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Noro
Canada991 Posts
On April 11 2013 13:16 Sigh wrote: The Oilers make me want to stab my eyeballs out. Seriously. So disappointing. Standard. But honestly, from 30th, 30th, 29th, I'd say this is an improvement. The "rebuilding" is slowly paying off. | ||
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GolemMadness
Canada11044 Posts
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crawlingchaos
Canada2025 Posts
On April 11 2013 14:37 GolemMadness wrote: Volchenkov defended himself quite well from that incoming Marchand hit. Yeah, it should be a couple of games, but who knows where the wheel of justice lands. Volch has some (minor) history of suspensions so it probably won't go unnoticed. Incidentally, I don't think it's a coincidence the Devils started playing like a hockey team after he and Salvador were out of the game. | ||
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sharkeyanti
United States1273 Posts
On April 11 2013 13:31 Noro wrote: Standard. But honestly, from 30th, 30th, 29th, I'd say this is an improvement. The "rebuilding" is slowly paying off. It's hard for me to fathom being in a fan base so in love with the team (EDM) that has been so awful for so long. Last time a team was picking that high for so long they almost moved cities, but lucked out with maybe the two best players in the league. | ||
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Flaccid
8928 Posts
On April 11 2013 13:31 Noro wrote: Standard. But honestly, from 30th, 30th, 29th, I'd say this is an improvement. The "rebuilding" is slowly paying off. 26th in 2013-2014. Calling it now!!! edit: Might make it up to 24th or so in time for Hall to retire. Wooooooooo!!!!! edit2: Look at a team like Montreal. They were a lottery team last year, weren't they? Their management accessed need, acquired necessary players, built a fucking-hockey-team and they're like 5th overall right now. That's the difference between teams who are competently managed and the Edmonton Oilers. What have the Oilers accomplished in the last 5 years outside of being bad enough to get a compensation-prize in the form of a high draft pick at the end of each season? Look at their current roster and see just how few of the players did not come out of the draft, and how awful those players are. All this management has done is swung and missed consistently on bad players like Belanger, Fistric, Eager, Brown, etc. - none of whom can be reasonably called 'NHL players' at this point in their careers. They have a great first line by merit of being shitty enough to draft it, and beyond that have done nothing. Oh, and the management also cost us a couple seasons of Ryan Smyth for no good-goddamn reason. Assholes. Great article about how, outside of the first line, the Oilers have actually gotten far worse year-over-year: http://www.mc79hockey.com/?p=5731 This season is the first of the years in which you can win a Stanley Cup with Taylor Hall as your best player thrown away because of how screwed up everything else is. I don’t expect them to put together a Stanley Cup contending team overnight but when you’re starting with a player of his calibre and you’ve had three years since you admit the rebuild started in 2010, you really ought to be doing better. Not that Katz would ever fire his golfing buddies. Most days it seems as though he bought the team just so he'd have an excuse to hang out with his heroes from the 80s. | ||
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Noro
Canada991 Posts
On April 11 2013 23:41 sharkeyanti wrote: It's hard for me to fathom being in a fan base so in love with the team (EDM) that has been so awful for so long. Last time a team was picking that high for so long they almost moved cities, but lucked out with maybe the two best players in the league. When you've lived in Edmonton your entire life, it isn't that hard to fathom. I'm not even a huge hockey fan, but I like to support them when they're actually playing like they mean it (which they haven't been for the past few years). But year, if I'm not watching the Oilers, I'm not watching anyone else. | ||
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Sub40APM
6336 Posts
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
On April 11 2013 23:41 sharkeyanti wrote: It's hard for me to fathom being in a fan base so in love with the team (EDM) that has been so awful for so long. Last time a team was picking that high for so long they almost moved cities, but lucked out with maybe the two best players in the league. Many sports have teams like this, where the teams never bring home success and yet they still have rabid fan bases. A fanbase isn't built just on success, it's built on culture. | ||
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sharkeyanti
United States1273 Posts
On April 12 2013 05:53 Stratos_speAr wrote: Many sports have teams like this, where the teams never bring home success and yet they still have rabid fan bases. A fanbase isn't built just on success, it's built on culture. Well, that culture is sort of built on winning a lot in the past. It is almost a distant memory at this point, but the combination of Canada and a wildly successful team will create some die-hard fans. I think my point was more comparative to everyone else in the league. Maybe comparing a Canadian team to USA teams is unfair to begin with. Senators fans would probably have the best insight on this, being in a definite hockey market with very little hockey success. | ||
