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On May 28 2012 04:36 IlK wrote:
Midle mouse button is a bad key since u have to move your finger from ur nr1 priority button(left mouse).
1for army is bad since 1a is weird to press, 2a is medicore for the same reason.
Basecam on space isnt bad but a waste imo, all u need it for is for the basecam inject method and for this space is bad since space=>v is weird and, theres a lot of better options.
I, personally, dont like the location hotkeys on f-keys since its a lot of movement to do and u need those often, more often the better u get.
Its not bad thoug, most of the very good players play with them like that but to me its the biggest improvement on custom hotkeys to get those away from fkeys.
The rest is up to you, both darkgrid and this layout show very efficient ways to use your keys, your stuff is a bit off that thats why id say fine for you if u can play well with it but i guess the existent+the upcoming layouts beat it.
Thanks for the feedback. I have never found middle mouse button to be a problem for that reason at all, since while pressing it, using my ring finger to press left mouse Is always a comfortable option. F keys are a bit far away and hard to tap them without glancing at the keyboard. I feel you are absolutely right about using 1,2 for army. From now on i'll try to keep 3,4,5 for that instead and move my upgrades to 1 and my scouts to 2. Spacebar is wonderful for larva inject and also "chrono inject" (chronoboosting all your nexuses really fast.) , but now that I actually think of it, switching tab to basecam and space to subgroups makes a whole lot more sense.
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On May 28 2012 07:07 Sirverik wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 04:36 IlK wrote:
Midle mouse button is a bad key since u have to move your finger from ur nr1 priority button(left mouse).
1for army is bad since 1a is weird to press, 2a is medicore for the same reason.
Basecam on space isnt bad but a waste imo, all u need it for is for the basecam inject method and for this space is bad since space=>v is weird and, theres a lot of better options.
I, personally, dont like the location hotkeys on f-keys since its a lot of movement to do and u need those often, more often the better u get.
Its not bad thoug, most of the very good players play with them like that but to me its the biggest improvement on custom hotkeys to get those away from fkeys.
The rest is up to you, both darkgrid and this layout show very efficient ways to use your keys, your stuff is a bit off that thats why id say fine for you if u can play well with it but i guess the existent+the upcoming layouts beat it. Thanks for the feedback. I have never found middle mouse button to be a problem for that reason at all, since while pressing it, using my ring finger to press left mouse Is always a comfortable option. F keys are a bit far away and hard to tap them without glancing at the keyboard. I feel you are absolutely right about using 1,2 for army. From now on i'll try to keep 3,4,5 for that instead and move my upgrades to 1 and my scouts to 2. Spacebar is wonderful for larva inject and also "chrono inject" (chronoboosting all your nexuses really fast.) , but now that I actually think of it, switching tab to basecam and space to subgroups makes a whole lot more sense.
Nice one. How does everyone feel about having three fingers on top of the mouse to press buttons instead of 2? What if the third mouse button was more like the 2 primary buttons? Like This
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Nice one but I cant get used to it but I'll try harder
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I'm intrigued, but I'd like to see some examples of how much more efficient it is. Do you have any vods of someone decent playing or something so I can see what it's like?
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On May 28 2012 17:09 sanddbox_sc2 wrote:
I'm intrigued, but I'd like to see some examples of how much more efficient it is. Do you have any vods of someone decent playing or something so I can see what it's like?
A VOD isn't going to reveal much apart from control groups. The entire premise of JaKaTaK Righty is to centralise hotkeys in order to reduce finger travel. This by itself should be enough incentive for you to try it out, just download the profile file in the OP so you can easily revert back.
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Hey nice job on the hotkeys i have been trying them out since i am switching races to terran from Master lvl protoss anyways. When the game came out i also spent a lot of time focusing on efficient hotkeys for protoss but this is on a whole other level. I have played maybe 20 games since switching and i have made a few changes.
-moved army hotkeys to erg because 4-6 is harder to reach. Also I dont see the point of having a main army hotkey and ones for individual types of units. it takes me a tenth of second to type earata. Hotkeying new units with that many groups is a major pain
-321 tab and capslock are now all location keys which is esp usefull for terran so i can have easy access to my rally and different fronts.
- b is hotkey for scouts
- made ` the idle worker hotkey because its something I use many times each game. f1 is was too out of the way and recent camera isnt useful.
-moved hold position and added a hotkey for stop. You can't play terran and not have a hotkey for stop so i added it.
Still getting used to the new system and my mechanics have suffered tremendiously. I am looking forward to try your new system as well!
