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On June 06 2011 14:02 MrDudeMan wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 13:51 Defacer wrote:On June 06 2011 13:48 MrDudeMan wrote:On June 06 2011 13:44 Necro)Phagist( wrote:On June 06 2011 13:39 bennyaus wrote:On June 06 2011 13:37 DoomsVille wrote:
What is very very important is the fact that he has ignored all attempts by NASL to contact him. This is ludicrous. How hard is it to respond to an email or make a phone call. It would literally take him 2 minutes if he sent them an e-mail and said "I don't have time for the league so I withdraw". NASL has used this same response when they failed to get hold of Whitera and others who have been walk-over games. Frankly it is so unbelievable that I think there is more than just one side to these stories. It shouldn't really be NASL's responsibility to get a hold of him in either case... he signed a contract and even if he didn't have the decency to get a hold of them or answer your phone/ e-mail once in 3 weeks? Even if they didn't try as hard as they say they did to get a hold of him, its easy to assume they called/e-mailed him once every week, thats 2 weeks to check your e-mail or phone history to call them back, which he didn't do. There is no excuse for not showing up/ getting a hold of them for 3 weeks in a row. I'm probably more angry then I should, which is most likely due to the fact that he has now stood up and wasted Boxers time, but still complete dick move totally unprofessional/inexcusable No, NASL should bear some responsibility to at least make contact prior to that matchups and confirm everything, especially with all the WO's happening lately. While it may be his responsibility as the player to show up and respect the contracts, it looks bad for NASL if he doesn't show up (which he didn't) I'm sorry, I have to absolutely disagree. If you hire a contractor to show up to work, you expect them to show up. The onus is not on the organizer to run around every week to remind them of them responsibilities, make them a sack lunch, wipe their ass etc. analogies work both ways. For example lets say your throwing this huge barbecue and need 500 burgers. You place an order at your local burger shop and give them what date the order should be ready by and when you will pick it up. You don't bother to check on the order (and you shouldnt have to in a perfect world) as the date gets closer, and on the day your supposed to pick them up the burgers aren't ready because someone forgot to send the order through. Is it your fault? No, but you should have checked prior to this to make sure everything was perfect because at the end of the day the burger company doesn't lose much, but your barbecue is ruined.
Your buger shop would be sued to no end dude. To no end...
Well, I don't know how things are over there in Canada, maybe these kind of fuckups are okay. But in Brazil/Korea, you'd better be ready to lose money/credibility
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On June 06 2011 14:17 bennyaus wrote:
Obviously they haven't been trying to contact him for weeks, Geoff has been on skype with PU for DJwheat's show just last week and didn't ask him about it? People acting like the information is concrete.
This is how I see it...
-Painuser says on show that he can't reschedule his games because of work and he is stepping back from gaming. Assumes that this will be taken as a fact that he can't do any more NASL. Bad assumption, but anyway....
-NASL only try to contact the player on the day of the game, when it is likely that Painuser is travelling to Columbus and on a plane or out of contact. I mean seriously, who doesn't answer their phone/email on purpose....?
The traveling excuse works for this week... what about the week before? and the week before that? And Geoff didn't ask because its ASSUMED that when you sign up for something(That is essentially your job) that you will show up!
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On June 06 2011 14:16 MrDudeMan wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 14:08 Necro)Phagist( wrote:
Thats a terrible analogy for your point... and the burger company does lose a lot its called PR and they are known for not being able to get their shit done, no ones going to buy from them... your analogy is full of fail. its the burger companies fault 100%(And you admit that) so I don't really see how you're trying to argue against the other analogy?
The point of the analogy is not to prove that it is NASL's (i.e barbecue hosts) fault that painuser (i.e the burger company) did not play the game (i.e provide the burgers) but rather that at the end of the day it is their tournament (i.e barbecue) that suffers. And that this situation could have been avoided had they checked on him 2-3 days earlier (something that should have come to mind seeing as how there have been a ton of walkovers).
Your burger company would be sued/lose all customers....... your analogy is still useless and only proves my point more...
