigners to GSL code S."
I think the majority of viewers dont really care if they are entertained by "99% skill players" or by "95% skill players"; in fact a game between supposedly lesser players can be more entertaining(*1) and there seems to be a significant difference between the Korean and non-Korean styles. Koreans seem to practice more precision and fixed build orders, while non-Koreans seem to be more able to adjust on the fly. To me the second style is more attractive as several GSL finals have shown a weakness in the attractiveness of the Korean style.
The lack of preparation for a specific opponent is shown each time in the GSTL, but since the "super tournament" is another long and drawn out Korean tournament it will probably end up with a lot of boring games which are all shown nevertheless. The 'arc' for such a tournament is much too long to keep the tension from start to finish and GOM should add more shorter tournaments which last a day or two only since they already have the long GSL seasons. Try to make a Korean MLG and you might get foreigners into the tournament!
(*1) Super specific preparation might lead to a "build order loss" like we have seen in the last GSL finals and "lesser players" are prone to make mistakes which can still be neutralized by a brief resurgence of brilliance.
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On May 22 2011 13:54 Azarkon wrote:
The time commitment is almost certainly the main reason, along with lack of free travel. Foreigners in other games like WC 3, CS, and DOTA go regularly to tournaments all across Europe, and to China, Korea, Malaysia, etc. when invited. But for SC 2 they don't seem to be interested. The difference between WC 3, CS, and DOTA tournaments and the GSL, including the GSL Super Tournament, is that they're not month-long, but week-long, or in some cases weekend-long affairs, and travel expenses are usually paid by the organizers.
It's quite obvious when comparing foreigners' response to the GSL WC and the actual GSL leagues what the reason for the rejections is. What's not obvious is what the GSL organizers intend to do about it, if anything.
WC3, CS and Dota's popularity weren't focused in Korea and isn't exactly part of their culture.
A lot of focus and prizemoney has been pumped into Starcraft (and SC2 to an extent) in Korea. Perhaps if the SC2 Korean scene declines like the WC3, we'll see the top Koreans get international sponsorships (like how Lyn, Moon, the others got sponsorships from MYM and SK) and then participate in more foreign tournaments... But at the moment, the Korean scene seems to be rather healthy with the expansion of the team league and the influx of sponsors to the new Korean teams. There's no real incentive or funds to go overseas for the Korean players anyway.
I'm not entirely sure, but I'm pretty sure that before the Korean WC3 leagues started declining in popularity, most of the tournaments between the top War3 pros of Europe and Korea/China were online in high latency environments (aside from big WCGs and ESWCs).
As for Dota, I believe not until maybe 2 or 3 years ago did the Chinese and Asian teams start owning in LANs as most of the LANs were based in Europe before that and most tournaments were online anyway. Prior to that it had always been European teams dominating.
EDIT:
TL;DR - The Korean Starcraft (and eSports) culture is to make their tournaments broadcasted leagues similar to real sports tournaments rather than a LAN over a couple of days. They tried to use the same model for WC3, but failed because of its lost of popularity and the foreigner scene outgrew it... Expecting SC2 to follow suit is kind of like hoping the Korean televised SC2 scene dies. But we can still wait and see how GomTV decides to adjust to accommodate foreigners and expand the Korean SC2 scene at the same time.
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Considering TT1 has experience firsthand. There is some truth in what he says. However, Subversion made a good point. When speaking, it is best to stick to your personal experience(s).
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How many tournaments are there in Korea?
How many tournaments are there in Europe?
It's an easy decision of where to stay.
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EPT
