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On December 14 2012 06:14 Crypdos wrote:http://drop.sc/284118I just lost a TvZ and I would love some tips I opened 1rax FE into hellion banshee. I denied his overlord scout so I faked a 2rax pressure, but he didnt bite. Later on I see my oppurtunity to just go in with my hellions and kill drones, I kill 20 drones. My 2 banshees were unable to do any damage however. So now I'm aiming to harass him with drops, while hitting a ~15min 2/2 +1 vehicle weapons timing. The drops dont shit this game .. he always has lings perfectly split.I always had more army supply but he held any push with ease with his infestors. I really don't know how to win TvZ these days. When I saw his ultras I should've made more marauders, but i already had 8 rax and no building space. I tried to add 3 more rax in front of my third but he killed them. So i was left with 2 techlabs. I also expected him to just make a few ultras and then go broods. My 2nd factory and 5-8th rax were also a bit late. Would really appreciate some help from a skilled terran! Highish Mid master Terran
- No need to fake 2 rax pressure, you will hurt yourself more than him. Actually a Marine attacking an Overlord near your natural tells him that you did not go 2 rax, otherwise why on earth would this Marine be here? It's not a big deal here but no need to waste some minerals + 2 Marines.
- When you kill 20 Drones like this it means you bought yourself roughly one additional minut for your 2-2 timing. No more no less. So keep playing as usual knowing you will have extra time compared to a game in which your pressure did not result in Drone kills.
- Take your gases at natural a bit later, otherwise you will bank too much gas.
- Add your second Factory earlier, somewhere between 10' and 11'.
- No need to drop if nothing else occurs at the same time, especially against Infestors. You will likely lose Marines for nothing, which will weaken the 2-2 timing without any necessity. If you're dropping you need to take advantage of this to clear creep or give your army an opportunity to gain ground. Here you're just feeding Zerg.
- Don't get 3 Reactors at 14'35, Hive is complete so you will need Tech Labs (for Marauders or maybe Ghosts). Even without Reactors you could produce 12 Marines at once, that's OK.
- Well, those dead Marines are really lacking when the first fight occurs. You would also have 2-3 more Tanks with an earlier second Factory.
- Each second of down-time between the end of 2-2 and the moment you start 3-3 widens your window of vulnerability against 5-3 Ultralisks. You need to start Marauders and 3-3 as soon as possible against Ultralisks, otherwise they will just stamp your 2-2 Marines. There is no way you trade well with 2-2 Marines/Tanks against 5-3 Ultralisks unless he fights in the worst choke ever or make them dance during 30 seconds or something; you can see that in your game, he tried very hard to throw it away but despite his best efforts he still didn't manage to lose. One big problem when this situation occurs (upgrade disadavantage during ~2 minuts) is that you're unable to secure or maintain your fourth.
OK, mainly macro/infrastructure problems in the end (gas management & timing of additional Barracks/Factories weakening your 2-2 timing, add-ons not allowing you to make enough Marauders). Aim at 2-3 Marauders per Ultralisk, so head for 4 Tech Lab Barracks at least. Scout his Hive tech by the way, you did not know he was going Ultralisks.
On December 14 2012 11:47 CrazyF1r3f0x wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2012 11:46 13JackaL wrote:On December 14 2012 11:29 CrazyF1r3f0x wrote:
What is a solid opener for TvT; keep dying to cheese/aggression--I just need a safe build so I can practice my mechanics. All of the openings mentioned in the OP are solid and safe vs anything if used properly. Oh whoops; I seemed to have somehow missed that. How embarrassing >_> EDIT: Show nested quote +On September 14 2012 12:20 Ver wrote:
5) Rax expand double gas into reactor hellion/viking, transitioning into both bio or mech.
If I use this and transition into mech, how many factories should I get before my starport?
You get Factories #2 and #3 later, so you stay on 1 Factory for some time.
On December 14 2012 14:50 mothergoose729 wrote:
This question is regarding TvP
I play 1 rax expand into two more rax, medivacs, and plus one. I get one tech lab and two reactors on my first three barracks, and I prefer to get two more barracks with tech labs before I expand (but I will expand before getting two more barracks depending on what I scout). I go for the +1 stem timing with two medivacs push at ~10 minutes, like almost every other terran.
I have been playing a against a protoss build where the protoss gets fast high templars. Their storm will finish before I reach their base for my timing. They make about 5 gateways, and take a third base sometime around 10 minutes (. Then they add a few more gateways, and go for a huge high templar, archon, charge zealot push as I land my third sometime around 12 minutes. I have trouble pressuring this build. I have trouble with the timing attack that hits at about 13:30. My concerns are that protoss seems to get ahead in tech and economy simultaneously. I have noticed that forges are late but I haven't found a way to make it to late game in a good position to capitalize on it. What is the appropriate response to this kind of build using my build? Thank you.
Replay(s) would be nice, can't tell for sure from your description.
On December 14 2012 17:33 GARcher wrote:
Keep your viking count at around 5 per colossi.
