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Noocta
France12578 Posts
On October 25 2012 06:58 SarcasmMonster wrote: In that case I'm wrong. Now I'm a bit dissapointed 100/200/2 Raven vs 150/150/3 Oracles...  units should cost more  but are stronger.The protoss unit were more expensive but everyone was like " Huh ! I will never build this unit if it cvost so much ! " :/ | ||
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happyness
United States2400 Posts
On October 25 2012 06:53 Anomi wrote: its 150 gas and 150 minerals http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Oracle My bad, thought it was 200/200. I guess 150 is better, but I still don't think it will be worth it as an early harassment tool at least. | ||
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discator
Germany639 Posts
slowed mutas + storm + pheonix =dead zerg like the ideas though. | ||
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SarcasmMonster
3136 Posts
On October 25 2012 07:05 discator wrote: they just fucked ZvP muta slowed mutas + storm + pheonix =dead zerg like the ideas though. DOESN'T AFFECT AIR | ||
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Crawdad
614 Posts
Which is strange, because it theoretically has more reason to affect air than Fungal does. | ||
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Tomasy
Poland80 Posts
20dps by Oracle hatchery has 1500 hp so 1500/20=75 sec It takes 100 sec to build hatchery. They said it was one of their intensions with these new spells. | ||
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SarcasmMonster
3136 Posts
On October 25 2012 07:14 Crawdad wrote: Which is strange, because it theoretically has more reason to affect air than Fungal does. It should affect friendlies too like storm  I'm no quantum-physicist but time doesn't discriminate. | ||
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TibblesEvilCat
United Kingdom766 Posts
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CikaZombi
Serbia630 Posts
On October 25 2012 06:33 Ramiz1989 wrote: Because, there is no way to counter that... You can move your units away from it, but you will have to cancel building and place it at different location so you don't have to wait for it to build 50% longer. And for upgrades, it is even worse. There would be some retarded timings with it, or delaying enemy timings by a lot. Yes, Overseer can stop the production or research, but Overseer isn't an useful for anything else except scouting, and they pumped the Contaminate cost to 125 energy. There is no way that you would mass them without crippling yourself, while Oracle will actually be really useful unit after this, and isn't as slow as Overseer. I really like both abilities, and Oracle is quite decent now, maybe they will need some number tweaking, but they are good design wise. You can't really compare a unit that requires little to no tech, is always available, that costs no supply but rather gives supply and also costs 3 times less gas then the oracle to the freaking oracle. And I have no clue why contaminate isn't used more often to delay timing pushes from Protoss, because Zerg definitely scouts with them, often times getting out without even dying and still dies to that chrono boosted immortal push. You don't have to cancel anything, because it only slows it down by 50%, not 100%, and it will probably last a lot shorter than the building time itself. It could be tuned easily for it's power. It only delays and it's really really versatile and has different uses in different times of the game. It is an incredibly interesting spell that varies from person to person. As for upgrades, building a couple of turrets or a mine nullifies oracle's harass, and if the spell did land the Protoss player invested money in the oracle and his attacking units are lacking so he is slowing himself down to possibly slow you down. It is the basic concept of the entire unit, and it should work like this. And if it only lasts like 10 seconds it really isn't such a big deal. Alternatively, EMP or some future spell could dispel it if it was deemed too strong. | ||
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idkfa
United States77 Posts
Also, restricting it to ground only means the oracle will be deader than disco against protoss that goes stargate. If it affects air, it can discourage muta harass, phoenix harass (and protecting the mothership core against phoenix seems pretty difficult), drop play of all stripes... and it seems like it would give the oracle some real traction as a viable response. The tempest, lest we forget, was originally conceived for HotS as an answer for muta harass, which is a role it can no longer fill - so why not give the oracle a tool for that? | ||
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LockeTazeline
2390 Posts
On October 25 2012 03:15 awesomoecalypse wrote: The only thing I dont like about this is its counterintuitive and doesn't really work in terms of flavor. That is, the "idea" behind the spell is the Oracle is slowing down time so enemy units move slower. But slowing down time would logically make timed life units last longer. "This spell slows down time for movement purposes, but speeds it up for lifespan purposes" just isn't very sensible or intuitive. Not that every power needs to make "sense" in this way, but its just a minor annoyance. This kinda bothers me too. If time is moving faster inside the bubble, then lifespans would actually increase. (and rate of fire would decrease) Otherwise, I like the changes. Heading in the right direction. | ||
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CikaZombi
Serbia630 Posts
On October 25 2012 07:21 LockeTazeline wrote: This kinda bothers me too. If time is moving faster inside the bubble, then lifespans would actually increase. (and rate of fire would decrease) Otherwise, I like the changes. Heading in the right direction. Maybe make storm last longer in it :DDD | ||
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Cloak
United States816 Posts
On October 25 2012 07:16 SarcasmMonster wrote: It should affect friendlies too like storm I'm no quantum-physicist but time doesn't discriminate. Well, neither do EMPs or ensnaring goo shit. I want a spell to be useful before we gimp it into oblivion. | ||
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SarcasmMonster
3136 Posts
On October 25 2012 07:31 Cloak wrote: Well, neither do EMPs or ensnaring goo shit. I want a spell to be useful before we gimp it into oblivion. EMP does affect friendlies. I think Time Bomb affecting friendlies would make it worse within a deathballing. That's my only real complaint. | ||
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Cloak
United States816 Posts
On October 25 2012 07:35 SarcasmMonster wrote: EMP does affect friendlies. I think Time Bomb affecting friendlies would make it worse within a deathballing. That's my only real complaint. I stand corrected then. Lore discussion aside, I don't see much design benefit for slowing down your own units. Because it stops any offensive use of the unit, pursuit is no longer feasible. It could only be used defensively and possibly on workers, but the numbers seem weak to be useful for that. | ||
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Lauriel
United States108 Posts
I think it'd be a much better unit if they just made the beam target units (ground and air), and allowed it to sneak in and pick off 2-3 workers at a time, even if no structures could be sniped. It increases the justification of building just one or two, and forces the opponent to account for them all game, as even a few seconds of free casting could destroy a few workers. That adds up over time, but I'd definitely not call it overpowered considering how devastating a single drop or a handfull of mutas can be to a mineral line. They may have to tinker with the numbers on pulsar beam, and the health and movement speed of the oracle, but ultimately it feels more like a complete, dynamic unit if it can attack units as well. Best of all, it basically would fill the role of the void ray, and they can remove it from the game entirely since it's (at least in my opinion) an unexciting, underwhelming part of the air arsenal for protoss. Just my .02. The other abilities seem very strong. | ||
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Fig
United States1324 Posts
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NathanaelOlsen
United States19 Posts
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brofestor
Singapore101 Posts
On October 25 2012 07:05 discator wrote: they just fucked ZvP muta slowed mutas + storm + pheonix =dead zerg like the ideas though. PvZ meta is alr fucked fungal growth+ITs+broodlords+neuraled momaship =dead toss | ||
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Belisarius
Australia6233 Posts
Time warp is.... well... frankly, it's what force field probably should have been. It's a nice ability, but I'm disappointed because the oracle having a slow means there's pretty much zero chance of FF and fungal being changed to slow. Revelation should detect again. | ||
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