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On May 10 2011 00:00 Beefwipe wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2011 23:53 shaman6ix wrote:On May 09 2011 23:06 tdt wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. West don't have best players there. NaNi, Thor, Hasu, Dimaga, Strelok, kas and many others I think would be S class. idra too of course. He was getting higher every season and is playing better than ever now. What? Are you aware of the Code-S level of play? Hasu, Strelok would never ever get there. Kas has the skill and he could if he trained 24/7 but he lacks strong mentality and thats extremely important when it comes to stage matches.. Thor has a lot to prove yet, dont get carried away from his results in online matches he had a week to prepare for. NaNi and Dimaga are the only ones who i could see in Code-S after 2 or 3 months in Korea. Are you aware of the Code-S level of play? A lot of top Europeans would easily play in Code S, I can only think of a few Americans but the Europeans are definitely there skill-wise.
A few of the top Europeans could compete in Code S (and be about mid-tier), a lot could (maybe) compete in Code A. TSL shows that given enough preparation, a lot of Europeans can create very strong customized builds for their opponents and win decisively, the GSL World Championships showed that with little preparation they still can get slaughtered just as easily. I do agree almost nobody in the NA server could compete in Code S though.
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On May 10 2011 00:19 Astans wrote:
I wonder if the "international" system of TL is really working. Other teams seem to be pretty much based on one continent. Maybe they do not all love together in one house like the Koreans do but at least they can play each other and communicate all the time.
TL is on 3 different continents, with lag being a problem when you play on another continent and with different timezones that make training tough as well.
do you wonder about Fnatic.MSI and FXOpen too?
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On May 10 2011 00:21 zerious wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2011 00:18 Arcanne wrote:On May 09 2011 23:57 zerious wrote:On May 09 2011 23:55 Maenander wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. It is not like Jinro and Huk had more success in foreigner tournaments lately, I doubt players like Zenio are one step ahead of the non-korean scene. I'm pretty sure Zenio would slaughter any foreign terran. Didnt he lose to drewbie? Drewbie also beat IdrA online when IdrA was still in Korea, now he can't even touch IdrA. Yeah, I'd have to say the latency helped Drewbie.
Without people in Korea im pretty sure will just get the BW situation all over again. Until e-sports is socially accepted in the west, koreans will always excell.
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On May 09 2011 23:57 zerious wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2011 23:55 Maenander wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. It is not like Jinro and Huk had more success in foreigner tournaments lately, I doubt players like Zenio are one step ahead of the non-korean scene. I'm pretty sure Zenio would slaughter any foreign terran.
Well, lag controversies notwithstanding, this is a strange thing to say after Zenio lost to Drewbie in the NASL.
I'm willing to say that Zenio was the better player today, but I don't believe he is a level above every other foreign terran.
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On May 10 2011 00:00 Beefwipe wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2011 23:53 shaman6ix wrote:On May 09 2011 23:06 tdt wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. West don't have best players there. NaNi, Thor, Hasu, Dimaga, Strelok, kas and many others I think would be S class. idra too of course. He was getting higher every season and is playing better than ever now. What? Are you aware of the Code-S level of play? Hasu, Strelok would never ever get there. Kas has the skill and he could if he trained 24/7 but he lacks strong mentality and thats extremely important when it comes to stage matches.. Thor has a lot to prove yet, dont get carried away from his results in online matches he had a week to prepare for. NaNi and Dimaga are the only ones who i could see in Code-S after 2 or 3 months in Korea. Are you aware of the Code-S level of play? A lot of top Europeans would easily play in Code S, I can only think of a few Americans but the Europeans are definitely there skill-wise.
The word 'easily' made me sure that you dont know what youre talking about.
GSL and Korean skill level are 2 different things. Im not saying that foreigners have a huge skill difference with the Koreans cause thats not the case in SC2. Im saying that getting into Code-S and then maintaining that position is something very few foreigners would be able to do and that only after a lot of practise time in Korea.
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Fnatic is mostly NA and Sen can play without too many problems on the NA-server. Same goes for FXO. So their situation is totally different.
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On May 10 2011 00:21 PartyBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2011 00:00 Beefwipe wrote:On May 09 2011 23:53 shaman6ix wrote:On May 09 2011 23:06 tdt wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. West don't have best players there. NaNi, Thor, Hasu, Dimaga, Strelok, kas and many others I think would be S class. idra too of course. He was getting higher every season and is playing better than ever now. What? Are you aware of the Code-S level of play? Hasu, Strelok would never ever get there. Kas has the skill and he could if he trained 24/7 but he lacks strong mentality and thats extremely important when it comes to stage matches.. Thor has a lot to prove yet, dont get carried away from his results in online matches he had a week to prepare for. NaNi and Dimaga are the only ones who i could see in Code-S after 2 or 3 months in Korea. Are you aware of the Code-S level of play? A lot of top Europeans would easily play in Code S, I can only think of a few Americans but the Europeans are definitely there skill-wise. A few of the top Europeans could compete in Code S (and be about mid-tier), a lot could (maybe) compete in Code A. TSL shows that given enough preparation, a lot of Europeans can create very strong customized builds for their opponents and win decisively, the GSL World Championships showed that with little preparation they still can get slaughtered just as easily. I do agree almost nobody in the NA server could compete in Code S though.
