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2013 NBA Finals - Page 62

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MassHysteria
Profile Joined October 2010
United States3678 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-15 02:53:50
June 15 2013 02:41 GMT
#1221
Yes ofc, didn't mean to make it sound like the opposite if I did anywhere =)

edit: I see what you mean. I meant that if Parker was healthy it would be an even better bet on the Heat imo. Vegas still respects them after a 30-point loss though was the bigger story I had in my mind when I wrote that. Any other team would not have likely had that spread.
"Just ban all the J's...even jinklejoes" --unnamed source
DystopiaX
Profile Joined October 2010
United States16236 Posts
June 15 2013 04:54 GMT
#1222
http://www.businessinsider.com/bill-simmons-rips-espn-for-dwyane-wade-joke-2013-6

starting to think Simmons isn't dumb like he seems on ESPN, he just has to be so PC that he can't actually make jokes or say smart shit.
red_
Profile Joined May 2010
United States8474 Posts
June 15 2013 05:04 GMT
#1223
On June 15 2013 13:54 DystopiaX wrote:
http://www.businessinsider.com/bill-simmons-rips-espn-for-dwyane-wade-joke-2013-6

starting to think Simmons isn't dumb like he seems on ESPN, he just has to be so PC that he can't actually make jokes or say smart shit.


Obviously different people will have different tastes, but I find a lot of his stuff really entertaining. I wouldn't call him 'smart' in the sense of having amazing insight into the sport(s), but he kind of knows that isn't his thing and writes around it. I do feel like he isn't anything near his writing personality when he's on ESPN/ABC.
How did the experience of working at Mr Burns' Nuclear Plant influence Homer's composition of the Iliad and Odyssey?
Ace
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States16096 Posts
June 15 2013 05:10 GMT
#1224
His joke was harmless, they are being ridiculous
Math me up, scumboi. - Acrofales
DystopiaX
Profile Joined October 2010
United States16236 Posts
June 15 2013 05:13 GMT
#1225
On June 15 2013 14:04 red_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 15 2013 13:54 DystopiaX wrote:
http://www.businessinsider.com/bill-simmons-rips-espn-for-dwyane-wade-joke-2013-6

starting to think Simmons isn't dumb like he seems on ESPN, he just has to be so PC that he can't actually make jokes or say smart shit.


Obviously different people will have different tastes, but I find a lot of his stuff really entertaining. I wouldn't call him 'smart' in the sense of having amazing insight into the sport(s), but he kind of knows that isn't his thing and writes around it. I do feel like he isn't anything near his writing personality when he's on ESPN/ABC.

oh I like his writing too (didn't agree with all of his book of basketball but it was an entertaining read/good basic reference for the shit that happened before I was born) I just think that on ESPN he comes off really flat and he'll sometimes say things that don't make sense.

ESPN is being dumb, they can't be blind to how much better and more popular TNT's show is, yet stop them from having that kind of vibe can they?

And Simmons is right. How can they let morons like Stephen A. Smith say the dumb shit he does, yet censor that joke?
Jibba
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States22883 Posts
June 15 2013 05:32 GMT
#1226
Meanwhile on Inside the NBA

ModeratorNow I'm distant, dark in this anthrobeat
MassHysteria
Profile Joined October 2010
United States3678 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-15 06:02:41
June 15 2013 05:47 GMT
#1227
Well ya I knew Simmons was going to have a problem on TV from the first like 3 shows he did. His jokes on his Grantland video shows are funny but they are kind of like Pineapple Express and Hangover stuff, where they aren't for everyone.

I was excited when it was announced he would be on TV, b/c I enjoy his writing and his shows online but once I heard him on there the first few times I knew I wouldn't like him. A lot of his humor, not to mention the tone of his voice on the shows, is not made for a pregame or postgame show where they are trying to be as neutral as possible to appeal to the mass public. He says stuff that is just pure hyperbole sometimes or stuff that just shows his instant thoughts that we know will probably change. Not that it is bad or good, but he looks/feels kind of like a normal fan up there sometimes. And it is not that I don't think he says funny stuff sometimes because he does, it is just that he is so hit-or-miss all the time, though to his credit he has improved with time.