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On May 28 2012 14:29 BaRtHeN wrote:
Nice one but I cant get used to it but I'll try harder
You can do it man! :D
On May 28 2012 17:09 sanddbox_sc2 wrote:
I'm intrigued, but I'd like to see some examples of how much more efficient it is. Do you have any vods of someone decent playing or something so I can see what it's like?
I would wait for the New Layout. This is the kind of data we're working with now: Spreadsheet
2129 tournament replays analyzed. MLGs IEMs Dreamhacks.. GSL doesn't release replays 
On May 28 2012 17:21 Akinokaze wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 17:09 sanddbox_sc2 wrote:
I'm intrigued, but I'd like to see some examples of how much more efficient it is. Do you have any vods of someone decent playing or something so I can see what it's like? A VOD isn't going to reveal much apart from control groups. The entire premise of [Chameleon] is to centralise hotkeys in order to reduce finger travel. This by itself should be enough incentive for you to try it out, just download the profile file in the OP so you can easily revert back.
Akinokaze is probably right, trying it will reveal much more than a VOD, again, I would suggest waiting for the new layout. But even with this layout, which was based purely on intuition and logic, people have reported going from 100 to 300 APM in the timespan of 2 weeks.
On May 28 2012 19:09 xavra41 wrote:
Hey nice job on the hotkeys i have been trying them out since i am switching races to terran from Master lvl protoss anyways. When the game came out i also spent a lot of time focusing on efficient hotkeys for protoss but this is on a whole other level. I have played maybe 20 games since switching and i have made a few changes.
-moved army hotkeys to erg because 4-6 is harder to reach. Also I dont see the point of having a main army hotkey and ones for individual types of units. it takes me a tenth of second to type earata. Hotkeying new units with that many groups is a major pain
-321 tab and capslock are now all location keys which is esp usefull for terran so i can have easy access to my rally and different fronts.
- b is hotkey for scouts
- made ` the idle worker hotkey because its something I use many times each game. f1 is was too out of the way and recent camera isnt useful.
-moved hold position and added a hotkey for stop. You can't play terran and not have a hotkey for stop so i added it.
Still getting used to the new system and my mechanics have suffered tremendiously. I am looking forward to try your new system as well!
Interesting changes. What do you use as your harass control groups? Are you using tabbed production? If so, how many keys are you using for macro, just F and D, or are you using others? What are all the different uses for the idle worker button? I've heard of a few, but I am wondering if you know any others that I don't yet. How would you feel about moving the "next subgroup" button from the spacebar and using the spacebar for something else? I really look forward to your beta feedback with the new layout. Good to have another master on board :D
EDITED for name change
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I use 1234RTFG for my control groups, and I definitely recommend trying things like this out for anyone with small hands, such as myself, that can't reach accurately past 5. A very simple quality of life matter: The better the game fits you, the more fun you'll have.
I didn't read through the whole OP, but checking out the pictures, I definitely recommend trying pre-made stuff like this for anyone who wants to dabble with keybinds, and control groups in particular, as those things are a massive pain in the ass to fix due to ctrl groups being "global" and thus removing them completely from use as unit action hotkeys.
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Ive been thinking about those 2000 rePlays . . . Seems like quality is probably way more important than quantity doesn't it? What's the point of analyzing the replays and aggregating them when 95 percent of them are from second rate pros? Just a thought.
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Why would anyone need many control groups ? Especially for protoss -.-
even most progamers use at most 3 control groups for army , dont they ?
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On May 28 2012 22:53 Nancial wrote:
Why would anyone need many control groups ? Especially for protoss -.-
even most progamers use at most 3 control groups for army , dont they ?
Because they let you do more with less effort? Some pro-gamers use very little control groups, but many of them use almost all of them. It is a matter of preference. The question is not why would anyone need the control groups, but why would anyone want them.
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On May 28 2012 21:54 JaKaTaK wrote:I would wait for the New Layout. This is the kind of data we're working with now: Spreadsheet2129 tournament replays analyzed. MLGs IEMs Dreamhacks.. GSL doesn't release replays
Its good to see you are using actual data to make decisions on your new hotkey setup, should be good as a result. More than good, it will be good for a reason - with an explanation and data to explain why its good, because data and solid evidence of study and analysis complete with conclusions will be the only way id be believing that a new hotkey setup is good for any reason other than that it is simply "tighter, with less finger travel". To be honest, i think we (those of us who have seriously considered our hotkeys) are at the point where we have (or atleast have a complete understanding of how to) cram our hotkeys together to create 'efficiency'. Hell, im sure many of us have gone so far as the cram everything so tight that its backflipped and is negatively effecting our efficiency, even if only by a minor amount. My point is without data and analysis we will never know, and any changes that we think make us more efficient are largely speculative past the point of saying "Ok.. if its closer, i can theoretically push it quicker up until the point im fumbling over my fingers trying to hit things."
