EPT@ all the whining Zergs seriously you complain about phoenixes which need at least micro to kill drones and which cant destroy spores... but mutas which can kill ground and air without micro and buildings without micro is fine? I dont understand the world anymore.
Patch 1.2.0 on PTR - Page 93
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AmstAff
Germany949 Posts
@ all the whining Zergs seriously you complain about phoenixes which need at least micro to kill drones and which cant destroy spores... but mutas which can kill ground and air without micro and buildings without micro is fine? I dont understand the world anymore. | ||
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Mr_Kzimir
France268 Posts
On December 04 2010 23:05 AmstAff wrote: after thinking about it it seems like blizzard wants more Terrans to all in. they didnt buffed T in anyway for late midgame / lategame but with the scv repair nerf they nerfed the PF into being useless. there were many ways to beat a PF without losing much (storms, fg and all the other high ranged units, air units and units with high damage. the PF was only csteffective if someone was stupid enough to move melee units at it or a little clumped group of ranged unit. T doenst have the ridiculously fast 4,7 speed units offcreep!!! like zergs have and they dont have a speedgupgrade for nearly every unit like zergs have and they cant build roads (creep) like zergs can to be faster and they cant warp in storms to kill T/Z pushes or at least deny them long enough until the main army is back. a PF costs 550/150 + Mules imo it doesnt make any sense to build a PF. I have the same shit with mutas flying in my base roflstomping it and going back to defend vs the push and simply winning the game, I dont need the same shit for roaches roflstomping a PF that cant lift and going back in 6 secs on creep to defend vs the push. I seriously dont understand this T is so fucking immobile if you build anything else than just MMMG (which totally blows in any game that goes past 10mins) and still they try everything to force Terrans to build more bio. thor was the only unit that could deal with phoenix harass (if you didnt wanted to build turrets which doenst move and dont attack ground units) but now a voidray just rapes them. @ all the whining Zergs seriously you complain about phoenixes which need at least micro to kill drones and which cant destroy spores... but mutas which can kill ground and air without micro and buildings without micro is fine? I dont understand the world anymore. We got a (prolly removed) new imba feature with 30 sec bunker. No reason to complain about this patch /sarcasm On a serious note Jinro/Mana showed us what is the futur of PvZ/T past 15 minutes Slowly bunker walking to your enemy base why the hell would you try something else , your backbone units beeing slow like hell | ||
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Pitrocelli
Slovakia127 Posts
Almost every patch is reducing possibilities. Even from beta neural parasite roflstomp, 5R reaper, void ray rush, 1st rax builds, Ultralisk cripple.. Now we see big incline towards snowball based strategies, there are no defender's advantages and no WOW tricks players can do to reverse flow of lost game becouse of limited options players have. As result we can see streamed games of top pro's doing 2 rax allins and crowd of loyal fans vomitting all over the globe. With patching like this we will end up with empty C&C like timing push game. | ||
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solidbebe
Netherlands4921 Posts
So... Zerg have to deal with a mass of fast flying air units that are great at harassing masses of probes/drones/scvs. .... wait a minute... P.S f/edit: Zergs are the biggest whiners.. ever. The first patch where they don't get something they like, and suddenly, it's OMG PROTOSS AIR UNBEATABLE NOW OMG NERF NERF NERF! I'm sick of zerg whining. Yes, you have to use keys for production normally... just like every other race. Yes, you have to protect yourself from air harrassment now... just like every other race. Yes, you have to think strategically now about where you put your 'supply' units (aka overlords) and god forbid, protect them... just like every other race. ...Go cry yourselves to sleep with nightmares about my 'IMBA' phoenixes. But what CAN a zerg do against 2 stargate pheonix opening into mass gateway + maybe colossi. You get corruptors to hold off the pheonix and any ground army will stomp you, unless you don't get enough corruptors to hold off the pheonix. Muta's are a no go against pheonix especially without fungal. And hydras just can't hit the pheonix anymore cos they're so fast and there's nothing to hold them in place. And keep in mind that toss can use pheonix to slow down the zerg incredibly well, they can pick off alot of overlords hereby supply blocking the zerg and hindering army production. And you lose all overlord vision we used to have. We can't delay expansions anymore with overlords, overseers can get picked off extremely easy. And you have to build some kind off spore crawler triangle to keep your overlords in, which cost alot of money and drones especially early on. And you have this Mass of overlords in your base, which can really lead to misclicking units. All of this because 2 gate pheonix is suddenly very viable and on TOP of that, the production time for pheonix has been buffed. So what CAN you do against a toss going 2 stargate pheonix, besides ending the game as quickly as possible with some kind off cheese or rush. | ||
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Roggay
Switzerland6320 Posts
On December 04 2010 23:05 AmstAff wrote: after thinking about it it seems like blizzard wants more Terrans to all in. they didnt buffed T in anyway for late midgame / lategame but with the scv repair nerf they nerfed the PF into being useless. there were many ways to beat a PF without losing much (storms, fg and all the other high ranged units, air units and units with high damage. the PF was only csteffective if someone was stupid enough to move melee units at it or a little clumped group of ranged unit. T doenst have the ridiculously fast 4,7 speed units offcreep!!! like zergs have and they dont have a speedgupgrade for nearly every unit like zergs have and they cant build roads (creep) like zergs can to be faster and they cant warp in storms to kill T/Z pushes or at least deny them long enough until the main army is back. a PF costs 550/150 + Mules imo it doesnt make any sense to build a PF. I have the same shit with mutas flying in my base roflstomping it and going back to defend vs the push and simply winning the game, I dont need the same shit for roaches roflstomping a PF that cant lift and going back in 6 secs on creep to defend vs the push. I seriously dont understand this T is so fucking immobile if you build anything else than just MMMG (which totally blows in any game that goes past 10mins) and still they try everything to force Terrans to build more bio. thor was the only unit that could deal with phoenix harass (if you didnt wanted to build turrets which doenst move and dont attack ground units) but now a voidray just rapes them. @ all the whining Zergs seriously you complain about phoenixes which need at least micro to kill drones and which cant destroy spores... but mutas which can kill ground and air without micro and buildings without micro is fine? I dont understand the world anymore. But phoenixes deny mutas completely now. Zerg doesnt have clear answer to them. Other races HAVE answers to mutas. However Im not complaining, it will makes thing more interresting. | ||
