EPTPatch 13 Discussion - Page 24
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NeoScout
United States103 Posts
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roark
United States187 Posts
Corruptor still has the same corruption spell from before. Corruption ability redesigned: Single target. Increases damage taken by 20%. Lasts 30 seconds. Costs 100 energy. Range 6. Cannot target structures. So now, Corrupt Mech + Frenzy Ultra = Dead Mech | ||
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lebalebaleba
United States71 Posts
On May 21 2010 13:52 Iron_ wrote: Most definately scratching my head at the Terran infantry improvements. Gotta be some programmer with a lot of pull that loves Terran but sucks at the game. The Terran Toss matchup is going to be completely broken at the higher levels. the toss in any matchup will be broken. just imagine the new overseer ability vs a toss whos going collosus. | ||
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Sent
United States120 Posts
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cHaNg-sTa
United States1058 Posts
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Vattilega
United States52 Posts
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haitike
Spain2722 Posts
A Size reduction would be good. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On May 21 2010 13:54 roark wrote: Corruptor still has the same corruption spell from before. So now, Corrupt Mech + Frenzy Ultra = Dead Mech Corruptors are hardly worth their cost for just that ability. Why would I spend 150/100 on something that can't actually attack ground units, and can occasionally increase damage by 20% against ONE unit. | ||
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baconbits
United States419 Posts
At the worst, atleast 1-2 ultra will get to the troop line and splash will start hitting friendlies (unless ultra hitbox soaks too much), I think teching as zerg just became far more important which isn't a bad thing. And getting an ultra cavern is still cheaper than spire->gspire investment for broodlords unless you need mutalisks/corruptors. Overseer change is good. I think we'll see them every game now. They have a lot of good opportunities there, esp a very early overseer it could really make for some good timing windows vP. Wondering the range on it if it'll be able to outrange marines though. But delaying upgrades or a specific unit, that is awesome considering you can have an overseer at ~4 minutes and corrupters were ~6 minutes. Hell you could totally stop VR rushes and robo timing push. | ||
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johnlee
United States242 Posts
..... at most, it's interesting. Especially seeing how they added a higher league than Platinum, they're reading about our opinions for sure... but their intrepretations of our opinions are a bit skewed... -_- "Ultras are useless" "HM. LET'S LOWER THEIR HEALTH AND ONLY BOOST THEIR DAMAGE WITH ARMOR!" ".... uh..." | ||
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Doc Daneeka
United States577 Posts
On May 21 2010 13:50 allowicious wrote: People are failing to see the balance between the ultra hp nerf and the armored damage buff. Yes, marauders can kill an ultra quicker, but it's not as big of a deal as everyone is making it out to be. A 600hp ultra with frenzy and the armored damage buff would be ridiculous. Before, the concussive shells made it much more difficult for the ultra to get near the marauders. The ultras were pretty much giant boulders sitting in the middle of a battle, unable to move due to the mass of concussive shells. With frenzy, the ultras can close in on marauders quicker, without the effect of being stunned the whole time. Well, then you argue that marauders can still kite and focus fire down an ultra due quicker to its the decreased hp. Yes that is true, but you will rarely have a scenario where you are fighting pure ultra vs pure marauder. A well mixed zerg army with 4-5 ultras can easily kill a terran bio blob. The ultras are still damage soakers; they just can't soak up as much damage as before. The marauders can maybe focus fire down 2 ultras before they close in, but you still have 2 ultras left that will rip apart the marauders. Plus you have all your other z units swarming in. Even if only 1 ultra survives, a few swipes at the marauders could be a huge battle changer. Splash damage + frenzy that's a good point - they're still damage soakers cos all those maurauder shots are hitting your ultras and not all your other units. the more ultras, the more damage wasted on them. and if even one ultra makes it to the front line and takes a swipe, let's say it's a line of marauders, that's a wide swath of marauders gone - it's like a super baneling. it's absolutely imperative to the other player that none of those ultralisks reach their front line, therefore drawing all fire away from the rest of your army. | ||
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Seiuchi
United States931 Posts