No, more like 3-4.
On December 14 2012 17:33 GARcher wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2012 14:50 mothergoose729 wrote:
This question is regarding TvP
I play 1 rax expand into two more rax, medivacs, and plus one. I get one tech lab and two reactors on my first three barracks, and I prefer to get two more barracks with tech labs before I expand (but I will expand before getting two more barracks depending on what I scout). I go for the +1 stem timing with two medivacs push at ~10 minutes, like almost every other terran.
I have been playing a against a protoss build where the protoss gets fast high templars. Their storm will finish before I reach their base for my timing. They make about 5 gateways, and take a third base sometime around 10 minutes (. Then they add a few more gateways, and go for a huge high templar, archon, charge zealot push as I land my third sometime around 12 minutes. I have trouble pressuring this build. I have trouble with the timing attack that hits at about 13:30. My concerns are that protoss seems to get ahead in tech and economy simultaneously. I have noticed that forges are late but I haven't found a way to make it to late game in a good position to capitalize on it. What is the appropriate response to this kind of build using my build? Thank you. Fast ghost academy as soon as you scout it. Be greedy and expand while denying his third. Or you can all in him with SCV pull before he has storms out.
Do you read? He said Storm was ready when he reaches Protoss' natural. All-inning at 8-9 minuts with SCVs will never work. You can 2-bases all-in with SCVs before Protoss gets Storm when he tech switches from Colossi to HTs. Not when he goes Storm first.
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This might seem stupid, but can I get a basic build for the 1-1-1? I want to use it in TvP and I don't really want to have to optimize it/figure it out when people have already done it.
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On December 15 2012 06:45 packrat386 wrote:
This might seem stupid, but can I get a basic build for the 1-1-1? I want to use it in TvP and I don't really want to have to optimize it/figure it out when people have already done it.
There's many variations. What do you want? 3 hellion drop into cloak into marine tank banshee? gas first cloakshee into marine tank? 13 gas banshee -> marine tank? 3-1-1? 2-1-1 byun stim cs marine medic tank push?
Don't be lazy and ask for a complete BO...there are a plethora of resources you could get for an effective 1-1-1.
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Why don't terrans do rine tank tvp? tanks can do decent vs ht and have about the same as collo in range, and with rines you have super dps and still can drop
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On December 15 2012 09:33 LeafMeAlone wrote:
Why don't terrans do rine tank tvp? tanks can do decent vs ht and have about the same as collo in range, and with rines you have super dps and still can drop
Charge, immortals, blink, collsai.
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Blazinghand
United States25560 Posts
On December 15 2012 09:36 iAmJeffReY wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 09:33 LeafMeAlone wrote:
Why don't terrans do rine tank tvp? tanks can do decent vs ht and have about the same as collo in range, and with rines you have super dps and still can drop Charge, immortals, blink, collsai.
Basically, yeah. Tanks are worse than vikings at killing collosi and are slow-moving and need to set up. They're also supremely vulnerable to things like charge and immortals, and due to the long cooldown on their attacks, a few zealots charging in can screen for HTs, nullifying tanks in a way they can't against Ghosts.
Basically, tanks are nice before protoss has lots of tech, but then they become very weak. Usefull in 1 base all-ins or certain 2 base play but other than that not good in WoL TvP
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On December 15 2012 08:26 iAmJeffReY wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 06:45 packrat386 wrote:
This might seem stupid, but can I get a basic build for the 1-1-1? I want to use it in TvP and I don't really want to have to optimize it/figure it out when people have already done it. There's many variations. What do you want? 3 hellion drop into cloak into marine tank banshee? gas first cloakshee into marine tank? 13 gas banshee -> marine tank? 3-1-1? 2-1-1 byun stim cs marine medic tank push? Don't be lazy and ask for a complete BO...there are a plethora of resources you could get for an effective 1-1-1.
In that case, what are those resources from which I could get an effective 1-1-1? And in general some other builds would be good too. TL reccomended threads are outdated and so is liquipedia. Do you know of any other resources that compile build orders like that?
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Hey guys, I'm just getting back into SC2 (masters terran) and I wanted to know what are some good current builds that allow for heavy bio armies? I love splitting marines/marauders and kiting and all that stuff. I even made a guide a looooong time ago about pure bio in TvZ  Marineking and Polt are my favorite 2 players, so it is just something I really want to get good at. But yeah, what builds transition into bio really well and can utilize good micro?
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On December 15 2012 18:25 IMoperator wrote:Hey guys, I'm just getting back into SC2 (masters terran) and I wanted to know what are some good current builds that allow for heavy bio armies? I love splitting marines/marauders and kiting and all that stuff. I even made a guide a looooong time ago about pure bio in TvZ Marineking and Polt are my favorite 2 players, so it is just something I really want to get good at. But yeah, what builds transition into bio really well and can utilize good micro?
