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Affluenza
United Kingdom214 Posts
I mean you hear stories of Zerg development being slow and troublesome but you never think they would just allow the SC2 release to happen unless they were fully capable of releasing relatively right races... It is quite clear to see that Terran and Protoss got all the love, care and attention... Hell even the most iconic unit the Zergling has not transitioned or been buffed like Zealots or Marines...infact they seem to be just a straight transition. | ||
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Phayze
Canada2029 Posts
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Bull-Demon
United States582 Posts
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Affluenza
United Kingdom214 Posts
On August 15 2010 23:20 Phayze wrote: Affluenza, ZvT, despite nothing being changed was relatively alright nearing the end of beta. This was when terrans starting using pretty abusive builds and got better in general (As tester predicted). They learned to use their race to its near full potential and a week after release ZvT became unplayable. Hmm...there has been the same complaints even during the beta. It only reached boiling point after release because obviously there are more players who are experiencing the game. In terms of balance I really don't know what solutions can be drawn up...but I hope Blizzard are paying good enough attention to remedy stuff sharpish! Also my post had more to do with the general feeling one gets...it's not hard to see and feel there is something missing from Zerg...and no one can put their finger on it but that feeling of being under-developed is at the core of it all. Alot of people will bring up the Lurker being taken away prior to beta opening and in my opinion Blizzard should have allowed the beta to give them the answers of whether taking the Lurker away was a good idea rather then leaving it up in the air for all to make assumptions about...but I recently saw a YT video of the Lurker in action and I can honestly say that I think it would have had it's use in the current ZvT especially mech-bio balls!... That discussion is for another thread though I guess... | ||
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shrinkmaster
Germany947 Posts
On August 15 2010 23:20 Phayze wrote: Affluenza, ZvT, despite nothing being changed was relatively alright nearing the end of beta. This was when terrans starting using pretty abusive builds and got better in general (As tester predicted). They learned to use their race to its near full potential and a week after release ZvT became unplayable. The same thing is by the way happening in ZvP right now. Protoss players are getting better in exploiting small weaknesses in the early game and going into mid game with a lead. The problem right now is, that most people complain that ZvT is broken and this leads to ZvP imbalances not being discussed enough. | ||
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Wayem
France455 Posts
On August 15 2010 22:56 Opinion wrote: <Insert irrational Terran denial here> The case is really closed to be honest. too much evidence, too many players unhappy, prepare for Incoming changes. I know Terran are on the denial offensive, as if their denial will somehow divert Blizzard from looking into the problem. "I hear Zerg has a problem? oh, Terran players say they are fine? Carry on then." But this is just standard defense mode for class/race loyalty, sad but predictable behavior. But i doubt there will be Terran Nerfs, or at least nothing drastic. Something like concussive shells or siege tech cost/time, maybe a build time increased, nothing game breaking. 50 minerals here, 2 seconds there. I'm leaning more towards Some slight Zerg buffs, whether to spawn larva or some research costs and build times. I doubt any severe or drastic changes will occur like food count on roaches, new spells or units until the expansion. Good post. This is a normal reaction from T players, denial. Of course, it's hard to admit that if you win it's not entirely because of your skill. The same thing applies to constant whiners in RTS games: if I lost it's not entirely my fault. Blizzard will obviously fix this, but very slightly. I guess EMP projectile will be a little bit slowed down to balance mid-game PvT (the rest of the MU is fine). Siege tanks will take few seconds more to research so the zerg can play safer a little bit longer, etc. But don't expect a "damage from hellions was reduced by 10%" or radical stuff like that... it's not like you'll suddenly win all your games because of the patch. | ||
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Horvath
Hungary11 Posts
Im just asking everyone who trying to argue with zerg is way way worse than the other 2 race, what are you trying to argue with? simple statistical facts?? | ||
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skirmisheR
Sweden451 Posts
On August 15 2010 04:41 floor exercise wrote: Maybe SichuanPanda's going even further over the top. We're talking meta trolling here. This is the kind of out of the box thinking that zerg players need to employ if they want to be competitive. I'm thinking, abuse mobility WHILE tech switching. No can defend. I laughed IRL for 30sec, seriously. Hilarious post, you're a genius (no sarcasm) | ||
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mmdmmd
722 Posts
