EPTRTS has already been declining for the past 5-6 years even in Korea. One only needs to look at a MSL or OSL and compare it to one from 2004 or so. I think if sc2 succeeds then both games will benefit from it but if it fails it will take competitive rts down with it/
FOMOS: BW will live if SC2 dies? - Page 2
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Hakker
United States1360 Posts
RTS has already been declining for the past 5-6 years even in Korea. One only needs to look at a MSL or OSL and compare it to one from 2004 or so. I think if sc2 succeeds then both games will benefit from it but if it fails it will take competitive rts down with it/ | ||
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LunarC
United States1186 Posts
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Joroth
United States318 Posts
It really disappoints me that SC2 has exploded so much as a spectator sport. That every now and than when patches are few and far between so many people will be off complaining how fucked up something is and trying to start drama that when something happens it explodes. | ||
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isM
United States735 Posts
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mordk
Chile8385 Posts
On January 07 2011 13:55 frodoguy wrote: you obviously look down on acti-blizz too much, they would not stoop that low, unless it was well worth the time and money spent, which i doubt. If sc2 dies, they would most likely give up on it, since that would seem to be the most cost effective decision. Fighting with kespa after sc2 dying amounts to nothing except alittle bit of satisfaction over revenge. Of course it would be worth their money and time. Particularly if blizzard succeds in their current demands in relation to OGN/MBC. They could easily turn to squeeze the last few dollars out of SC:BW by taking big action against its scene. Other blizzard games will still succeed and sell like crazy in korea even is SC as a whole just dies, they have no need to care for these things. I don't know what to think really, I certainly believe actiblizz will try to get the most out of their games up to the last second, so I really wouldn't find it weird if they decided to act against the BW proscene in case SC2 died, then just leave the brand behind them, tailor the SC2 expansions towards getting most out of initial sales, then focus all their efforts in WoW expansions and the future MMO Titan. Sounds like a plan to me. | ||
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ckunkel1
United States181 Posts
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Marl
United States694 Posts
BW on the other hand is freaking awesome. I feel like last night's MSL games with JD's drone rush and the Stork vs Bisu match was more entertaining than the 2nd and 3rd GSLs combined. | ||
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Cofo
United States1388 Posts
IS THAT TOO MUCH TO ASK? | ||
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LunarC
United States1186 Posts
On January 07 2011 14:12 Teogamer wrote: SC2 simply hasn't developed enough to deserve something like GSL. I tune into the GSL when I can, but I really don't get excited about any players including foreigners anymore. I think GSL should have waited a year or even for the final expansion to come out because the game has no real star players, gimmicky play is viable, and the map pool is horrible. BW on the other hand is freaking awesome. I feel like last night's MSL games with JD's drone rush and the Stork vs Bisu match was more entertaining than the 2nd and 3rd GSLs combined. Where do you think the game evolves most and the professional scene is developed? In large tournament settings. Like Proleague. Or the OSL. Or the MSL. The BW scene didn't pop up overnight, you know. It started ten years ago. | ||
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Elwar
953 Posts
Neither is the argument as to why SC2 needs BW sound. SC2 doesn't need BW to transition new players, it needs current players and viewers to switch over ASAP combined with new talent emerging who weren't in the BW proscene. In fact if BW died tomorrow the SC2 pool of talent would increase one-hundred fold and the viewership would surely follow. | ||
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fatfail
United States386 Posts
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eviltomahawk
United States11135 Posts
Well, with KeSPA's current stance against people who switched over, players like NaDa, BoxeR, MVP, JulyZerg won't be able to switch back to BW due to KeSPA's 3 year license ban against switchers. Hopefully, they will change this rule if they see that SC2 no longer threatens them, but if not, this essentially means that the former stars of BW will be left out in the cold. People link SC2's success in Korea as an important sign on whether or not it can survive outside of Korea. Assuming that the SC2 scene dies off in Korea, what will happen to the foreign scene? Unlike the Korean scene, the foreign scene has pretty much entirely switched over to SC2. If the foreign scene fails due to a failed Korean scene, then I think no one is going to switch back to BW. Sponsors and tournaments would move on to other games, and we would be left with a dead foreign scene that is but a shell of its former self. Now, this is under the assumption that the foreign scene's success is linked to the Korean scene's success, which could be a completely wrong assumption, but if true, it does not bode well for anyone if the Korean scene fails. The death of SC2 is not to be celebrated. On one hand, it returns the scene to the status quo. On the other hand, it would become a missed opportunity to expand the scene beyond the status quo to become something greater. | ||
