On October 20 2011 19:16 bbQ4Aiur wrote: its kinda ridiculous to see a mech terran can stay in a game for so long after being crushed so many times, if that was a toss or a zerg, it would be gg much earlier
The only thing that is ridiculous is how fucking brokenly easy it is to play bio.
Attack move, lose every unit, remax.
Tanks should not be 125 gas. Marauders should not exist.
After this post I wonder, are there any people who still want the marauder in the game ;>?
I know that protosses like myself hate it terribly, terrans apaprently hate it because of bio vs mech, and zergs hate everything ;>.
Hope it gets removed.
Marauders can't be removed without major changes . TvP would be impossible without Mauraders . Mech just sucks in TvP.
On October 20 2011 19:16 bbQ4Aiur wrote: its kinda ridiculous to see a mech terran can stay in a game for so long after being crushed so many times, if that was a toss or a zerg, it would be gg much earlier
The only thing that is ridiculous is how fucking brokenly easy it is to play bio.
Attack move, lose every unit, remax.
Tanks should not be 125 gas. Marauders should not exist.
After this post I wonder, are there any people who still want the marauder in the game ;>?
I know that protosses like myself hate it terribly, terrans apaprently hate it because of bio vs mech, and zergs hate everything ;>.
Hope it gets removed.
I really don't see the problem with the marauder.
I'm not going to explain in here as I don't want it to turn into a balance discussion, but without the marauder Bio would be impossible in TvP and TvT.
Marauders are fine from a balance perspective. From a gameplay perspective they are boring as shit (similar to the colossus, but worse).
On October 20 2011 19:16 bbQ4Aiur wrote: its kinda ridiculous to see a mech terran can stay in a game for so long after being crushed so many times, if that was a toss or a zerg, it would be gg much earlier
The only thing that is ridiculous is how fucking brokenly easy it is to play bio.
Attack move, lose every unit, remax.
Tanks should not be 125 gas. Marauders should not exist.
god i love you jinro. people dont realize how broken the marauder is
On October 20 2011 19:11 Treadmill wrote: [quote] 25:00 sC tries to push all the way into TOP's base but is finally repulsed. TOP has an unscouted base at the 9 o'clock main. Hes trying to reproduce his tanks but is still well down in supply.
26:00 sC sends out a large force of marauders to kill TOP's base at the 9:00.
28:00 TOP tries to push out and hold his fourth, but sC runs in on his sieged tanks and kills them all. sC losees most of his bio but can rebuild, unlike TOP.
31:00 TOP has managed to get his fourth back up but its almost out of minerals quickly with all his mules. sC pushes in with his bio and destroys all TOP's tanks again, though once again losing his army. He doesnt manage to kill TOP's planetary at his fourth though.
32:00 sC builds another massive bio force, runs in, kills all of TOP's tanks. Again. TOP finally GG's.
Game 4 Map: Tal'Darim Altar Noblesse vs Lucky Noblesse starts in the top left. Lucky starts in the bottom right.
3:00 Noblesse goes 12 rax with no gas. Lucky somehow drone scouts Noblesse at cross position first and goes for hatch first into gas into pool, again.
5:00 Noblesse drops his CC after his second supply depot. He then adds one gas. Lucky drops 2 queens and speed when his pool finishes, then takes his drones off gas. Noblesse adds 2 barracks.
6:00 Noblesse is getting combat shields. Lucky is building 24 lings.
7:00 Noblesse put his CC down at his naturaly and doesnt have a wall. His bunker is too late, the lings run in and mess shit up.
8:30 Lucky follows it up with a baneling nest and a lair. Noblesse is down 40-61 supply though he still has his expansion.
On October 20 2011 19:20 rebuffering wrote: rofl i just watched someone make one unit and stim, run into seiged tanks, and still win, how is there nothing wrong with that.
Personally I saw someone do camping, waiting for max tanks while hiding bases he couldn't defend, and the other one kept attacking into him with beautiful spreading and just outplaying the camper. Nothing wrong either way, the one who played better won. Like how hard is it to spam tanks and turrets, it's like the lowest apm-requirement build in the whole game.
On October 20 2011 19:25 Goibon wrote: Turn your head for 3 minutes and you come back to see a Terran with an expo and no wall and Lings all up in his grill. The hell is going on?
Lmao dude i had same reaction was typing in LR and just saw like 12 lings running around a main. Man today is getting crazyyy
On October 20 2011 19:23 Qikz wrote: Also, it was 3-3 Marauders against 0-0 tanks.
The tanks should not have won those battles.
No, it was 2-2 against 2-0, but that's besides the point.
There's no point in whining when you have half your siege tanks unsieged and lose an engagement when your opponent micros and engages better than you. Watch MVP vs. Ganzi on TD. MVP gets heavily pressured but retains his army and is able to crush ganzi's army because he actually moves across the map well.
On October 20 2011 19:12 Treadmill wrote: [quote] 26:00 sC sends out a large force of marauders to kill TOP's base at the 9:00.
28:00 TOP tries to push out and hold his fourth, but sC runs in on his sieged tanks and kills them all. sC losees most of his bio but can rebuild, unlike TOP.
31:00 TOP has managed to get his fourth back up but its almost out of minerals quickly with all his mules. sC pushes in with his bio and destroys all TOP's tanks again, though once again losing his army. He doesnt manage to kill TOP's planetary at his fourth though.
32:00 sC builds another massive bio force, runs in, kills all of TOP's tanks. Again. TOP finally GG's.
Game 4 Map: Tal'Darim Altar Noblesse vs Lucky Noblesse starts in the top left. Lucky starts in the bottom right.