Nice work, a much needed direction change.
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On May 28 2012 22:44 cosimorondo wrote:
Ive been thinking about those 2000 rePlays . . . Seems like quality is probably way more important than quantity doesn't it? What's the point of analyzing the replays and aggregating them when 95 percent of them are from second rate pros? Just a thought.
Data is useful, i dont think you are quite considering all the different facets of data that can be used to answer all sorts of questions for us. For starters, id imagine the first step to doing this thing right (-the- hotkey setup) would be to bulk analyse data from tournaments as has been done to ascertain the most used commands/keys in each matchup - this gives you your priority in terms of what is used alot and what isnt. Also, you might want to know what percentage of players actually use more than X amount of control group hotkeys - and you will -definitely- want to blanket analyse that as alot of pro's come from WC3 or are just used to using only a few control groups because in broodwar you had to do alot of boxing anyway because of the unit selection limit/control group limits.
Infact, how could you even think using only the top tier of pro players data would be a good idea, most of them are so fast they dont need custom hotkeys, or are just so damn used to the standard hotkeys that they will -never- change them. Imagine taking what, two thirds of a year? For a top pro player to get back to his A game with a new hotkey setup. And this is while tournaments are flying past that they wouldnt be able to play because it would be a waste of money for their team to fly them over when they arent playing their best. To be honest, top tier data bears little relevance to this except as a cross referencing tool to be used later. What we really want is a cut off line that determines when a player is likely to make the step to alter their hotkeys, then we could start accumulating/analysing data in brackets starting above that point. This would start to paint a picture of how players progress with their hotkeys and where they end up. To be honest though, i doubt replays can give us enough data without having a good program to arrange and analyse it all - you are almost better off making a very very detailed survey and posting it to a selection of say 200 players above masters from each race, it should include questions as well as instructions of different movements/keystrokes/layouts to try and then plenty of room for the player to give feedback on each. I really cant see a decent way of dialing this in besides that considering it is so much to do with how it 'feels' to a player, and it may be difficult to pin data points on that depending on how good SC2Gears is.
Anyway, just suggestions for if you guys want to make sure its done right. And the comment about only using top tier pro play as a guideline, roflcoptermao.
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I'm pretty sure that there are no top players that have not customized their hotkeys. The examples of "top"players that have not tend to exemplify the stereotype of the smart player who's mechanics just aren't up to snuff with the very tip top pros (Sheth for example). . .
The definition of the pro is the person who does whatever it takes to be the best and if they are too lazy to optimize their hotkeys then it should come as no surprise that they are not the very best.
Also, i think you are missing the point of analyzing the data. The point is to figure out how the very best players control the game, not what their hotkey set up is. I fail to see how the data from an incompetent american cheeser from MLG would positively affect the data in contrast to someone like stephano drg mvp idra demuslim kas violet polt etc
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EDIT: Look on the far right of the Spreadsheet. If any progamers are missing let me know and I'll add them to the list. Looks like we're just under 50% top notch pros :D Feel free to say Illusion's not top notch, you'll be wrong.
As far as the, "how valuable is this data" question goes, I would say it is very valuable. It gives a good description of the top players. Champions of major tournaments like polt, stephano, mc, mkp, mvp, drg, nestea, violet, and mma have some of the highest # of games per player. (the no name players were all in the single digits). At the same time it allows for data from some of the up and coming players who haven't yet made names for themselves and can afford to approach the game differently and more creatively, bringing variety of play into our data.
omny, I feel like you didn't really get a good look at the spreadsheet.
To be honest though, i doubt replays can give us enough data without having a good program to arrange and analyse it all
we do have a good program to arrange and analyze it all, that is how the spreadsheet is there. And there will be another program that is being written to weigh hand stress against frequency of the key in order to get the fastest, most erognomical match for each key to it's respective command.
This project will be on a completely different level than Darkgrid or Chameleon. Really digging the constructive feedback, keep it coming :D
On May 28 2012 22:36 Kontys wrote:
I use 1234RTFG for my control groups, and I definitely recommend trying things like this out for anyone with small hands, such as myself, that can't reach accurately past 5. A very simple quality of life matter: The better the game fits you, the more fun you'll have.