I actually disagree. Given enough time, I think that a Kiwikaki, a TT1, a Major/Terran/Kitty, an Incontrol, a Tyler, a Drewbie etc. could all compete at least in code A. They would have to stay in korea for a LONG time though. They couldn't just fly over and compete in code S, although I bet a few europeans could.
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Sigh, Jinro and San ;(, two of my favorite players in Code S down to Code A =(.
Well, I guess it's extra motivation to watch more Code A games  .
Can't really be arsed to go through the 100 pages to search for the LR, did they go out in style?
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On May 10 2011 00:26 Irrational_Animal wrote:
Fnatic is mostly NA and Sen can play without too many problems on the NA-server. Same goes for FXO. So their situation is totally different.
You would think there is no problem with sen playing on na server since he never complain or talked about it. Sometime we see him miss micro here there and thought that is his own fault. Also the fact that he play so much on na that he is so used to it.
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On May 09 2011 23:57 Irrational_Animal wrote:
Even if Dimaga has the skill his motivation seems to rise and fall very quick. Thorzain is getting a bit too much hype (granted he is excellent but he still has a lot to proof). I only think Nani and Kas could do it but Nani wouldn`t prolly fit into the korean culture.
Nani really wants to compete in korea so I bet he would try to fit in well. Kas could be a great player, but Idk if he wants to compete seeing as he's dominating EU tournies. 
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On May 10 2011 00:21 zerious wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2011 00:18 Arcanne wrote:On May 09 2011 23:57 zerious wrote:On May 09 2011 23:55 Maenander wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. It is not like Jinro and Huk had more success in foreigner tournaments lately, I doubt players like Zenio are one step ahead of the non-korean scene. I'm pretty sure Zenio would slaughter any foreign terran. Didnt he lose to drewbie? Drewbie also beat IdrA online when IdrA was still in Korea, now he can't even touch IdrA. Yeah, I'd have to say the latency helped Drewbie.
Latency honestly didn't seem like a big issue in those games, I think the oGs house has some pretty good internet because generally if you watch their games, there's no clear indication of latency coming into effect(obvious miss-micros, bad reaction times).
Also, Drewbie has beaten IdrA in the US as well, so no...
Drewbie goes back and forth with a lot of players, he does dumb shit and loses sometimes, but when he's on his game he does really well.
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Jinro has shown that he can compete, but his play today was not good, it just wasn't.
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France13021 Posts
You really underestimate what "code S" means lol.
None foreigner would be able to fly to korea and qualify to code A then code S at his first try.
Very few could reach code S after months of training. Few could qualify for code A.
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On May 10 2011 00:32 MechKing wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2011 23:57 Irrational_Animal wrote:
Even if Dimaga has the skill his motivation seems to rise and fall very quick. Thorzain is getting a bit too much hype (granted he is excellent but he still has a lot to proof). I only think Nani and Kas could do it but Nani wouldn`t prolly fit into the korean culture. Nani really wants to compete in korea so I bet he would try to fit in well. Kas could be a great player, but Idk if he wants to compete seeing as he's dominating EU tournies.
Nani perfectly executes certain builds, but we have yet to see his crysis management and decision making in orthodox situations.
For example, MC vs Rain on Lost temple in GSL3 finals. Where MC really showed how to manage difficult-unforeseen situations.
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On May 10 2011 00:29 MechKing wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2011 00:21 PartyBiscuit wrote:On May 10 2011 00:00 Beefwipe wrote:On May 09 2011 23:53 shaman6ix wrote:On May 09 2011 23:06 tdt wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. West don't have best players there. NaNi, Thor, Hasu, Dimaga, Strelok, kas and many others I think would be S class. idra too of course. He was getting higher every season and is playing better than ever now. What? Are you aware of the Code-S level of play? Hasu, Strelok would never ever get there. Kas has the skill and he could if he trained 24/7 but he lacks strong mentality and thats extremely important when it comes to stage matches.. Thor has a lot to prove yet, dont get carried away from his results in online matches he had a week to prepare for. NaNi and Dimaga are the only ones who i could see in Code-S after 2 or 3 months in Korea. Are you aware of the Code-S level of play? A lot of top Europeans would easily play in Code S, I can only think of a few Americans but the Europeans are definitely there skill-wise. A few of the top Europeans could compete in Code S (and be about mid-tier), a lot could (maybe) compete in Code A. TSL shows that given enough preparation, a lot of Europeans can create very strong customized builds for their opponents and win decisively, the GSL World Championships showed that with little preparation they still can get slaughtered just as easily. I do agree almost nobody in the NA server could compete in Code S though. I actually disagree. Given enough time, I think that a Kiwikaki, a TT1, a Major/Terran/Kitty, an Incontrol, a Tyler, a Drewbie etc. could all compete at least in code A. They would have to stay in korea for a LONG time though. They couldn't just fly over and compete in code S, although I bet a few europeans could.
