On May 27 2015 11:10 IgnE wrote: You know that cyclist does squats right? You know that if you want to improve your cycling performance increasing your squat strength is probably the most important thing you can do besides simply getting in shape to handle the metabolic load of that much cardio? That dude has huge quads because he's massively strong, and because he does a lot of cycling. He probably does a lot of cycling because he has sick leg genetics to begin with. But you are doing yourself a disservice if you aren't squatting.
The way I understand it though, is it's a completely different load, no?
A squat is very short burst, cycling is a constant load applied over hours. Like like how benching 300lbs wont really help you much in swimming, it's all about that "short twitch" and "long twitch" or whatever.
I mean, I enjoy squats, but I don't have the energy in my legs for it. I would have thought that the best way to develop leg muscles for cycling would be to cycle at high intensity. I might be wrong, it's just what seemed intuitive to me.
And I do figure genetics play a role, but only to an extent. And even if they do matter a lot, I think I should be quite good in that department. I broke the city record (in my age category) in the 3k, and the yearly record in the 5k in Junior High... Was 115lb at 5'9", then I got fat D:
Anyway, I'll do my research, but what I've also read here is people didn't recommend doing sports while working out, and that it hampers your progress, and that's why I felt that doing squats, as well as cardio (I don't know if that's the best name for it, feels more HIIT the way I bike) at the same time would be counter productive.
If you want to cycle longer and harder you need to strengthen your back and posterior chain. Do you think that Lance Armstrong wasn't squatting?
I don't buy that you don't have the "energy in your legs" for it. I think you are just skipping them because you don't like them. It's like people who say they don't do leg day because they "run" for legs.
On May 27 2015 11:20 IgnE wrote: If you want to cycle longer and harder you need to strengthen your back and posterior chain. Do you think that Lance Armstrong wasn't squatting?
I don't buy that you don't have the "energy in your legs" for it. I think you are just skipping them because you don't like them. It's like people who say they don't do leg day because they "run" for legs.
I did squats for 2 years, I would do them twice a week as Starting Strength said initially, and made everyone in my family do squats, even though it feels like such a difficult exercise the first time you do them.
Like when I finish a bike ride, I am you know, having a little limp, it hurts to fully squat. Even if I could squat, it'd probably be at 50-70% of what I'd squat without biking. And to an extent, sure, I finish a long bike ride, my legs are sore, it's a lot less enjoyable working out something that's sore than not.
All I'm saying is I'm biking a lot, and I've gotten a lot quicker, and would have thought the biking would have been sufficient. I don't care much for people like Lance, but regardless, before this conversation if you told me that he never squatted, I wouldn't find it far-fetched. Anyway, thanks for the different perspective, I'll go read some stuff, see how squatting and other leg work combines with cycling.
You can do strength and conditioning, if not competetive crossfit would not exist
Being serious, I've started a strength program in my CF gym (close to 10 members now, yay) and I have them do squat+presses on monday and deadlift and accesories on saturdays. They can do as much crossfit as they want in between, and they all have done great progress (my fav student girl went from 80kg to 55kg in 3 months, while her squat went from 50kg to a brutal 80kg today)
For an early intermediate (maybe not even intermediate yet) like me, would a routine with weekly progress be better or a monthly-ish cycle sort of thing be better?
I'm considering Texas Method or the Sheiko Intermediate routine with medium load. I'll then adjust the percentages for Sheiko when I think the weights feel too easy.
On May 27 2015 12:06 GoTuNk! wrote: You can do strength and conditioning, if not competetive crossfit would not exist
Being serious, I've started a strength program in my CF gym (close to 10 members now, yay) and I have them do squat+presses on monday and deadlift and accesories on saturdays. They can do as much crossfit as they want in between, and they all have done great progress (my fav student girl went from 80kg to 55kg in 3 months, while her squat went from 50kg to a brutal 80kg today)
Oh, good on her. Yeah, I'm not necessarily a fan of crossfit (maybe brainwashed by all the videos on the internet making fun of it), but I dunno, I feel like crossfit is very well rounded. Yeah, people don't lift as much, some things look a little bit wonky, they aren't as bulky, they often have better endurance, and most likely better at sport than most power lifters.