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On June 06 2011 14:17 nokz88 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 14:02 MrDudeMan wrote:On June 06 2011 13:51 Defacer wrote:On June 06 2011 13:48 MrDudeMan wrote:On June 06 2011 13:44 Necro)Phagist( wrote:On June 06 2011 13:39 bennyaus wrote:On June 06 2011 13:37 DoomsVille wrote:
What is very very important is the fact that he has ignored all attempts by NASL to contact him. This is ludicrous. How hard is it to respond to an email or make a phone call. It would literally take him 2 minutes if he sent them an e-mail and said "I don't have time for the league so I withdraw". NASL has used this same response when they failed to get hold of Whitera and others who have been walk-over games. Frankly it is so unbelievable that I think there is more than just one side to these stories. It shouldn't really be NASL's responsibility to get a hold of him in either case... he signed a contract and even if he didn't have the decency to get a hold of them or answer your phone/ e-mail once in 3 weeks? Even if they didn't try as hard as they say they did to get a hold of him, its easy to assume they called/e-mailed him once every week, thats 2 weeks to check your e-mail or phone history to call them back, which he didn't do. There is no excuse for not showing up/ getting a hold of them for 3 weeks in a row. I'm probably more angry then I should, which is most likely due to the fact that he has now stood up and wasted Boxers time, but still complete dick move totally unprofessional/inexcusable No, NASL should bear some responsibility to at least make contact prior to that matchups and confirm everything, especially with all the WO's happening lately. While it may be his responsibility as the player to show up and respect the contracts, it looks bad for NASL if he doesn't show up (which he didn't) I'm sorry, I have to absolutely disagree. If you hire a contractor to show up to work, you expect them to show up. The onus is not on the organizer to run around every week to remind them of them responsibilities, make them a sack lunch, wipe their ass etc. analogies work both ways. For example lets say your throwing this huge barbecue and need 500 burgers. You place an order at your local burger shop and give them what date the order should be ready by and when you will pick it up. You don't bother to check on the order (and you shouldnt have to in a perfect world) as the date gets closer, and on the day your supposed to pick them up the burgers aren't ready because someone forgot to send the order through. Is it your fault? No, but you should have checked prior to this to make sure everything was perfect because at the end of the day the burger company doesn't lose much, but your barbecue is ruined. Your buger shop would be sued to no end dude. To no end... Well, I don't know how things are over there in Canada, maybe these kind of fuckups are okay. But in Brazil/Korea, you'd better be ready to lose money/credibility
Exactly.
But in this terrible analogy, NASL is down at the burger shop, banging on the freaking door, and the burger owner has locked up, turned the lights off, and is hiding behind the counter because he couldn't be bothered explaining the fuckup.
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so nasl said they have been trying to contact pu for weeks? don't get why they'd still wake up boxer at 3 am.
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The travelling excuse does not work for this week either. These games were played on like wed or tuesday. incontrol/gretorp/idra/drewbie/tyler were all at MLG and managed to show up for the cast/their games.
And to those of you saying NASL could have assumed he wasn't coming, what the hell are you smoking? They can't assume anything. They tried contacting him, he didn't respond. They can't just then assume he's not coming. If they do that and he shows up, guess who is pissed off? And guess who the public is going to blame?
And MrDudeMan, your analogy fails for so many reasons. The most obvious of which is the fact that NASL did call the burger shop many times and the burger shop didn't pick up the phone.
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On June 06 2011 14:18 Necro)Phagist( wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 14:17 bennyaus wrote:
Obviously they haven't been trying to contact him for weeks, Geoff has been on skype with PU for DJwheat's show just last week and didn't ask him about it? People acting like the information is concrete.
This is how I see it...
-Painuser says on show that he can't reschedule his games because of work and he is stepping back from gaming. Assumes that this will be taken as a fact that he can't do any more NASL. Bad assumption, but anyway....
-NASL only try to contact the player on the day of the game, when it is likely that Painuser is travelling to Columbus and on a plane or out of contact. I mean seriously, who doesn't answer their phone/email on purpose....? The traveling excuse works for this week... what about the week before? and the week before that? And Geoff didn't ask because its ASSUMED that when you sign up for something(That is essentially your job) that you will show up!