And Stephen A. Smith can say what he does b/c he is on First Take not on the pre and post game shows. When we watch First Take (which I enjoyed this morning) we know what we are getting into. Simmons and Bayless are entertainers. And better TV entertainers than Simmons for that matter.

I still enjoy reading his stuff and grantland, just not on national TV. I guess I just don't think Simmons is as smart as he thinks he is.

edit: the comment they originally censored is just stupid though, no big deal
"Just ban all the J's...even jinklejoes" --unnamed source
DannyJ
Profile Joined March 2010
United States5110 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-15 06:09:26
June 15 2013 06:04 GMT
#1228
That's such a tame "joke" it barely is one. ESPN probably just took it out because the average person wouldn't know what the hell Germany has to do with anything if they weren't aware that other players got treatment there.

The ESPN NBA guys seem really terrible in general imo, at least in that capacity ( I like Wilbon and Simmons otherwise).
Jibba
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States22883 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-15 06:17:55
June 15 2013 06:12 GMT
#1229
Maybe but then they could explain it.

They brought Simmons on to add comedy and an edge, because they get killed by TNT and they know it. But then they don't let Simmons be Simmons, so they're just as pale and boring as they were with Greg Anthony and Tim Legler.

They're in this weird unfunny yet still completely generic and uninformative grey area.
ModeratorNow I'm distant, dark in this anthrobeat
DannyJ
Profile Joined March 2010
United States5110 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-15 06:25:49
June 15 2013 06:24 GMT
#1230
It just seems like a really big turd of a "joke" for him to bitch about them taking it out, lol. Hopefully there are other things ESPN has edited out otherwise maybe he isn't the man for the job if they wanted the second coming of Barkley. Being funny spontaneously on TV isnt exactly the same thing as writing a 10,000 word funny/interesting editorial.
Ferrose
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States11378 Posts
June 15 2013 12:02 GMT
#1231
On June 15 2013 13:54 DystopiaX wrote:
http://www.businessinsider.com/bill-simmons-rips-espn-for-dwyane-wade-joke-2013-6

starting to think Simmons isn't dumb like he seems on ESPN, he just has to be so PC that he can't actually make jokes or say smart shit.


Wow. I thought it was going to be because Simmons made some borderline racist remark or something. But a joke about Wade going to Germany to get surgery? That's so weak by ESPN...
@113candlemagic Office lady by day, lonely woman at night. | Official lolicon of thread 94273
RowdierBob
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
Australia13385 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-15 14:39:10
June 15 2013 14:38 GMT
#1232
OT, but utter madness: http://espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2013/story/_/id/9386566/2013-nba-playoffs-big-market-vs-small-market

The ongoing mystery of the NBA is why it cares about small-market teams more than the fans do. Oh, fans might say they're concerned about the welfare of the league's smaller outposts and believe the NBA conspires against the lesser markets. Yet those same fans never bother to support the lesser markets, even when it costs nothing more than the electricity needed to power their TV sets.

The Memphis-San Antonio Western Conference finals struggled to draw even half the television audience on ESPN that the Boston-Miami conference finals did the year before. NBA Finals ratings over the years have consistently shown that a shortage of superstars means no shot at a double-digit TV rating. And superstars tend to gravitate toward the big markets.

"Who cares about TV ratings?" is the commonly heard whine from those who don't understand or care about the business of sports. Advertisers and television executives care. And since advertisers pay the TV networks, and the networks are the ones writing billion-dollar checks to sports leagues, there's plenty of reason for the NBA to care about what they care about.

Yet the NBA continues to go out of its way to support the smaller markets. It was willing to lop off 20 percent of the 2011-12 season with a lockout to get a collective bargaining agreement better suited to the have-nots. It allowed the SuperSonics to leave Seattle for Oklahoma City and kept the Kings from leaving Sacramento to replace them. This isn't a perception; it's David Stern's stated goal.

"Everything that we have done in terms of collective bargaining is designed to level the playing field and allow teams that are well managed, no matter what their market size, to be in the Finals," the outgoing commissioner said in his last pre-Finals address to the media.

"This is a league that prides itself on Oklahoma City, Memphis, Salt Lake City, Portland, San Antonio, Sacramento, Indianapolis, on and on and on."

