EPTPatch 1.1 Is Coming 09.22 - Page 17
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Camlito
Australia4040 Posts
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dave22222
20 Posts
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cykalu
Australia30 Posts
Hydras may become more variable against those silly tanks.. | ||
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Konsume
Canada466 Posts
On September 21 2010 00:45 Camlito wrote: I'm gonna have me some obnoxious protoss tears in a few days :D. I really really really doupt it's going to change anything on anymaps BUT steppes of war. In any case I bet that they will have to start with forge 10 on steppes and take late gaz. protoss [a+move] will just be less of a no-brainer early game now! as for terran changes.... I doupt it's going to do anything significant in TvZ... so.... I don't know... | ||
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tOOkOmA4U
Germany253 Posts
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OPSavioR
Sweden1465 Posts
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ELA
Denmark4608 Posts
On September 21 2010 00:53 Konsume wrote: I really really really doupt it's going to change anything on anymaps BUT steppes of war. In any case I bet that they will have to start with forge 10 on steppes and take late gaz. protoss [a+move] will just be less of a no-brainer early game now! as for terran changes.... I doupt it's going to do anything significant in TvZ... so.... I don't know... I would say that Hydralisks are a fair bit more viable in ZvT now - It takes 3 shots from a sieged up siegetank to kill a hydra now.. Thats pretty huge! | ||
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accaris
98 Posts
Meaning tomorrow. | ||
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Sixes
Canada1123 Posts
On September 20 2010 19:35 BeMannerDuPenner wrote: you rreally are exaggerating hard here. T cant just "switch mass air". the 2 units you talked about,bc&banshee, need techlabs. a terran will have 0-1 starport with techlabs in tvz. and ultras are plain amazing against almost evrything. the 10% nerf to their armored dmg wont change anything about that. and absolute will not make them "not viable". yeah Z has problems, ye the maps are shit but i think you just are randomly complaining about things right now. Z has problems that occur before ultras can pop. There are actually a fair few fast ultra strats out there now which basically revolve around "How can I stay alive with the econ to support ultras until I can pop them out and be on even ground?". Note that both other races still have very good solutions to ultras or broodlords (immortals and marauders for ultras and vikings and blink stalkers for broodlords) that are extremely hard counters so they don't mean the zerg player wins, just that the zerg player has a fighting chance to counter mech or mass stalker. The basic issue (other than wall offs, the fact that zerg tier 1/1.5 can't get up a ramp, silly maps with cliffs on naturals and tech times that are double what the opposition has) is that with so few available units zerg units have been made soft counters but only rarely hard counters (the baneling comes to mind, as do ultras). The hard counters are usually due to a big +xx against light or armored or a ton of splash (which counters swarms or infantry balls) and zerg has very few of these, especially relative to Terran (which has a +xx against armored or light on almost every unit). This means the zerg solution to most things is out macro and spam soft counters. You can perfectly scout an opponent, make the counter and still barely win (with the opponent not scouting a thing) because we cant just pop up with marauders to kill stalkers in 5 seconds flat. To further complicate things zerg have terrible range (usually melee) so every unit becomes worse when battles get large. Lings generally destroy stalkers but with a choked up map there is a critical mass of stalkers where lings don't cut it (and we need ultras and hope the P player isn't great at blink micro). That leads to another point about zerg. A zerg player with godly micro can't use it to the extent a P player can abuse blink or a T player can abuse stim. This is due again to all the units being melee and having almost no abilities. The best Z can hope for when it comes to micro is good infestor play and good timing on surrounds where ghost snipe, EMP, storm, blink etc allow a smaller force to destroy the large zerg army. The point being a Z player with crazy micro and good macro shouldn't have to play a 30+ minute game to break a mediocre terran just because the Terran sieged up and sat there. | ||
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Artifex
Belgium189 Posts
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Calidus
150 Posts
On September 21 2010 01:01 Artifex wrote: Its probably september 21 for US and 22 for EU (or the rest of the world) ^^^ | ||
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T0fuuu
Australia2275 Posts
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junemermaid
United States981 Posts
On September 21 2010 00:40 Disp wrote: So you're saying the window is so tight that 5 game seconds (about 3 real seconds) is the difference between holding off an attack and having no chance to defend it? Yeah, thats pretty much what he's saying. Sounds pretty silly, doesn't it? Almost irrational. | ||
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FaCE_1
Canada6183 Posts
On September 21 2010 01:02 T0fuuu wrote: please please please give me a ladder reset ! that woudl actually be cool  ne wplacement match ?  | ||
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
On September 21 2010 01:03 junemermaid wrote: Yeah, thats pretty much what he's saying. Sounds pretty silly, doesn't it? Almost irrational. That really is the difference more often than you'd think, at least after the builds are refined a bit more. | ||
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Sixes
Canada1123 Posts
On September 21 2010 00:58 ELA wrote: I would say that Hydralisks are a fair bit more viable in ZvT now - It takes 3 shots from a sieged up siegetank to kill a hydra now.. Thats pretty huge! Actually the units that will benefit from this most are the Queen and the IT. ITs can now soak up 2 tank hits (and cause 2 splash hits to nearby units). Queens can be used to soak up a bunch of hits from the early 2-3 tank/marine push as the lings run in. Remember that hydras get destroyed by stimmed marines, blue flame hellions, to some extent thors ... and still can't move faster than an anemic snail. I don't think we will see that many more hydras but hopefully we will see more cool infestor play (especially from the pros). I know that even in my games ITs causing 2 splash hits would be great for killing that silly bio ball beside the sieged tanks. The reaper nerf may not seem like much but it may be all that is needed to get up an extra queen or batch of roaches in time (or scout raxes 2-3-4-5 in time). The ultra nerf is actually a buff, supply depot/cannon/pylon walls or stacks will get destroyed which is a blessing (most of the time my ultras are running into cannon lines because they are one of the only units that can break them). | ||
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gruntrush
Canada134 Posts
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Altsa
Finland990 Posts
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junemermaid
United States981 Posts
On September 21 2010 01:06 Shikyo wrote: That really is the difference more often than you'd think, at least after the builds are refined a bit more. On the zerg side of the equation, I'd be interested in seeing how people refine the six pool more. On the protoss side, you can always just do a complete wall-off, clog a probe in the choke point to make up for the zealot build time. And this is really only an issue on Steppes, and even then, its not an issue. Basically anything you do that doesn't drop your probe count below 6 is in the protoss' favor. | ||
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bodycount
Poland36 Posts
On September 21 2010 01:02 T0fuuu wrote: please please please give me a ladder reset ! And the point of ladder reset is? You think you will suck less when you start from scratch with 0 losses? Just play the game, no one cares about your win/lose ratio. | ||
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