I didn't read through the whole OP, but checking out the pictures, I definitely recommend trying pre-made stuff like this for anyone who wants to dabble with keybinds, and control groups in particular, as those things are a massive pain in the ass to fix due to ctrl groups being "global" and thus removing them completely from use as unit action hotkeys.
I don't know if you got a good look at the Progress Blog but we'll be having different versions for different hand sizes in the new layout :D
EDITED for name change
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On May 28 2012 21:54 JaKaTaK wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 14:29 BaRtHeN wrote:
Nice one but I cant get used to it but I'll try harder You can do it man! :D Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 17:09 sanddbox_sc2 wrote:
I'm intrigued, but I'd like to see some examples of how much more efficient it is. Do you have any vods of someone decent playing or something so I can see what it's like? I would wait for the New Layout. This is the kind of data we're working with now: Spreadsheet2129 tournament replays analyzed. MLGs IEMs Dreamhacks.. GSL doesn't release replays Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 17:21 Akinokaze wrote:On May 28 2012 17:09 sanddbox_sc2 wrote:
I'm intrigued, but I'd like to see some examples of how much more efficient it is. Do you have any vods of someone decent playing or something so I can see what it's like? A VOD isn't going to reveal much apart from control groups. The entire premise of JaKaTaK Righty is to centralise hotkeys in order to reduce finger travel. This by itself should be enough incentive for you to try it out, just download the profile file in the OP so you can easily revert back. Akinokaze is probably right, trying it will reveal much more than a VOD, again, I would suggest waiting for the new layout. But even with this layout, which was based purely on intuition and logic, people have reported going from 100 to 300 APM in the timespan of 2 weeks. Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 19:09 xavra41 wrote:
Hey nice job on the hotkeys i have been trying them out since i am switching races to terran from Master lvl protoss anyways. When the game came out i also spent a lot of time focusing on efficient hotkeys for protoss but this is on a whole other level. I have played maybe 20 games since switching and i have made a few changes.
-moved army hotkeys to erg because 4-6 is harder to reach. Also I dont see the point of having a main army hotkey and ones for individual types of units. it takes me a tenth of second to type earata. Hotkeying new units with that many groups is a major pain
-321 tab and capslock are now all location keys which is esp usefull for terran so i can have easy access to my rally and different fronts.
- b is hotkey for scouts
- made ` the idle worker hotkey because its something I use many times each game. f1 is was too out of the way and recent camera isnt useful.
-moved hold position and added a hotkey for stop. You can't play terran and not have a hotkey for stop so i added it.
Still getting used to the new system and my mechanics have suffered tremendiously. I am looking forward to try your new system as well!
Interesting changes. What do you use as your harass control groups? Are you using tabbed production? If so, how many keys are you using for macro, just F and D, or are you using others? What are all the different uses for the idle worker button? I've heard of a few, but I am wondering if you know any others that I don't yet. How would you feel about moving the "next subgroup" button from the spacebar and using the spacebar for something else? I really look forward to your beta feedback with the new layout. Good to have another master on board :D
4-5 are harass hotkeys instead of rt because you use less often. I prioritize the easy to reach places to things i use more often. I am using tabbedproduction which is probably the biggest change from when i played protoss. Its nice seeing everything in one go, but you always have to look at your selection whenever you build units. So if I have rax, fact, and starport and i lose my fact, then that will change how i build certain units. I am not sure if I am going to keep it on a single hotkey yet. Idle worker is super important because besides all the misclicks you always have random scvs no matter how skilled you are. If you put some scvs on autorepair you want to know when they are finished so you can send them back to minerals so you need the button. I don't really know any tricks with it but i used it like 5 times a game so it takes precedence over center camera position for me. The tab with spacebar is good, but since its something i use a lot it would have to be moved to a very convenient location. I'll update again if I make additional changes, but for now I am really looking forward to your new hotkey setup and keep up the good work!
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Seems pretty sweet. Can't wait to try it out!
