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On May 09 2011 23:57 zerious wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2011 23:55 Maenander wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. It is not like Jinro and Huk had more success in foreigner tournaments lately, I doubt players like Zenio are one step ahead of the non-korean scene. I'm pretty sure Zenio would slaughter any foreign terran.
Well
+ Show Spoiler +Drewbie beat him 2-0 in NASL yestarday
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On May 09 2011 23:44 Pipeline wrote:
What ever happened to Jinros macro style? It has been a very long time since I saw a terran player with such late upgrades. I don't know how you guys feel but I'm having a hard time recognizing Jinro as a player. He went from solid macro terran to his current state? He needs to go back to his roots. Drop the stupid bunker nonsense at the start and go for macro games.
I don't think he has any confidence in his TvZ right now, heard him say a few times he is struggling with the matchup. Those builds and the way he played told me he is a bit lost in the matchup..
Hope to see him do well in Code A, the Jinro I know is a really solid player with great builds, don't give up Jinro!
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On May 10 2011 00:43 MechKing wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2011 00:38 lazyfeet wrote:On May 10 2011 00:29 MechKing wrote:On May 10 2011 00:21 PartyBiscuit wrote:On May 10 2011 00:00 Beefwipe wrote:On May 09 2011 23:53 shaman6ix wrote:On May 09 2011 23:06 tdt wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. West don't have best players there. NaNi, Thor, Hasu, Dimaga, Strelok, kas and many others I think would be S class. idra too of course. He was getting higher every season and is playing better than ever now. What? Are you aware of the Code-S level of play? Hasu, Strelok would never ever get there. Kas has the skill and he could if he trained 24/7 but he lacks strong mentality and thats extremely important when it comes to stage matches.. Thor has a lot to prove yet, dont get carried away from his results in online matches he had a week to prepare for. NaNi and Dimaga are the only ones who i could see in Code-S after 2 or 3 months in Korea. Are you aware of the Code-S level of play? A lot of top Europeans would easily play in Code S, I can only think of a few Americans but the Europeans are definitely there skill-wise. A few of the top Europeans could compete in Code S (and be about mid-tier), a lot could (maybe) compete in Code A. TSL shows that given enough preparation, a lot of Europeans can create very strong customized builds for their opponents and win decisively, the GSL World Championships showed that with little preparation they still can get slaughtered just as easily. I do agree almost nobody in the NA server could compete in Code S though. I actually disagree. Given enough time, I think that a Kiwikaki, a TT1, a Major/Terran/Kitty, an Incontrol, a Tyler, a Drewbie etc. could all compete at least in code A. They would have to stay in korea for a LONG time though. They couldn't just fly over and compete in code S, although I bet a few europeans could. Kiwikaki and incontrol tried to qualify open season 3 and fail. The reason i think it is super hard for foreigner to get into GSL is not because of skill but rather the number of pro players there are in korea competing. Bomber who fail to qualified until recently who destroyed whitera in 2 best of seven series when he was code B player. A IM team without nestea and mvp can compete with the the world team. Wasn't incontrol only 1 game away? They were only there for like a month, max. Idra, jinro and haypro all qualified for GSL3. Huk and Jinro both got into code S. Idra is definitely a top foreigner, but do you think that Jinro is any better than Kas or Thorzain? Or is haypro better than morrow? Is Huk better than Kiwikaki or Naniwa? They might be, but there are still a ton of foreigners that are able to compete with koreans for sure if other foreigners can.
I want to reiterate, the players are really good, but the process for qualifying is just really hard and unforgiving.
Kiwikaki, SeleCT, inControl and many players have failed to qualify, not because they're bad players, but because they're out of their element, in an unforgiving environment with ridiculous pressure, particularly if they don't have a team consistently supporting them with a house and companion team like Liquid does. They have to commit to a single tournament and if they fail, they're in a foreign country without anything to really do other than practice for 3 months, while Liquid members are able to remain and do that in Korea right now, it's not as viable for others.
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On May 10 2011 00:46 Slimijs wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2011 23:57 zerious wrote:On May 09 2011 23:55 Maenander wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. It is not like Jinro and Huk had more success in foreigner tournaments lately, I doubt players like Zenio are one step ahead of the non-korean scene. I'm pretty sure Zenio would slaughter any foreign terran. Well + Show Spoiler +Drewbie beat him 2-0 in NASL yestarday
Well
+ Show Spoiler +
Edit: Also
+ Show Spoiler +Yeah I know the whole "matches are played on NA and the lag ruined Zenio's play" argument is pretty bad but he still made 2 spawning pools AND 2 baneling nests in game 2, and that's the one he won
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Wow, so much doom and gloom, just because Jinro is relegated to Code A, despite some amazing results in the past seasons. Lots of great players perform poorly and get relegated to Code A, should they just give up and go home?