I guess I'm trying to go for a pretty slim build, where I can easily manipulate my body to do whatever I want. And the other thing is, a smaller body will generally live longer than a large body, as your lungs and heart don't have to work as hard, etc. I dunno, maybe I've matured a little bit, or just changed, but by far my most important focus is health. I used to be so proud when I'd make my squat go up 10lb, at this point... I just don't care. It's not what I aim for... I don't feel success when I leave my basement gym. I feel success the next morning, when I wake up, and just feel good with my body.
I really respect what people like you Gotunk do, just being absolute beasts, but I think I've started to learn it's not for me. I want to be a casual fitness guy who can feel sexy around his lady, do things I enjoy (biking, swimming, tennis, hiking), with some relatively light strength in between. So many people here are just really hardcore for me S:
On May 27 2015 12:06 GoTuNk! wrote: You can do strength and conditioning, if not competetive crossfit would not exist
Being serious, I've started a strength program in my CF gym (close to 10 members now, yay) and I have them do squat+presses on monday and deadlift and accesories on saturdays. They can do as much crossfit as they want in between, and they all have done great progress (my fav student girl went from 80kg to 55kg in 3 months, while her squat went from 50kg to a brutal 80kg today)
Oh, good on her. Yeah, I'm not necessarily a fan of crossfit (maybe brainwashed by all the videos on the internet making fun of it), but I dunno, I feel like crossfit is very well rounded. Yeah, people don't lift as much, some things look a little bit wonky, they aren't as bulky, they often have better endurance, and most likely better at sport than most power lifters.
I guess I'm trying to go for a pretty slim build, where I can easily manipulate my body to do whatever I want. And the other thing is, a smaller body will generally live longer than a large body, as your lungs and heart don't have to work as hard, etc. I dunno, maybe I've matured a little bit, or just changed, but by far my most important focus is health. I used to be so proud when I'd make my squat go up 10lb, at this point... I just don't care. It's not what I aim for... I don't feel success when I leave my basement gym. I feel success the next morning, when I wake up, and just feel good with my body.
I really respect what people like you Gotunk do, just being absolute beasts, but I think I've started to learn it's not for me. I want to be a casual fitness guy who can feel sexy around his lady, do things I enjoy (biking, swimming, tennis, hiking), with some relatively light strength in between. So many people here are just really hardcore for me S:
Muscle mass and strength are two of the most heavily correlated factors with longevity and health.
Alright, so I found the bicycle I'm going to be getting. Decided to spend a little bit more, just because the Shimano 105 5800 with the new bikes has seen impressive improvements, and they are very new, so wont be found on used bikes. As well, I read great things about the carbon frame, so this is the choice:
Thanks mordek, those reads seem like something I would enjoy, so I appreciate it a lot.
I have a good friend in engineering, he's actually one year younger than me, and I think he's very fit, much of what I'm trying to achieve, just to give a reference for where I would like to be in a two or three years. Here are a few of his videos (hope he doesn't come on here haha):
As for a reply to your IgnE, I definitely agree that muscle is better, and that's why I want to exercise. But I suppose my issue with the articles is this:
Firstly, I think the first one is most relevant. Groups are broken down in quarters, and we can see that 50% with lowest muscle mass die sooner, and the top 25%, as well as 26-50%, have the exact same numbers. If I even casually workout , I believe I'd be in the top 50%, and what this suggests to me, is that there is an optimal level, and then once you go even more hard core, your life expectancy will go down, which can't be demonstrated with a regression of 4 points.
This comes from reading papers about rats being starved, and living longer than regular rats, because their metabolism is slower (hence less snipping of DNA strands at their ends when cells multiply), and so forth. I think it is quite universally known that professional atheletes don't have high life expectancies, but it is difficult to say whether that is because they have pushed their body so hard for so long, or whether it is due to steroid and other supplement use.
As for a reply to your IgnE, I definitely agree that muscle is better, and that's why I want to exercise. But I suppose my issue with the articles is this:
Firstly, I think the first one is most relevant. Groups are broken down in quarters, and we can see that 50% with lowest muscle mass die sooner, and the top 25%, as well as 26-50%, have the exact same numbers. If I even casually workout , I believe I'd be in the top 50%, and what this suggests to me, is that there is an optimal level, and then once you go even more hard core, your life expectancy will go down, which can't be demonstrated with a regression of 4 points.