Kiwikaki and incontrol tried to qualify open season 3 and fail. The reason i think it is super hard for foreigner to get into GSL is not because of skill but rather the number of pro players there are in korea competing. Bomber who fail to qualified until recently who destroyed whitera in 2 best of seven series when he was code B player. A IM team without nestea and mvp can compete with the the world team.
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On May 10 2011 00:37 Poopi wrote:
You really underestimate what "code S" means lol.
None foreigner would be able to fly to korea and qualify to code A then code S at his first try.
Very few could reach code S after months of training. Few could qualify for code A.
Rain, Tester, Killer, Lyn etc. all got into code S. Bomber didn't even get into the GSL until this season. It all depends.
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On May 10 2011 00:38 MechKing wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2011 00:37 Poopi wrote:
You really underestimate what "code S" means lol.
None foreigner would be able to fly to korea and qualify to code A then code S at his first try.
Very few could reach code S after months of training. Few could qualify for code A. Rain, Tester, Killer, Lyn etc. all got into code S. Bomber didn't even get into the GSL until this season. It all depends.
There is a lot of bracket luck involved in making Code S, there's a lot of stamina and consistency required in qualifying for Code A.
Some of the best foreign players in the world have gone over, made a mistake or two and found themselves left with the decision of having to wait 3 months or leave. It can be pretty unforgiving.
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Jinro in Code A, MVP, Boxer, MC.....
To me, it just means the game is evolving so fast that nobody (except NesTea) has got a real handle on it yet, and there isn't a superior style, strat or composition yet. The game is still being figured out, and for now, everyone is in danger of going down to something new, or something they didn't think about.
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On May 10 2011 00:38 lazyfeet wrote:Show nested quote +On May 10 2011 00:29 MechKing wrote:On May 10 2011 00:21 PartyBiscuit wrote:On May 10 2011 00:00 Beefwipe wrote:On May 09 2011 23:53 shaman6ix wrote:On May 09 2011 23:06 tdt wrote:On May 09 2011 22:56 eoLithic wrote:
Nature has its ways. The weaker ones has to go and the strongest remain. I think both Jinro and HuK will fall down from code-A and leave Korea together with Haypro. Honestly, I don`t see any player with enough dedication and methodical approach to the game to keep up with the koreans, except IdrA.
I think it is definitely time to realize that the koreans are one step ahead, and will always be.
I just want the better players to stay, and that is what happened today. Jinro played like a beast a month or so ago though, oh well. West don't have best players there. NaNi, Thor, Hasu, Dimaga, Strelok, kas and many others I think would be S class. idra too of course. He was getting higher every season and is playing better than ever now. What? Are you aware of the Code-S level of play? Hasu, Strelok would never ever get there. Kas has the skill and he could if he trained 24/7 but he lacks strong mentality and thats extremely important when it comes to stage matches.. Thor has a lot to prove yet, dont get carried away from his results in online matches he had a week to prepare for. NaNi and Dimaga are the only ones who i could see in Code-S after 2 or 3 months in Korea. Are you aware of the Code-S level of play? A lot of top Europeans would easily play in Code S, I can only think of a few Americans but the Europeans are definitely there skill-wise. A few of the top Europeans could compete in Code S (and be about mid-tier), a lot could (maybe) compete in Code A. TSL shows that given enough preparation, a lot of Europeans can create very strong customized builds for their opponents and win decisively, the GSL World Championships showed that with little preparation they still can get slaughtered just as easily. I do agree almost nobody in the NA server could compete in Code S though. I actually disagree. Given enough time, I think that a Kiwikaki, a TT1, a Major/Terran/Kitty, an Incontrol, a Tyler, a Drewbie etc. could all compete at least in code A. They would have to stay in korea for a LONG time though. They couldn't just fly over and compete in code S, although I bet a few europeans could. Kiwikaki and incontrol tried to qualify open season 3 and fail. The reason i think it is super hard for foreigner to get into GSL is not because of skill but rather the number of pro players there are in korea competing. Bomber who fail to qualified until recently who destroyed whitera in 2 best of seven series when he was code B player. A IM team without nestea and mvp can compete with the the world team.
Wasn't incontrol only 1 game away? They were only there for like a month, max. Idra, jinro and haypro all qualified for GSL3. Huk and Jinro both got into code S. Idra is definitely a top foreigner, but do you think that Jinro is any better than Kas or Thorzain? Or is haypro better than morrow? Is Huk better than Kiwikaki or Naniwa? They might be, but there are still a ton of foreigners that are able to compete with koreans for sure if other foreigners can.
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You also underestimate living in a country for a longer period where you can only talk with a handfull people and where people expect you to fit into a hierarchical order. Nani had problems to adapt to living in Germany so saying he would easily handle living in Korea for a long time is hilarious.
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EPT