On May 21 2010 13:50 allowicious wrote: People are failing to see the balance between the ultra hp nerf and the armored damage buff. Yes, marauders can kill an ultra quicker, but it's not as big of a deal as everyone is making it out to be. A 600hp ultra with frenzy and the armored damage buff would be ridiculous. Before, the concussive shells made it much more difficult for the ultra to get near the marauders. The ultras were pretty much giant boulders sitting in the middle of a battle, unable to move due to the mass of concussive shells. With frenzy, the ultras can close in on marauders quicker, without the effect of being stunned the whole time. Well, then you argue that marauders can still kite and focus fire down an ultra due quicker to its the decreased hp. Yes that is true, but you will rarely have a scenario where you are fighting pure ultra vs pure marauder. A well mixed zerg army with 4-5 ultras can easily kill a terran bio blob. The ultras are still damage soakers; they just can't soak up as much damage as before. The marauders can maybe focus fire down 2 ultras before they close in, but you still have 2 ultras left that will rip apart the marauders. Plus you have all your other z units swarming in. Even if only 1 ultra survives, a few swipes at the marauders could be a huge battle changer. Splash damage + frenzy + insane damage vs armored units? The remaining z units can come in and clean up. You can also argue that it takes a long time to get to ultras, and they are a huge resource investment in terms of upgrades and unit cost. Yea, but it was the same issue in bw also. They are a late game unit for a reason. If you wanted ultras to be effective in bw, you needed to invest in hive + ultra den + speed upgrade + ultra armor upgrade + evo chamber armor upgrade. They are late game tech/expensive for a reason. Also, stop jumping on the race bandwagon. "ZOMg terran is OP. time to switch to t!" Man up and stick with a race. It's ok to switch races, but don't switch solely based on the fact that you can't figure out a way to win with your old race. Buffs and nerfs will come to all races with time; terran will be nerfed eventually, and protoss will be buffed. The game hasn't even been released yet. Many more patches are on the way. Stop acting like this is the final version, and that no more changes will be made. Have you ever used Ultralisks or used Marauders against them? Concussive Shells have never mattered because Ultras are Massive and aren't effected by them. The reason Marauders are so good is because Ultras can never hit them because Marauders are significantly faster with Stim, even with Ultra speed, so they can kite the Ultra and quickly wipe them out without being hit. You're saying that there won't be a situation with pure Ultra against pure Marauder, but Ultras are so expensive that even if you just get five of them you usually won't have much of an army unless you are so significantly ahead that you can't lose anyways. Add in Infestor gas cost and your army is puny. You argue that they were expensive in BW and that was okay, but that's because they were worth it. There's nothing about these changes that change the fact the Brood Lord is still significantly better in all situations. | ||
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BlasiuS
United States2405 Posts
except why would you get corruptors vs a terran who is going mech? | ||
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junemermaid
United States981 Posts
On May 21 2010 13:53 Salv wrote: If you stick with mass stalker/sentry/zealot versus hydralisks you're going to get raped. You need colossus to deal with them, that is a fact. I have yet to see a single good Protoss prioritize getting charge or blink before getting colossus. 1800 platinum here, I can send you replays if you want. I don't get colossus until I have an expansion up (aound 60ish supply). Stalkers go toe to toe with hydras, especially with upgrades. Blink + charge zealots & sentries work wonders if you know how to use them. Gets a little more tricky when roaches are in play, but having a zerg get enough roaches + hydras to actually start to roll stalker / zealot / sentry takes a bit of time, at which point getting colossus is a priority. I just don't understand this mad rush for colossus... | ||
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krowe
United States184 Posts
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Pufftrees
2449 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + They should just give the ultralisk burrow, make it evolve from a hydra, and have a long aoe damage range, and call it the Lurker. | ||
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Drowsy
United States4876 Posts
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Sentient
United States437 Posts
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Flameberger
United States226 Posts
On May 21 2010 13:43 baconbits wrote: massive units walking thru FF, a little late in the game imo but it is nice. well to be fair the game hasn't come out yet, hard to say anything that's implemented before release is late... It seems to me that in most ways the Ultralisk is becoming a unit that would be good to have a small number supporting your army. They do huge damage especially with the new Frenzy on them but in large numbers most of them get wasted due to inability to get in attack range. Only problem with that is the Ultras are such a huge investment in the high tech and all of their upgrades that it doesn't really seem worth it for just a couple in your army. | ||
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Khalleb
Canada1909 Posts
On May 21 2010 13:58 Pufftrees wrote: Looking forward to many of these changes. I have a feeling they will realize Ultra's need changing again very quickly.. although we only have a week to play before the May31st shutdown. + Show Spoiler + They should just give the ultralisk burrow, make it evolve from a hydra, and have a long aoe damage range, and call it the Lurker. lol they already have burrow | ||
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