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Slago
Canada726 Posts
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mustaju
Estonia4504 Posts
On January 07 2011 14:34 eviltomahawk wrote: Well, with KeSPA's current stance against people who switched over, players like NaDa, BoxeR, MVP, JulyZerg won't be able to switch back to BW due to KeSPA's 3 year license ban against switchers. Hopefully, they will change this rule if they see that SC2 no longer threatens them, but if not, this essentially means that the former stars of BW will be left out in the cold. There's different options as well. Former BW pros have become coaches. commentators, managers, so there's somewhere to get back to. | ||
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Consolidate
United States829 Posts
The natural assumption was that Starcraft 2 would ramp up in popularity as time went on, but that obviously isn't the case. I'm too tired to re-iterate why Starcraft 2 is flawed as a spectator sport, but maybe someone else will. Starcraft 2 is running on hype and novelty. It will soon meet the same hard limitations that broodwar faces as an e-sport -- only worse because it is an inferior game. Allow me to qualify. Ask any progamer which of the two Starcrafts is more difficult, more balanced, more rewarding of skill, and he will say that it is broodwar. That is the uncomfortable truth that can't be buried by any amount of hype or direct cash-infusion. If broodwar is to fail in the long run, Starcraft 2 is similar enough (slightly worse in all ways), that it can also be expected to fail. | ||
Waxangel
United States33571 Posts
I'm sure some of us would love to believe that so there's a clear villain, but at the very least it's going to be more complicated than that, even if there are malicious intentions. | ||
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Cryogenic
Canada75 Posts
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Go0g3n
Russian Federation410 Posts
Let the game get balanced, let GOM introduce all their leagues, get the audience to know/understand their format better and you'll see it become more popular than ever. (As it happened with GOM Classic, only by the third season it started beating OSL/MSL in ratings). | ||
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QuothTheRaven
United States5524 Posts
On January 07 2011 13:47 supernovamaniac wrote: Wrong. If SC2 dies but BW lives, what will Blizzard try to do? Just let KeSPA run the tournaments? The end result is not guaranteed in this situation. However, Blizzard will take much more severe action if its league dies. For starters, Blizzard (Gretech) is already suing KeSPA, OGN, and MBC for copyright violations. I suppose it's possible that they could do more than that, but it's not as if Blizzard is currently being benevolent towards the professional BW scene. Another point that's worth some consideration is that Blizzard still has two expansion packs that it wants to release. If the SC2 competitive scene flounders sometime in the next year, pulling a huge "fuck you" revenge move would greatly damage their expansion pack sales in Korea. Some of that ill will might spill over and hurt their WoW subscription numbers, as well (though that's more speculative). At any rate, if at some point in the future Starcraft 2 is already dead in Korea, Blizzard has almost nothing to gain at that point by taking extra measures to kill BW, and they would probably damage the reputation of the company as well as future game sales in Korea. Bobby Kotick would have a fit! | ||
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GaMeOfFeAr
United States26 Posts
On January 07 2011 14:43 Consolidate wrote: People need to be honest as to why interest in the GSL is ACTUALLY DECLINING! The natural assumption was that Starcraft 2 would ramp up in popularity as time went on, but that obviously isn't the case. I'm too tired to re-iterate why Starcraft 2 is flawed as a spectator sport, but maybe someone else will. Starcraft 2 is running on hype and novelty. It will soon meet the same hard limitations that broodwar faces as an e-sport -- only worse because it is an inferior game. Allow me to qualify. Ask any progamer which of the two Starcrafts is more difficult, more balanced, more rewarding of skill, and he will say that it is broodwar. That is the uncomfortable truth that can't be buried by any amount of hype or direct cash-infusion. If broodwar is to fail in the long run, Starcraft 2 is similar enough (slightly worse in all ways), that it can also be expected to fail. Please make an honest assessment when you compare a 10 year old, completed, well established game, to a 6 month old, incomplete game with two expansions planned in the future. It is too early to determine any of your false assumptions with any semblance of accuracy. There is one way that Blizzard can change which is currently crippling the potential future of Starcraft 2; Blizzard needs to turn over map making to an outside league (i.e. ICCUP). The stagnant map pool is hurting Starcraft 2 more than anything else at the moment. | ||
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