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DragoonPK
3259 Posts
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kedinik
United States352 Posts
Throw down a few spore crawlers, get a few extra queens, drones that much harder to replace what you lose, walk over and see if you can kill them with roach/hydra, play it by ear from there. | ||
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Mascherano
Argentina1726 Posts
On December 04 2010 22:49 andrewwiggin wrote: You know, I hope no protoss wins GSL now, as sad as that is... because if they do, you KNOW a billion zerg players are gonna get every protoss unit nerfed in a second. Or we could see guys like Morrow and TLO switch to Protoss. lol | ||
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Mr_Kzimir
France268 Posts
On December 04 2010 23:11 Mascherano wrote: Or we could see guys like Morrow and TLO switch to Protoss. lol I almost forgot about that XD Edit : There is a screen somewhere in this thread of a guy playing vs morrow who actually plays toss. Edit 2 : Found ![[image loading]](http://img811.imageshack.us/img811/7213/placementmatch.png) | ||
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ahwala
Germany391 Posts
On December 04 2010 23:07 Pitrocelli wrote: Undeniable reason why Blizzard balancing fails: Almost every patch is reducing possibilities. Even from beta neural parasite roflstomp, 5R reaper, void ray rush, 1st rax builds, Ultralisk cripple.. Now we see big incline towards snowball based strategies, there are no defender's advantages and no WOW tricks players can do to reverse flow of lost game becouse of limited options players have. As result we can see streamed games of top pro's doing 2 rax allins and crowd of loyal fans vomitting all over the globe. With patching like this we will end up with empty C&C like timing push game. QFT And it would be so sad if they continue with this. | ||
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Chaosvuistje
Netherlands2581 Posts
All I'm saying is that I'm open to LEGIT ways of beating phoenix into collosi/stalker ball in the current situation, not the 1.2 patch. Because Im really having trouble with it for a long time. Against 2base protoss pushes in general I'm very shaky. Could any good zerg shed some light about how you combat this kind of build to stay alive? Lastly, I would want to ask andrewwiggin politely to step back a bit. We know your opinion after a lot of posts in this thread and constantly giving us pointers about what your stances are isnt doing this discussion well. Sorry if you are offended by this. | ||
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Shinkugami
England74 Posts
On December 04 2010 23:11 Mascherano wrote: Or we could see guys like Morrow and TLO switch to Protoss. lol I'm waiting for the totally believable explanation that "they wanted to play protoss all along but [insert BS here]" SC2 is a definite proof Blizzard stinks at balancing and no amount of fanboyism or blind love for the company that made SC1 will ever redeem the clusterfuck that is SC2. | ||
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ltortoise
633 Posts
On December 04 2010 23:15 Shinkugami wrote: I'm waiting for the totally believable explanation that "they wanted to play protoss all along but [insert BS here]" SC2 is a definite proof Blizzard stinks at balancing and no amount of fanboyism or blind love for the company that made SC1 will ever redeem the clusterfuck that is SC2. Yes because Starcraft before Brood War was totally balanced... What is wrong with you?? | ||
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SmoKim
Denmark10305 Posts
are there any words about chat channels being able to be moderated? else it's gonna be a clusterfuck | ||
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IPS.Mardow.
Germany713 Posts
On December 04 2010 23:20 ltortoise wrote: Yes because Starcraft before Brood War was totally balanced... What is wrong with you?? We're living in another time. Blizzard had the perfect basis (SC:BW) to make a well balanced game but this (SC2 -.-) is what we got. Stop those kind of comparisons pls. | ||
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ltortoise
633 Posts
On December 04 2010 23:21 IPS.Mardow. wrote: We're living in another time. Blizzard had the perfect basis (SC:BW) to make a well balanced game but this (SC2 -.-) is what we got. Stop those kind of comparisons pls. So because Blizzard did something difficult in the past (balance an incredibly complex game over the course of years), that means they should be able to do it instantly now. I will ask you again: What is wrong with you? No matter how many times Blizzard does it, balancing a game is not easy, fast, or painless. It's going to take a while. | ||
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syllogism
Finland5948 Posts
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Shinkugami
England74 Posts
On December 04 2010 23:20 ltortoise wrote: Yes because Starcraft before Brood War was totally balanced... What is wrong with you?? BW certainly was balanced better than this mess. Also it has nothing to do with "time of balance" either; The overall SC1 balance was made little steps at a time while sc2 "balance changes" are complete overhauls changing the entire metagame EVERY DAMN TIME. Plus some of these changes like Fungal not affecting air are downright retarded. It should be clear to anyone not drowning in fanboyism that Blizz has no f*kin clue about what they're doing. | ||
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ROOTFayth
Canada3351 Posts
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Dreamexpress
80 Posts
from reading this thread everybody seem to think they are better and know more | ||
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