Yeah but people are like "he isn't responding to NASL's calls and emails for weeks". Um, ok but an employee of NASL had him on Skype last week. Clearly they do this on a week by week basis, and only trying to contact or email during the time they're trying to organise the game.... In which case, you can't say he was exactly ignoring them if he was travelling...
Personally I would just like clarification from both parties so we can all stop talking.
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OP seems very biased against painuser (not sure if this has been edited in by poster or someone else)
Letting everyone know the reasons and adding "NASL won't forget about it" is bound to spawn plenty of arguments.
I do think it is unfair to the others that he is leaving, you just don't leave a huge event like this and expect to have no repercussions.
And, did Idra and Tyler have to play these at the MLG venue? Pretty good dedication from them
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On June 06 2011 14:21 statik wrote:
so nasl said they have been trying to contact pu for weeks? don't get why they'd still wake up boxer at 3 am.
because if they didn't wake him up, and PU DID happen to not flake out, then they'd have to explain to boxer why they gave PU a walkover on him, because they "couldn't be bothered to wake him up."
Which would be about 10,000 times worse for the community.
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On June 06 2011 14:23 Comprissent wrote:
And, did Idra and Tyler have to play these at the MLG venue? Pretty good dedication from them
It was pre-recorded a while back, AFAIK
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On June 06 2011 14:21 statik wrote:
so nasl said they have been trying to contact pu for weeks? don't get why they'd still wake up boxer at 3 am.
Because if painuser shows up... how pissed off is he going to be? If they cancel his match ahead of time and he actually was going to show up and play... how pissed off is he going to be?
And if any of those happens, who do you think this thread would be flaming right now? They can't just make an assumption like that...
Going back to MrDudeMan's analogy... that would be like the bbq host cancelling the bbq and not going to pick up the burgers because the burger shop didn't answer the phone... and the burger shop is going to be sitting there with a ton of burgers demanding satisfaction.
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On June 06 2011 14:20 Necro)Phagist( wrote:
Your burger company would be sued/lose all customers....... your analogy is still useless and only proves my point more...
It doesn't matter what happens to the burger shop, your barbecue is still fucked. and I doubt they tried to contact him prior to the game day.
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On June 06 2011 14:24 reneg wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 14:21 statik wrote:
so nasl said they have been trying to contact pu for weeks? don't get why they'd still wake up boxer at 3 am. because if they didn't wake him up, and PU DID happen to not flake out, then they'd have to explain to boxer why they gave PU a walkover on him, because they "couldn't be bothered to wake him up." Which would be about 10,000 times worse for the community.
i'd doubt that after weeks of no contact or replies to emails/calls that they'd give pu a walkover over boxer.
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Burger analogy is bad, let it rest please -_-
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On June 06 2011 14:10 Defacer wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 14:02 MrDudeMan wrote:On June 06 2011 13:51 Defacer wrote:On June 06 2011 13:48 MrDudeMan wrote:On June 06 2011 13:44 Necro)Phagist( wrote:On June 06 2011 13:39 bennyaus wrote:On June 06 2011 13:37 DoomsVille wrote:
What is very very important is the fact that he has ignored all attempts by NASL to contact him. This is ludicrous. How hard is it to respond to an email or make a phone call. It would literally take him 2 minutes if he sent them an e-mail and said "I don't have time for the league so I withdraw". NASL has used this same response when they failed to get hold of Whitera and others who have been walk-over games. Frankly it is so unbelievable that I think there is more than just one side to these stories. It shouldn't really be NASL's responsibility to get a hold of him in either case... he signed a contract and even if he didn't have the decency to get a hold of them or answer your phone/ e-mail once in 3 weeks? Even if they didn't try as hard as they say they did to get a hold of him, its easy to assume they called/e-mailed him once every week, thats 2 weeks to check your e-mail or phone history to call them back, which he didn't do. There is no excuse for not showing up/ getting a hold of them for 3 weeks in a row. I'm probably more angry then I should, which is most likely due to the fact that he has now stood up and wasted Boxers time, but still complete dick move totally unprofessional/inexcusable No, NASL should bear some responsibility to at least make contact prior to that matchups and confirm everything, especially with all the WO's happening lately. While it may be his responsibility as the player to show up and respect the contracts, it looks bad for NASL if he doesn't show up (which he didn't) I'm sorry, I have to absolutely disagree. If you hire a contractor to show up to work, you expect them to show up. The onus is not on the organizer to run around every week to remind them of them responsibilities, make them a sack lunch, wipe their ass etc. analogies work both ways. For example lets say your throwing this huge barbecue and need 500 burgers. You place an order at your local burger shop and give them what date the order should be ready by and when you will pick it up. You don't bother to check on the order (and you shouldnt have to in a perfect world) as the date gets closer, and on the day your supposed to pick them up the burgers aren't ready because someone forgot to send the order through. Is it your fault? No, but you should have checked prior to this to make sure everything was perfect because at the end of the day the burger company doesn't lose much, but your barbecue is ruined. Well, the NASL has been asking about their fucking PainBurger for weeks now and no one is returning their calls.