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Masamune
Canada3401 Posts
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Masamune
Canada3401 Posts
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GolemMadness
Canada11044 Posts
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
Well, that culture is sort of built on winning a lot in the past. It is almost a distant memory at this point, but the combination of Canada and a wildly successful team will create some die-hard fans. I think my point was more comparative to everyone else in the league. Maybe comparing a Canadian team to USA teams is unfair to begin with. Senators fans would probably have the best insight on this, being in a definite hockey market with very little hockey success. Yea, that's definitely true; the Oilers set up a dynasty in the 80's that probably keeps their fanbase alive. That said, there are some teams that have never had success that keep loyal fanbases, like the Minnesota Vikings and Wild (no football or hockey championships for MN). To be fair though, with the sour relationship between Minnesota and professional hockey caused by Norman Green, the Wild are going to be on thin ice if they fuck this up and continue to lose. After all, we can always go back to our nation-leading high school hockey and our four D1 collegiate teams that consistently contend nationally. | ||
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QuanticHawk
United States32161 Posts
On April 11 2013 01:24 JimmyJRaynor wrote: "average" is a poor statistic in general. many players are streaky as their confidence ebs and flows throughout a season. this makes his ".904 save percentage" with out much meaning. this theoretical ".904 save percentage goalie" you speak of... does not exist. the real question is this. will we get the MAF from Pittsburgh's first trip to game 7 of the Stanley Cup finals with MAF in net? OR will we get the MAF from last year's playoffs? ive not posted in this thread for several days because ive been trying to think of a way to properly respond to something so dumb, so completely and totally absurd, and i am absolutely stumped. so, uh, congrats. how does an average that takes into account all of the games that a goalie has played not have much meaning it's not like taking a small 5 game sample size of shit play and trying to hold that up as an example of the players skill or lack there of. the dude's playoff career, he has a 904. for his career, he is a 909. this year, he a 915 or so putting him right around 16th in the league how are any of these things without much meaning | ||
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Flaccid
8928 Posts
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Noro
Canada991 Posts
On April 12 2013 11:36 Stratos_speAr wrote: Wild are in danger of not making the playoffs with another loss to St. Louis tonight. I'm pretty sure that this would be the biggest fuck-up of the entire season by any team if they collapse here in the last stretch. Parise, Suter, Pomenville, held onto the division lead for several weeks, and now with ten games left, we might not get into the playoffs. I mean yes, we've lost Heatley and Cullen, but 1) play looked very questionable before that, even in our Feb-March run, where we gave up easy goals, missed on a number of chances, and went down early unnecessarily in games, and 2) if losing these two players (important teammates, but not stars like Suter/Koivu/Parise/Backstrom) means that your team tanks and reverts to the zero production offense you had at the beginning of the season (where the team gets a pass for "chemistry problems"), you've failed to create a lineup with any depth. Yea, that's definitely true; the Oilers set up a dynasty in the 80's that probably keeps their fanbase alive. That said, there are some teams that have never had success that keep loyal fanbases, like the Minnesota Vikings and Wild (no football or hockey championships for MN). To be fair though, with the sour relationship between Minnesota and professional hockey caused by Norman Green, the Wild are going to be on thin ice if they fuck this up and continue to lose. After all, we can always go back to our nation-leading high school hockey and our four D1 collegiate teams that consistently contend nationally. What keeps the fanbase alive is the fact that we live in a terrible frozen tundra with nothing else to do. No other good sports teams to go cheer for. Regardless of the fact that the Oilers were once a dynasty, in this city, it's about the pride of the city, not so much the team. If that makes sense. But yeah, people outside of the city who cheer for the Oilers (who weren't born here) are pretty questionable imo. | ||
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Flaccid
8928 Posts