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On May 29 2012 14:08 xavra41 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 21:54 JaKaTaK wrote:On May 28 2012 14:29 BaRtHeN wrote:
Nice one but I cant get used to it but I'll try harder You can do it man! :D On May 28 2012 17:09 sanddbox_sc2 wrote:
I'm intrigued, but I'd like to see some examples of how much more efficient it is. Do you have any vods of someone decent playing or something so I can see what it's like? I would wait for the New Layout. This is the kind of data we're working with now: Spreadsheet2129 tournament replays analyzed. MLGs IEMs Dreamhacks.. GSL doesn't release replays On May 28 2012 17:21 Akinokaze wrote:On May 28 2012 17:09 sanddbox_sc2 wrote:
I'm intrigued, but I'd like to see some examples of how much more efficient it is. Do you have any vods of someone decent playing or something so I can see what it's like? A VOD isn't going to reveal much apart from control groups. The entire premise of JaKaTaK Righty is to centralise hotkeys in order to reduce finger travel. This by itself should be enough incentive for you to try it out, just download the profile file in the OP so you can easily revert back. Akinokaze is probably right, trying it will reveal much more than a VOD, again, I would suggest waiting for the new layout. But even with this layout, which was based purely on intuition and logic, people have reported going from 100 to 300 APM in the timespan of 2 weeks. On May 28 2012 19:09 xavra41 wrote:
Hey nice job on the hotkeys i have been trying them out since i am switching races to terran from Master lvl protoss anyways. When the game came out i also spent a lot of time focusing on efficient hotkeys for protoss but this is on a whole other level. I have played maybe 20 games since switching and i have made a few changes.
-moved army hotkeys to erg because 4-6 is harder to reach. Also I dont see the point of having a main army hotkey and ones for individual types of units. it takes me a tenth of second to type earata. Hotkeying new units with that many groups is a major pain
-321 tab and capslock are now all location keys which is esp usefull for terran so i can have easy access to my rally and different fronts.
- b is hotkey for scouts
- made ` the idle worker hotkey because its something I use many times each game. f1 is was too out of the way and recent camera isnt useful.
-moved hold position and added a hotkey for stop. You can't play terran and not have a hotkey for stop so i added it.
Still getting used to the new system and my mechanics have suffered tremendiously. I am looking forward to try your new system as well!
Interesting changes. What do you use as your harass control groups? Are you using tabbed production? If so, how many keys are you using for macro, just F and D, or are you using others? What are all the different uses for the idle worker button? I've heard of a few, but I am wondering if you know any others that I don't yet. How would you feel about moving the "next subgroup" button from the spacebar and using the spacebar for something else? I really look forward to your beta feedback with the new layout. Good to have another master on board :D 4-5 are harass hotkeys instead of rt because you use less often. I prioritize the easy to reach places to things i use more often. I am using tabbedproduction which is probably the biggest change from when i played protoss. Its nice seeing everything in one go, but you always have to look at your selection whenever you build units. So if I have rax, fact, and starport and i lose my fact, then that will change how i build certain units. I am not sure if I am going to keep it on a single hotkey yet. Idle worker is super important because besides all the misclicks you always have random scvs no matter how skilled you are. If you put some scvs on autorepair you want to know when they are finished so you can send them back to minerals so you need the button. I don't really know any tricks with it but i used it like 5 times a game so it takes precedence over center camera position for me. The tab with spacebar is good, but since its something i use a lot it would have to be moved to a very convenient location. I'll update again if I make additional changes, but for now I am really looking forward to your new hotkey setup and keep up the good work!
Cool cool man. Hitting spacebar with the thumb should be pretty damn easy, probably one of the fastest keystrokes right after the homekeys. The idle worker key will be in a better position in the new layout as well as in the 1.1 version of this layout. Thanks for the feedbacks :D keep em coming.
On May 29 2012 17:34 xHadoken wrote:
Seems pretty sweet. Can't wait to try it out!
Sweet man. Let me know how it works out for you. By the by, you've got a sick ID hadoken :D
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On May 29 2012 14:08 xavra41 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2012 21:54 JaKaTaK wrote:On May 28 2012 14:29 BaRtHeN wrote:
Nice one but I cant get used to it but I'll try harder You can do it man! :D On May 28 2012 17:09 sanddbox_sc2 wrote:
I'm intrigued, but I'd like to see some examples of how much more efficient it is. Do you have any vods of someone decent playing or something so I can see what it's like? I would wait for the New Layout. This is the kind of data we're working with now: Spreadsheet2129 tournament replays analyzed. MLGs IEMs Dreamhacks.. GSL doesn't release replays On May 28 2012 17:21 Akinokaze wrote:On May 28 2012 17:09 sanddbox_sc2 wrote:
I'm intrigued, but I'd like to see some examples of how much more efficient it is. Do you have any vods of someone decent playing or something so I can see what it's like? A VOD isn't going to reveal much apart from control groups. The entire premise of JaKaTaK Righty is to centralise hotkeys in order to reduce finger travel. This by itself should be enough incentive for you to try it out, just download the profile file in the OP so you can easily revert back. Akinokaze is probably right, trying it will reveal much more than a VOD, again, I would suggest waiting for the new layout. But even with this layout, which was based purely on intuition and logic, people have reported going from 100 to 300 APM in the timespan of 2 weeks. On May 28 2012 19:09 xavra41 wrote:
Hey nice job on the hotkeys i have been trying them out since i am switching races to terran from Master lvl protoss anyways. When the game came out i also spent a lot of time focusing on efficient hotkeys for protoss but this is on a whole other level. I have played maybe 20 games since switching and i have made a few changes.