Perhaps they give the league pride, but they don't bring in revenue. Stern said his goal is to make the NBA Finals more like the Super Bowl, which is a television event regardless of the participants. But the NBA will never be the NFL because NFL television money comes from national contracts, not the regional deals that create such huge discrepancies in basketball and baseball. The NFL also has a hard salary cap that makes free agency more restrictive.

The fact that the free agency or trades of just a few premium players can create super teams is actually a strength of the NBA. The Heat have consistently delivered NBA Finals viewership more than any team since the Shaq-Kobe Lakers. And the Heat even managed to do the impossible -- add suspense and intrigue to the NBA's interminable regular season -- through their initial struggles in Year 1 and their 27-game winning streak this season.

But as the new collective bargaining agreement is phased in it will become prohibitively expensive for the Heat to stay together -- or for a replacement to be created.

Stern was asked if the promoter in him could appreciate what the Heat meant to the league and want to see them stay together.

"As a promoter, absolutely," Stern said. "But there are 29 other bosses I have that think it's a great system. And other than the Heat and South Florida media, our league owners think this is a great idea. Because we have owners who want very much to compete. And they want to be able to tell their fans they can compete.

"The Heat have done a great job. They've put together a great roster. They put together perhaps a team for the ages. It has consequences that they are now dealing with, and actually they're much less harsh than the consequences that would have followed had we gotten what we really wanted in the collective bargaining."

It's not 29 other owners. Surely the Lakers and Knicks wouldn't mind the freedom to dispense their TV revenue on their roster in whatever manner they saw fit. But those weren't the voices driving the collective bargaining negotiations. The league was led by the teams who are contributing the least amount of money and bringing the fewest amount of people to the TV sets.

The problem is, in the process of creating a system to deter the Heat and Lakers, the NBA also made it harder on the Thunder and Grizzlies, two teams who traded key players in the past nine months in part due to financial considerations. The luxury tax is just as punitive for them, but they don't have the same revenue streams to compensate for it.

Why should the fans care? Because imbalanced basketball is better than no basketball at all. If the goal is always to accommodate the lesser markets, it won't be met. And eventually that will mean another work stoppage to try to rein in salaries.

If the salary cap, rookie salary cap and luxury tax from previous collective bargaining agreements weren't enough to bring competitive balance and widespread financial health to the league, why should we believe the current CBA will magically accomplish it? We've seen that the owners are willing to sacrifice games to get what they want.

So enjoy these star-laden Finals, which feature four former Finals MVPs in LeBron James, Dwyane Wade, Tim Duncan and Tony Parker. You're less likely to see clusters of talent like this in the future. You might get Milwaukee versus Sacramento, though … and you won't be watching.


This just utterly baffles me. Adande genuinely thinks the NBA should favour bigger markets simply because it's better for business and brings in more money.

Do fans want to watch good basketball or big teams with big stars? Am I getting sucked in by ESPN trolling?
"Terrans are pretty much space-Australians" - H
AntiGrav1ty
Profile Joined April 2010
Germany2310 Posts
June 15 2013 15:18 GMT
#1233
With the system in place it's more likely to get superstars/interesting players in small markets, which in turn will increase interest in those teams. At least that's the hope. It just takes time until the consequences can be felt.

But right now he is probably right. I didn't watch Grizzlies vs Spurs nor did I care much who wins that series. I can aknowledge that they are really good teams but I just dont find the players on those teams very interesting. Maybe I'm brainwashed.
www.twitch.tv/antigrav1ty
DystopiaX
Profile Joined October 2010
United States16236 Posts
June 15 2013 16:14 GMT
#1234
That's dumb. If the NBA was big market biased teams like the Spurs or Thunder wouldn't exist...no would Miami really. None of these are really "big market teams" (other than SA, kinda). They're just teams that are built well either because their front office is amazing (OKC) or because the stars colluded (Miami). Favoring TV markets over anything else ignores the fact that the most popular teams are the really good ones, not the ones where most people are from. I'd totally watch Milwaukee-Sacto if those were the best 2 teams in the league.
Tien
Profile Joined January 2003
Russian Federation4447 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-15 17:16:05
June 15 2013 17:10 GMT
#1235
The Spurs are the best team in the last 10 years yet nobody gives a damn about them. Even the self proclaimed NBA "purists" that claim to "love" Spurs basketball barely even turn on league pass to watch their games. You'd rather watch a Miami / OKC game with bodies flying all over the court.