3:00 Noblesse goes 12 rax with no gas. Lucky somehow drone scouts Noblesse at cross position first and goes for hatch first into gas into pool, again.
5:00 Noblesse drops his CC after his second supply depot. He then adds one gas. Lucky drops 2 queens and speed when his pool finishes, then takes his drones off gas. Noblesse adds 2 barracks.
6:00 Noblesse is getting combat shields. Lucky is building 24 lings.
7:00 Noblesse put his CC down at his naturaly and doesnt have a wall. His bunker is too late, the lings run in and mess shit up.
8:30 Lucky follows it up with a baneling nest and a lair. Noblesse is down 40-61 supply though he still has his expansion.
10:00 Noblesse gets his factory, Lucky gets baneling speed a spire and a macro hatch, but no thrid yet. Noblesse also gets stim and a starport. Workers are 32-59.
On October 20 2011 19:23 Qikz wrote: Also, it was 3-3 Marauders against 0-0 tanks.
The tanks should not have won those battles.
what 3-0 tank. when the engagement happen it was 2-0 vs 2-2, and you did not expected tank to be 2-2 at their cost are you?, I mean marauder is 100 min 25 GAS, and tank is 150 min 125 GAS?
On October 20 2011 19:16 bbQ4Aiur wrote: its kinda ridiculous to see a mech terran can stay in a game for so long after being crushed so many times, if that was a toss or a zerg, it would be gg much earlier
The only thing that is ridiculous is how fucking brokenly easy it is to play bio.
Attack move, lose every unit, remax.
Tanks should not be 125 gas. Marauders should not exist.
After this post I wonder, are there any people who still want the marauder in the game ;>?
I know that protosses like myself hate it terribly, terrans apaprently hate it because of bio vs mech, and zergs hate everything ;>.
Hope it gets removed.
Nah I love Marauders as a zerg It's the Tank I have problems with XD
On October 20 2011 19:20 rebuffering wrote: rofl i just watched someone make one unit and stim, run into seiged tanks, and still win, how is there nothing wrong with that.
Personally I saw someone do camping, waiting for max tanks while hiding bases he couldn't defend, and the other one kept attacking into him with beautiful spreading and just outplaying the camper. Nothing wrong either way, the one who played better won. Like how hard is it to spam tanks and turrets, it's like the lowest apm-requirement build in the whole game.
On October 20 2011 19:20 rebuffering wrote: rofl i just watched someone make one unit and stim, run into seiged tanks, and still win, how is there nothing wrong with that.
You mean like Zerglings or Zealots?
It would have been fine but Top made sooo many mistakes. He was 70 supply or more below Sc after the time he pushed out for no reason and lost 20 tanks. After that, you're going to die. SC was way up in bases and outplayed TOP completely.
and he pushes with only 20 tanks without much support else where, and didn't have the best positioning of those tanks cramping everything together.
since then SC has complete map control and limit TOP's economy. SC did what he need to do by trading tanks with massing bio, it is obvious TOP will never keep up in production and will slowly starve to death.
if TOP would have kept those 20 tanks at home and have a better positioned siege line defence, things might have been better.
it's not like TOP play superbly perfect and still loses to easy to control bio, far from that
On October 20 2011 19:23 Tsubbi wrote: this is funny seeing terran complain about terran
not surpising considering its the only matchup they go in without an advantage
that aside i don't see the whole mech is superior etc etc, it's map dependend and situational, and bio needs more multitasking from the looks of it too
Sometimes its fun to drop 4 medivacs of marauders and kill every building in sight, but overall its a retarded unit. I hate that its probably the 'easiest' unit to use in the game. For example, look at the game just played, TOP had to concentrate on positioning his army perfectly, while defending from a huge drop. sC just split his army, put half in medivacs and then a moved the other half in a concave and kills every tank.
On October 20 2011 19:16 bbQ4Aiur wrote: its kinda ridiculous to see a mech terran can stay in a game for so long after being crushed so many times, if that was a toss or a zerg, it would be gg much earlier
The only thing that is ridiculous is how fucking brokenly easy it is to play bio.
Attack move, lose every unit, remax.
Tanks should not be 125 gas. Marauders should not exist.
god i love you jinro. people dont realize how broken the marauder is
protoss know, trust me...
but really top could have played more carefully
World would be a better place with better mech and marauders not being in game, that way we could see mech in PvT instead of bio =/ Really hate blizzards game design that bio have to be viable....
On October 20 2011 19:23 Qikz wrote: Also, it was 3-3 Marauders against 0-0 tanks.
The tanks should not have won those battles.
No, it was 2-2 against 2-0, but that's besides the point.
There's no point in whining when you don't half your siege tanks unsieged and lose an engagement when your opponent micros and engages better than you. Watch MVP vs. Ganzi on TD. MVP gets heavily pressured but retains his army and is able to crush ganzi's army because he actually moves across the map well.
Fair point on the upgrades, but yeah as you say TOP didn't play mech too well there. MVP played it perfectly that game. ^^
On October 20 2011 19:23 Qikz wrote: Also, it was 3-3 Marauders against 0-0 tanks.
The tanks should not have won those battles.
No, it was 2-2 against 2-0, but that's besides the point.
There's no point in whining when you don't half your siege tanks unsieged and lose an engagement when your opponent micros and engages better than you. Watch MVP vs. Ganzi on TD. MVP gets heavily pressured but retains his army and is able to crush ganzi's army because he actually moves across the map well.
You can also watch Clide beat MMA with 1-0 tanks vs 3-3 bio on Terminus for an example of what happens when one guy plays solid mech and the other guys bio isn't as good as efficient as sC's.
===
Lucky in an amazing position after that first ling aggression.
EPT