And it may sound strange to people outside of a city like Edmonton, but there is a tangible difference in the air when the Oilers are playing well and winning games. Granted, it hasn't happened that often lately but even a small glimmer of hope or improvement is enough to notice the city gaining a bit of jump in its collective step. People in the city are born into it. It's like being a Catholic because your parents dragged you to church every day before you were old enough to know better or decide for yourself if you liked it. It becomes part of your life. Only in this case the church is a run-down, shitty arena in a desolate part of town surrounded by homeless and prostitutes. Oil Country, baby. edit: It also doesn't hurt that the passion for the team has led to the creation of some of the best writing on the subject of hockey available anywhere. | ||
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QuanticHawk
United States32161 Posts
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Kevin_Sorbo
Canada3217 Posts
On April 13 2013 03:06 QuanticHawk wrote: ive not posted in this thread for several days because ive been trying to think of a way to properly respond to something so dumb, so completely and totally absurd, and i am absolutely stumped. so, uh, congrats. how does an average that takes into account all of the games that a goalie has played not have much meaning it's not like taking a small 5 game sample size of shit play and trying to hold that up as an example of the players skill or lack there of. the dude's playoff career, he has a 904. for his career, he is a 909. this year, he a 915 or so putting him right around 16th in the league how are any of these things without much meaning because the way you explain it, Cujo would be better than MAF because he has a .917 average despite having won jackshit during his career. I can agree to a certain point that avg can give you an idea on the quality of the player to a certain degree but for a goalie the most important stat is W and you earn Ws by allowing 1 less goal than the other keeper. and I dont think that the fate of the pens rest on this guys shoulders. It rests on Crosby's mouth imo. On another topic: Heard on the news today that Glendale was looking for some other party to manage the Jobbing.com arena ( currently the Yotes organisation is managing it. ) Will they move to Puerto Rico or north of the border??? Sure looks like they are preparing for the life after the Yotes in Glendale. | ||
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Flaccid
8928 Posts
On April 13 2013 04:12 Kevin_Sorbo wrote: the most important stat is W and you earn Ws by allowing 1 less goal than the other keeper. Or in Fleury's case, you earn Ws by having the unbelievable fortune of playing behind a team that can score 7 goals when you give up 6. And yeah, I'd take Cujo at the same age over Fleury eleven times out of ten. edit: The notion of comparing Fleury to other goaltenders based on wins is just bizarre. Wins are a team stat, not a personal stat. When does Fleury ever steal a game? When does his team shit the bed so bad that he needs to stand on his head and he actually does? His primary job is to not be the reason the team lost. This is not a positive characteristic. edit2: People talk about 'wins' and 'cups' but ignore how everything points to the fact that the team would have MORE 'wins' and MORE 'cups' if they had a more reliable goaltender. Fleury doesn't win them games. He loses them games. edit3: For some reason, folks still paint their image of Fleury by one good year he had when he was new to the NHL (Steve Mason style). The countless sub-par years following seem to be ignored by those who have already made up their minds: If you looked at any of his postseasons at random, the odds are you wouldn't want your goaltender putting up numbers like that. Yes, he was spectacular in the Penguins' run to a Game-7 loss to Detroit in 2007-08, posting a 1.97/.933 line. That playoff, his second in the NHL, went a long way to coloring everyone's idea of his abilities to rise to the occasion like few other in league history. His winning the Stanley Cup the next season despite decidedly sub-average numbers of 2.61/.908 did little to help, especially as he allowed a combined six goals in the Penguins four wins in the Finals (which made it very easy to ignore the 11 against in three losses). Thus he established his reputation as unimpeachable rock at the back, even as his performances the next two postseasons were shockingly poor. Save percentages of .899 and .891, respectively. Goals-against averages of 2.78 and 2.52. A total of just 20 games played. Disappointing performances for both team and player, who by the way makes $5 million against the cap, and yet none of it stuck to him. It must be nice for Fleury: Three straight years of subpar performances following a good one and one in which you win the Stanley Cup despite not being good, and you're clutch forever. Doesn't matter how many stinkers you turn in during that time (and if we consider allowing three or more as a bad performance for a clutch playoff goaltender, the answer is 15 out of 23). http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-puck-daddy/learned-penguins-goalie-marc-andre-fleury-problem-perception-134517137.html | ||
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