omg.. I lol'd
also I hate this analogy cuz now I'm freakin hungry
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Contract ; You have the burden, not the one who made the contract. Painuser did wrong from a legal standpoint, no discussion.
IdrA fightin', just hope he can get to the playoffs, some of these groups have worthless competition compared to IdrA's group.
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On June 06 2011 14:27 statik wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 14:24 reneg wrote:On June 06 2011 14:21 statik wrote:
so nasl said they have been trying to contact pu for weeks? don't get why they'd still wake up boxer at 3 am. because if they didn't wake him up, and PU DID happen to not flake out, then they'd have to explain to boxer why they gave PU a walkover on him, because they "couldn't be bothered to wake him up." Which would be about 10,000 times worse for the community. i'd doubt that after weeks of no contact or replies to emails/calls that they'd give pu a walkover over boxer.
"Weeks of no contact" is an exaggeration. NASL employees have spoken to PU within the last 2 weeks, as I already explained. It is most likely that NASL only ever tries to contact people on the day of their game if they fail to show up. In which case they just assume that PU was going to show up despite the fact that he publicly announced that he can't reschedule his NASL games due to work, and he is stepping back from gaming.
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On June 06 2011 14:17 Necro)Phagist( wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2011 14:14 ven wrote:On June 06 2011 14:09 Necro)Phagist( wrote:On June 06 2011 14:05 ven wrote:On June 06 2011 13:33 Necro)Phagist( wrote:On June 06 2011 13:31 ven wrote:
Not to take the blame away from PainUser but I think the NASL could have done a better job of getting ahead of problems like this. Sure, PainUser could have given notice of not participating in it anymore but it's not that hard getting confirmation from the players either. Does NASL not communicate with the players other than when the matches are happening? They tried to get ahold of him, as Incontrol said in his speech, by phone/e-mail and even calling up people close to him to try and hunt him down. The blame is 100% on painuser Ya, I know and of course it's entirely PainUser's fault, I'm not saying anything different but why didn't they address it sooner if he hasn't even been responding for weeks. Just award the W/O beforehand and don't keep everyone waiting. The organizers should be on top of this kind of things. Because they can't just assume he is not going to show? They won't to show as many matches as they can and they do want him to play his games so just assuming he is not going to show is good for no one really... That's just my point. Why even assume anything? Ask him and make sure. If he doesn't respond, you'll have your answer just as well. They have to assume he is going to show, thats why he joined the league to show up and play! They have the matches scheduled and it screws with everything if they just say fuck it after and cancel all his matches without getting confirmation.
They don't have to assume anything. In fact, in PainUser's case they should have assumed the exact opposite. There's no reason not to require confirmation for the individual match dates. Conditions change. Don't rely on the players to keep your schedule.
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On June 06 2011 14:27 bennyaus wrote:
Burger analogy is bad, let it rest please -_-
Are you shitting me? From now on, we're comparing everything related to Starcraft to running a burger shop! 
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I can understand Painuser's mentality of -- "I already lost, why try to win a losing battle?" in regard to his record, but for some reason it doesn't seem appropriate in this community. I have heard and felt the same mentality before in jobs and various tournaments.
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EPT