-moved army hotkeys to erg because 4-6 is harder to reach. Also I dont see the point of having a main army hotkey and ones for individual types of units. it takes me a tenth of second to type earata. Hotkeying new units with that many groups is a major pain
-321 tab and capslock are now all location keys which is esp usefull for terran so i can have easy access to my rally and different fronts.
- b is hotkey for scouts
- made ` the idle worker hotkey because its something I use many times each game. f1 is was too out of the way and recent camera isnt useful.
-moved hold position and added a hotkey for stop. You can't play terran and not have a hotkey for stop so i added it.
Still getting used to the new system and my mechanics have suffered tremendiously. I am looking forward to try your new system as well!
Interesting changes. What do you use as your harass control groups? Are you using tabbed production? If so, how many keys are you using for macro, just F and D, or are you using others? What are all the different uses for the idle worker button? I've heard of a few, but I am wondering if you know any others that I don't yet. How would you feel about moving the "next subgroup" button from the spacebar and using the spacebar for something else? I really look forward to your beta feedback with the new layout. Good to have another master on board :D 4-5 are harass hotkeys instead of rt because you use less often. I prioritize the easy to reach places to things i use more often. I am using tabbedproduction which is probably the biggest change from when i played protoss. Its nice seeing everything in one go, but you always have to look at your selection whenever you build units. So if I have rax, fact, and starport and i lose my fact, then that will change how i build certain units. I am not sure if I am going to keep it on a single hotkey yet. Idle worker is super important because besides all the misclicks you always have random scvs no matter how skilled you are. If you put some scvs on autorepair you want to know when they are finished so you can send them back to minerals so you need the button. I don't really know any tricks with it but i used it like 5 times a game so it takes precedence over center camera position for me. The tab with spacebar is good, but since its something i use a lot it would have to be moved to a very convenient location. I'll update again if I make additional changes, but for now I am really looking forward to your new hotkey setup and keep up the good work!
I use E/R and sometimes T as multi-purpose scout/obs/harass/probe/base defense hotkeys, depending on the situation. Frankly, I have less use for 4/5; I find bundling my whole army, Zealots, Colossi, and all at 3 more convenient and not problematic.
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since while pressing it, using my ring finger to press left mouse Is always a comfortable option.
Using your ringfinger if you can is okay, with most mice you can also move your index to the right in order to middle click (thats how they are built, the wheel has one side of the axis at the thing to rasterize movement and the other end on a switch. usually its the right side so moving the wheel to the right triggers it for most modern mice).
Still i dont like it, i would use it for something rarely used or nothing
From now on i'll try to keep 3,4,5 for that instead and move my upgrades to 1 and my scouts to 2
I like the idea to get 1and 2for camera positions buts thats only me and im not used to it yet since im not that far that i would worry about flanking:D
Upgrades i alwas put to a control group with my racks/queens, thats about perfect since i listen and read if an upgrade finished and while tapping it i can see what upgrade it was in the overview and when choosing the upgrade its only 1keypress more over an own control group. I will think about getting a control group for custom use like flanks(half marine in that control grp instead of the usual one) and the upgrade i really need at a specific point (stim:D). Like that i can tap the one totally importan upgrade but dont waste a skillgroup or have to tap a hard to reach key. since a timing attack happens AFTER an upgrade is finished the control group is free to something like flanks.
@Jak: you really should get it on and dont overthink it too much, sometimes efficiency isnt the most important factor.
Also, now i know where i saw that "new" key usage before ur stream, it was Naniwa though he is using standard it looks similar to it;)
If u dont get it together fast and i loose interest in path of exile im gonna try out some mix of urs and darkgrid layout with thumb on shift. The problem is that i wil stick to that then so hurryyy:D
IMO it doesnt matter which spell is on which button (and so for the control groups), simply telling us the buttons u use for control groups and those for spells (i guess the layered camera will get ported in the same pattern) eh voila beta layout
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