This comes from reading papers about rats being starved, and living longer than regular rats, because their metabolism is slower (hence less snipping of DNA strands at their ends when cells multiply), and so forth. I think it is quite universally known that professional atheletes don't have high life expectancies, but it is difficult to say whether that is because they have pushed their body so hard for so long, or whether it is due to steroid and other supplement use.
I think you are generally wrong that being in the top 50% is all that is sufficient. Leg strength by itself is positively correlated with longevity and robustness, especially as you get older.
To get the benefits of calorie restriction you have to actually severely restrict calories, and hence lean body mass. Those kooks who follow severe calorie restriction diets are generally more fragile, but in a decade or two we should start seeing evidence about whether their quality of life is good into advanced old age. But taking a "middle of the road" approach doesn't net you any benefit on the calorie restriction side of the coin.
As for a reply to your IgnE, I definitely agree that muscle is better, and that's why I want to exercise. But I suppose my issue with the articles is this:
Firstly, I think the first one is most relevant. Groups are broken down in quarters, and we can see that 50% with lowest muscle mass die sooner, and the top 25%, as well as 26-50%, have the exact same numbers. If I even casually workout , I believe I'd be in the top 50%, and what this suggests to me, is that there is an optimal level, and then once you go even more hard core, your life expectancy will go down, which can't be demonstrated with a regression of 4 points.
This comes from reading papers about rats being starved, and living longer than regular rats, because their metabolism is slower (hence less snipping of DNA strands at their ends when cells multiply), and so forth. I think it is quite universally known that professional atheletes don't have high life expectancies, but it is difficult to say whether that is because they have pushed their body so hard for so long, or whether it is due to steroid and other supplement use.
I think you are generally wrong that being in the top 50% is all that is sufficient. Leg strength by itself is positively correlated with longevity and robustness, especially as you get older.
To get the benefits of calorie restriction you have to actually severely restrict calories, and hence lean body mass. Those kooks who follow severe calorie restriction diets are generally more fragile, but in a decade or two we should start seeing evidence about whether their quality of life is good into advanced old age. But taking a "middle of the road" approach doesn't net you any benefit on the calorie restriction side of the coin.
Alright alright, I'll do squats today with my workout, and I'll see how it goes. I don't have a counter-paper to argue what you said, I guess I'm not fully convinced, but I guess that's just what happens when you are told something different than what you've "known" for so long. Again, thanks for the links, appreciate it.
On May 28 2015 08:32 GoTuNk! wrote: Best Links Ever IgnE
Could you ask your friend about his dipping belt? I use a rope and anything above 40kg is massively uncomfortable.
Oh geez, that sounds awful. Every gym I've ever been to had stuff like belts and jump ropes etc. at the side, for anyone to use, when I used to do 75-90lb weighted dips, they weren't too bad, obviously not crazy comfortable, but very manageable.
But sure, I'll ask him for the model and where he got it and whatnot.
Do you guys have any suggestions for straps? I have absolutely no issues with my grip strength for deadlifts (I can easily hold onto my max weights at the moment), but I feel like it would help out a ton for shrugs since my grip massively limits the weight I can handle.
Just get a simple strap. I love them. Fuck small hands for doing high rep pulling.
Re: dipping belts
I think having 6 plates on a belt is always going to be uncomfortable. Also depends on the dipping station. Anything more than 2 or 3 plates I usually have to be pretty careful with it so the chain doesn't grab skin on my thighs or crush my crotch.
On May 28 2015 08:39 MtlGuitarist97 wrote: Do you guys have any suggestions for straps? I have absolutely no issues with my grip strength for deadlifts (I can easily hold onto my max weights at the moment), but I feel like it would help out a ton for shrugs since my grip massively limits the weight I can handle.
On May 28 2015 08:39 MtlGuitarist97 wrote: Do you guys have any suggestions for straps? I have absolutely no issues with my grip strength for deadlifts (I can easily hold onto my max weights at the moment), but I feel like it would help out a ton for shrugs since my grip massively limits the weight I can handle.
EPT