(examples of early eras of RTS ) Slayer-Boxer That dude from war3, ok, his maps were modded without him knowing. But he was still the highest paid player back at his peak. Also imagine the amount of Fans you will lose if you change to Terran, then gets knock out of the tournament by a Zerg. If that really happen, your public image will be forever damaged. People will bring up this incident at every single opportunity to make you look bad. | ||
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Baarn
United States2702 Posts
On August 15 2010 23:50 Horvath wrote: According to sc2ranks.com Dimaga still the 2nd successful Zerg player in the world after Fanta (who is korean obv). Now Fanta 12th as the MOST successful Zerg player in Diamond ladders.There is only 20 zerg players in the top 100. Im just asking everyone who trying to argue with zerg is way way worse than the other 2 race, what are you trying to argue with? simple statistical facts?? Yet he falls to 40something place if you look at win/loss record. Massing games and gaining points (which zerg is really strong at using the same website statistics) isn't gonna win you a tournament. | ||
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StarBrift
Sweden1761 Posts
This issue is clearly largely map based as some maps are insanely terran favored. But another troubling thing is that every single on of terrans units are useful against both the other races and their tech is ridiculously cheap in terms of gas and minerals. | ||
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JiSu
Korea (South)140 Posts
Anyway, since SC2:Wings Of Liberty was about Terran so Terran is overpowered. I guess when they release the next ones, that race will gets buffed and then become overpowered | ||
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Pking
Sweden142 Posts
Edit: Also I think if Dimaga thinks Z is weak he should definately switch, I don't think anyone should hold it against him. | ||
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synapse
China13814 Posts
On August 16 2010 00:23 Pking wrote: Seing Z is seen as weak against T and P, and TvP is pretty balanced, what is all this talk about T being OP? Is'nt it more appropriate to say Z is weak? I'd say advocate a buff for Z rather than a nerf for T. K? ZvP is pretty balanced, dunno what you're talking about. | ||
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hacpee
United States752 Posts
On August 16 2010 00:23 Pking wrote: Seing Z is seen as weak against T and P, and TvP is pretty balanced, what is all this talk about T being OP? Is'nt it more appropriate to say Z is weak? I'd say advocate a buff for Z rather than a nerf for T. K? Um wtf are you talking about. TvP is favored to T. TvZ is favored to T. ZvP is sort of balanced in that protoss has a small window where it has an advantage(at 7-15 minutes). If protoss doesn't kill zerg by then, its autoloss due to ultras or broodlords. | ||
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AeonStrife
United States918 Posts
I wouldn't be surprised to see more people switch to Terran. | ||
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synapse
China13814 Posts
On August 16 2010 00:28 AeonStrife wrote: So if Blizzard decided to do anything about TvZ, will Z get the buff or T get the nerf? I wouldn't be surprised to see more people switch to Terran. I expect that there'll be major changes in Zerg within the next few weeks; small changes in Terran if any at all. | ||
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Pking
Sweden142 Posts
On August 16 2010 00:24 synapse wrote: ZvP is pretty balanced, dunno what you're talking about. On August 16 2010 00:26 hacpee wrote: Um wtf are you talking about. TvP is favored to T. TvZ is favored to T. ZvP is sort of balanced in that protoss has a small window where it has an advantage(at 7-15 minutes). If protoss doesn't kill zerg by then, its autoloss due to ultras or broodlords. Really? Ok maybe I'm not keeping up with all the imbalance discussions. However, I'd still say Z players should advocate buffing Z, if its TvZ that is the problem (I've not heard anyone complain about the TvP matchup) then buff Z in a way that helps in that matchup. Why? Because you'll have a greater chance getting support for that idea rather than trying to put down another race. | ||
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Escapist
Portugal548 Posts
For example: i watched Check (Z) VS Maka (T), both pro Korean players from Prime Team playing a couple of days ago and the Zerg player handled himself pretty well. | ||
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Horvath
Hungary11 Posts
On August 16 2010 00:06 Baarn wrote: Yet he falls to 40something place if you look at win/loss record. Massing games and gaining points (which zerg is really strong at using the same website statistics) isn't gonna win you a tournament. well i think its still way more representative as the win/loss ratio. playing against players who much less skilled than you may results a decent win/loss ratio but dont think gonna make you win tournaments also neither getting points. if you look up to the points ladder you can notice pretty much everyone massgaming there. Also the 12th player Fanta the only one from the top20 who played 500+ games and no one near to reach that number. there is only a few except him who got 400+ | ||
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