Well, Day9 recently did a daily on Polts TvZ, which is a pretty cool and unique style at the moment. If you want other examples, watch someone like Demuslim play, as he often uses bio too pretty well. Here's the daily:
http://day9.tv/d/Day9/polts-tvz-beat-the-imba/
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On December 15 2012 18:31 kollin wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 18:25 IMoperator wrote:Hey guys, I'm just getting back into SC2 (masters terran) and I wanted to know what are some good current builds that allow for heavy bio armies? I love splitting marines/marauders and kiting and all that stuff. I even made a guide a looooong time ago about pure bio in TvZ Marineking and Polt are my favorite 2 players, so it is just something I really want to get good at. But yeah, what builds transition into bio really well and can utilize good micro? Well, Day9 recently did a daily on Polts TvZ, which is a pretty cool and unique style at the moment. If you want other examples, watch someone like Demuslim play, as he often uses bio too pretty well. Here's the daily: http://day9.tv/d/Day9/polts-tvz-beat-the-imba/
Alright, thanks a lot man.
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Hi guys, just wondering if there are usually any good timings to scan for greater spire in case of broodlords?
I some times lose because i don't make additional starports when using mech.
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On December 15 2012 12:10 packrat386 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 15 2012 08:26 iAmJeffReY wrote:On December 15 2012 06:45 packrat386 wrote:
This might seem stupid, but can I get a basic build for the 1-1-1? I want to use it in TvP and I don't really want to have to optimize it/figure it out when people have already done it. There's many variations. What do you want? 3 hellion drop into cloak into marine tank banshee? gas first cloakshee into marine tank? 13 gas banshee -> marine tank? 3-1-1? 2-1-1 byun stim cs marine medic tank push? Don't be lazy and ask for a complete BO...there are a plethora of resources you could get for an effective 1-1-1. In that case, what are those resources from which I could get an effective 1-1-1? And in general some other builds would be good too. TL reccomended threads are outdated and so is liquipedia. Do you know of any other resources that compile build orders like that?
So you're asking for us to throw out all the builds for you...There's not going to a website for you to find a complete BO or lists all the BOs for you, and most people on here aren't going to give you free information like that. You still have to work for it. You know, like watching a lot of games or going through the first 10 minutes of a replay.
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On December 15 2012 09:33 LeafMeAlone wrote:
Why don't terrans do rine tank tvp? tanks can do decent vs ht and have about the same as collo in range, and with rines you have super dps and still can drop
Tanks are only viable for timing pushes in TvP
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Hey everyone, I'm relatively new to SC2. And I thought I had a decent handle on my tvp but apparently I don't.
I know I didn't play as well as I could have, but could you guys just look at this replay and point out the obvious and not so obvious mistakes and flaws? Thank you.
http://drop.sc/284610
Thanks so much, this is my first post on here, you guys are always so helpful whenever I've come on here for non-related tips.
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@Gage
I think your big mistake is trying too hard to kill the colossus. Honestly it would be more effectively just to a-move.
You could tidy up your build and macro a bit, if you can't support 4 rax with addons, double ups and reactor starport then delay the 4th rax until you can afford it.
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What is the counter to sombody who goes mass infestor queen? I mean he honestly have over 30 infestor with a ton of queen support. Then to make it worse it was a huge map so it was hard to kill his bases and he had his infestor's burrowed everywhere.
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On December 16 2012 13:35 -NerdCrusher wrote:
What is the counter to sombody who goes mass infestor queen? I mean he honestly have over 30 infestor with a ton of queen support. Then to make it worse it was a huge map so it was hard to kill his bases and he had his infestor's burrowed everywhere.
I don't really see how he can engage you if you have tanks in good positions. When you attack him, save scans so you can siege up in time and target his infestors. Let everything else stay behind/just in front of your tanks so you don't get fungaled.
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Personally I'm in the habit of getting a raven these days in TvZ, there's far too much burrow shenanigans going on. Makes things so much easier vs infestors, just keep an eye on it, ravens love to fly off on their own!
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How do you deal with a protoss going 5gate? I can scout it easily enough, but then their sentry kills of my scouting SCV and I am in the dark. I lift off and bunker up in my main, but then the protoss can simply expand while holding me in my base and teching up to chargelot archon. I end up behind in eco and the 2medivac push will be weaker.
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On December 16 2012 22:19 Westy wrote:
How do you deal with a protoss going 5gate? I can scout it easily enough, but then their sentry kills of my scouting SCV and I am in the dark. I lift off and bunker up in my main, but then the protoss can simply expand while holding me in my base and teching up to chargelot archon. I end up behind in eco and the 2medivac push will be weaker.
If you are talking about 5 gate, i asume you are talking about a 2 base protoss. If this is the case, evacuating to your main is the wrong choice, since he´ll be ahead of you. Try to bunker up your natural and have scvs ready to instantly repair your bunkers. You can also experiment with depots or scvs in front of your bunkers, to prevent the zealots from reaching your bunkers. It´s also important to spread them out, so that he has to use more force fields.
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