The NBA gets its money from "most fans", not the fans that drool at the thought of watching a Memphis / Indiana or a Spurs / Indiana finals.

Nobody gives a shit about small markets, stop catering to them. Big markets is why the NBA is where it is today. Look at linsanity. That happened in New York and once he got shipped to Houston the national media / entire country could no longer give a shit about Jeremy Lin.
We decide our own destiny
Tien
Profile Joined January 2003
Russian Federation4447 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-15 17:19:10
June 15 2013 17:18 GMT
#1236
On June 15 2013 23:38 RowdierBob wrote:
Do fans want to watch good basketball or big teams with big stars? Am I getting sucked in by ESPN trolling?


Big teams with big stars is what fans want to watch.

Fans don't actually give a damn if a team executes an offensive play to perfection for stretches at a time so that a no name boring Gary Neal can sink a 3 pointer. And before you say its not boring, and you don't live in San Antonio how many Spurs game did you even bother to watch this season?

Fans only care about perfect offense if Magic Johnson / Chris Paul / LeBron James is running it.
We decide our own destiny
Jibba
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States22883 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-15 17:23:42
June 15 2013 17:21 GMT
#1237
On June 16 2013 02:10 Tien wrote:
The Spurs are the best team in the last 10 years yet nobody gives a damn about them. Even the self proclaimed NBA "purists" that claim to "love" Spurs basketball barely even turn on league pass to watch their games. You'd rather watch a Miami / OKC game with bodies flying all over the court.

The NBA gets its money from "most fans", not the fans that drool at the thought of watching a Memphis / Indiana or a Spurs / Indiana finals.
But this isn't about city or market sizes. These are all small market teams you're talking about, even Miami. The Spurs don't get enough attention for how fun they are to watch, but it's not because OKC has a better market than them.

Nobody gives a shit about small markets, stop catering to them. Big markets is why the NBA is where it is today. Look at linsanity. That happened in New York and once he got shipped to Houston the national media / entire country could no longer give a shit about Jeremy Lin.

He also started sucking. And since when is Houston a small market?
ModeratorNow I'm distant, dark in this anthrobeat
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States19574 Posts
June 15 2013 17:25 GMT
#1238
On June 15 2013 15:12 Jibba wrote:
Maybe but then they could explain it.

They brought Simmons on to add comedy and an edge, because they get killed by TNT and they know it. But then they don't let Simmons be Simmons, so they're just as pale and boring as they were with Greg Anthony and Tim Legler.

They're in this weird unfunny yet still completely generic and uninformative grey area.


He's been dropping subtle bombs on the podcast for months. Like "good thing they have 4 guys to fill 8 minutes of tv time"
Freeeeeeedom
Tien
Profile Joined January 2003
Russian Federation4447 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-15 17:31:49
June 15 2013 17:27 GMT
#1239
Of course, but imagine what the NBA would be today if Kevin Durant / Russell Westbrook / Harden and Ibaka was in the NYC market instead of OKC? The national market would actually care and they'd get 10x the exposure with all the residual effects for the rest of the NBA.

Fuck small markets and parity, nobody complained about it when Magic and Bird single handedly revived the NBA.

The greatest travesty in NBA is that great teams like the Spurs and OKC are doomed to little markets. If the Knicks had OKC's team and the Celtics had the Spurs team since 1999, the NBA would be in a better place today.
We decide our own destiny
Jibba
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States22883 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-15 17:31:59
June 15 2013 17:31 GMT
#1240
On June 16 2013 02:25 cLutZ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 15 2013 15:12 Jibba wrote:
Maybe but then they could explain it.

They brought Simmons on to add comedy and an edge, because they get killed by TNT and they know it. But then they don't let Simmons be Simmons, so they're just as pale and boring as they were with Greg Anthony and Tim Legler.

They're in this weird unfunny yet still completely generic and uninformative grey area.


He's been dropping subtle bombs on the podcast for months. Like "good thing they have 4 guys to fill 8 minutes of tv time"

That's really true. Not only are they more congested than TNT's crew usually is (especially since Ernie is just a moderator,) they also get way less air time. Inside the NBA is like 30 minutes pre and 1hr+ after the game. ABC's team gets like 15 minutes before and after.
ModeratorNow I'm distant, dark in this anthrobeat
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