Hell no. Jinro fighting!
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On May 10 2011 00:46 Slimijs wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2011 23:57 zerious wrote:On May 09 2011 23:55 Maenander wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. It is not like Jinro and Huk had more success in foreigner tournaments lately, I doubt players like Zenio are one step ahead of the non-korean scene. I'm pretty sure Zenio would slaughter any foreign terran. Well + Show Spoiler +Drewbie beat him 2-0 in NASL yestarday
Lag is a bitch, don't put too much stock into any results from online tournaments
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Jinro has had better days. 
I don´t know what happened exactly but I think he had great runs in the GSL. If he has home sickness, he should go back home, no shame in that.
If it´s something else, I hope he can recover.
Since I don´t know what the problem is, I can only hope he gets better.
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If anything I'm most surprised with San dropping down to Code A
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On May 10 2011 00:56 Irrelevant wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2011 00:46 Slimijs wrote:On May 09 2011 23:57 zerious wrote:On May 09 2011 23:55 Maenander wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. It is not like Jinro and Huk had more success in foreigner tournaments lately, I doubt players like Zenio are one step ahead of the non-korean scene. I'm pretty sure Zenio would slaughter any foreign terran. Well + Show Spoiler +Drewbie beat him 2-0 in NASL yestarday Lag is a bitch, don't put too much stock into any results from online tournaments
It's not that much of an issue if you actually watch the fucking games...
I've seen some of the Korean players make plays that couldn't possibly be made in delay, and react to attacks too quickly for there to be any significant lag.
I believe the oGs house has really good internet or some shit, because they seem to play fine.
In some games, there's a clear delay and lag issue, in others, it hardly appears to be there at all.
I didn't notice anything in Zenio's game to suggest his performance was inhibited by lag.
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On May 10 2011 00:56 Mataza wrote:Jinro has had better days. I don´t know what happened exactly but I think he had great runs in the GSL. If he has home sickness, he should go back home, no shame in that. If it´s something else, I hope he can recover. Since I don´t know what the problem is, I can only hope he gets better.
Feels like he's playing more like a korean and losing at their game rather than when he first came over his style was so different that most really didn't know how to react and were forced play his game
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On May 10 2011 00:59 Mordiford wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2011 00:56 Irrelevant wrote:On May 10 2011 00:46 Slimijs wrote:On May 09 2011 23:57 zerious wrote:On May 09 2011 23:55 Maenander wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. It is not like Jinro and Huk had more success in foreigner tournaments lately, I doubt players like Zenio are one step ahead of the non-korean scene. I'm pretty sure Zenio would slaughter any foreign terran. Well + Show Spoiler +Drewbie beat him 2-0 in NASL yestarday Lag is a bitch, don't put too much stock into any results from online tournaments It's not that much of an issue if you actually watch the fucking games... I've seen some of the Korean players make plays that couldn't possibly be made in delay, and react to attacks too quickly for there to be any significant lag. I believe the oGs house has really good internet or some shit, because they seem to play fine. In some games, there's a clear delay and lag issue, in others, it hardly appears to be there at all. I didn't notice anything in Zenio's game to suggest his performance was inhibited by lag. Having lag isn't just about not being able to react at a certain time during the game it the mind state of knowing you can't rely on micro forcing you to play the game completely different from what you would do in a lan setting where you could rely on your micro if needed.
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France13021 Posts
On May 10 2011 00:38 MechKing wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2011 00:37 Poopi wrote:
You really underestimate what "code S" means lol.
None foreigner would be able to fly to korea and qualify to code A then code S at his first try.
Very few could reach code S after months of training. Few could qualify for code A. Rain, Tester, Killer, Lyn etc. all got into code S. Bomber didn't even get into the GSL until this season. It all depends.
I mean code S when you were not in the open seasons.
Bomber fall to Alicia, luck of the draws, Alicia is probably the best PvTer.
edit : and don't use results from NASL or any other cross-server based tournament lol, these results don't mean anything at all.
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Jinro looked really tilted and mediocre. Medium and little mistakes all over the place add up to unwinnable defecits by midgame.
Perfect example, game on XNC, kills hatchery, leaves 2 bunkers sitting there full of marines and instead of salvaging and running, he sacs all 7 marines + 2 bunkers for 2 roaches. That seems like such an obvious thing to do. He must have been super tilted.
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On May 10 2011 00:56 Irrelevant wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2011 00:46 Slimijs wrote:On May 09 2011 23:57 zerious wrote:On May 09 2011 23:55 Maenander wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. It is not like Jinro and Huk had more success in foreigner tournaments lately, I doubt players like Zenio are one step ahead of the non-korean scene. I'm pretty sure Zenio would slaughter any foreign terran. Well + Show Spoiler +Drewbie beat him 2-0 in NASL yestarday Lag is a bitch, don't put too much stock into any results from online tournaments
Probably more important is that they play at 5am. I don't think anyone can play particularly well at that time...
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Zenio played so incredibly well today except how he handle jinro's bunker rush in game 2...
I was rooting for jinro but 2 bunker rushes in a row... id feel sad if jinro won game 3 tbh
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On May 09 2011 21:15 Wivyx wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2011 21:11 Pwnographics wrote:On May 09 2011 21:10 Wivyx wrote:On May 09 2011 21:08 aruken wrote:On May 09 2011 21:05 Poopi wrote:On May 09 2011 21:04 Nesquik wrote:On May 09 2011 21:03 bennyaus wrote:On May 09 2011 21:02 4of8 wrote:Seems like no foreigner next code S HuK can still win, mate. You seen Huk's group.. ? If MKP wins against MMA HuK can stay code S. (MMA lost to SangHo so his TvP is not that good, but if it was pre-patch it'll be harder to win as protoss) you are crazy to think MMA could lose to huk HuK defeated MMA on ladder yesterday. Granted, it was on ladder, but he definitely had a chance to advance. Don't rule him out yet. It wasn't Slayers'MMA, it was SlayersRyung. The player specifically answered MMA when HuK asked who it was. He also talked about up&down and that he wished MKP would fall. Ryung was mentioned in the chat, but that was HuK saying something along the lines of "I added you on twitter. You and Ryung." He might have played them both yesterday though.
So is HuK an MMA/Ryung fan? He's got good taste. I really don't wanna see Jinro and HuK dropped to code a
Edit: Somehow bungled the quoting.
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Unfortunate for Jinro, really thought he would roll over coca. Some bad moves and some bad luck lost him those games :/
Jinro is certainly code S calibre.. albeit just barely. huk, haypro are trying their level best and as much as I want them to do well, they seem to be choking big time.
Koreans are not that far ahead as compared to sc1. What separates them from foreigners is their ability to take risks which I feel lacks in most of the foreigners. Nevertheless, players like naniwa, kas and dimaga could easily take down code S players. As for NA, its all about select xD
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On May 10 2011 00:46 Slimijs wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2011 23:57 zerious wrote:On May 09 2011 23:55 Maenander wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. It is not like Jinro and Huk had more success in foreigner tournaments lately, I doubt players like Zenio are one step ahead of the non-korean scene. I'm pretty sure Zenio would slaughter any foreign terran. Well + Show Spoiler +Drewbie beat him 2-0 in NASL yestarday
Yea because Drewbie can totally make it through the Code A qualifiers, and then go on to Code S.
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oGs has some insane internet in their team house (they actually offered to let all korean players use their house for international games before), and as such lag should not be a big problem for oGs.Zenio. It probably isn't like playing on LAN, but the effects of lag would be minimal.
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On May 10 2011 01:41 doihy wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2011 00:46 Slimijs wrote:On May 09 2011 23:57 zerious wrote:On May 09 2011 23:55 Maenander wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. It is not like Jinro and Huk had more success in foreigner tournaments lately, I doubt players like Zenio are one step ahead of the non-korean scene. I'm pretty sure Zenio would slaughter any foreign terran. Well + Show Spoiler +Drewbie beat him 2-0 in NASL yestarday Yea because Drewbie can totally make it through the Code A qualifiers, and then go on to Code S.
He probably could if he put his mind to it and took 6 months out to move to Korea.
What are you trying to imply? GSL is a commitment, some other top players have failed to make it in because they simply take one shot at it and then leave, most of the players in there right now either took the time to consistently work at getting in and staying in, or were a part of GSL early on before the split really pushed weaker players out.
It'd be astounding for anyone to just move to Korea and make their way into Code S in one try at the moment. Even more astounding if they managed to stay in Code S for a following season.
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EPT
