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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. |
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On December 12 2012 04:57 kitsch wrote:Hi, after this 2 and a half years i just switched from random to Terran, just to claim infestor nerf (  ). I really hate this banshee/hellion style that has been used lately in TvZ. I just love to play bio. For now i have been doing a 1rax FE into a combat shield timing at zergs third, then a medivac/stim timing and finally a 2-2 timing. I've found some bio guides here and followed those, but seem a bit outdated. Is there still any possiblity to play bio in TvZ? And if it is, can you link me some guide/replays/streams/whatever? thx a lot 
Why don't you try Gumiho's bio style? Someone even wrote a thread on it with a link to the game.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=386131
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Hellion/Banshee doesn't get the job done, because all it does is harass. What you should do is the Bomber style. Recommended it before and I'll recommend it again. Been winning most of my games with it against Zerg. Only problem is that my micro sucks so I got owned when Zerg rushed to BL while defending soley with ling baneling.
http://day9.tv/d/Day9/day9-daily-530/
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TvT is my worst matchup since I started making marines, when I scout no gas with my first scout, is it viable to just add a third cc after combat shield and my bunker are started (before the extra 2 rax)?
Is there a time I should scan or poke to check for a build that could punish this? What am I looking for?
What I have been doing is making a factory after second rax and taking 3rd and 4th gases to be able to get tanks and medivacs in order to compensate for my lower marine count when they attack around 10-11. It is still a bit bumpy, though, mostly due to my bad improvisation skills, does anyone have experience with this style?
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On December 13 2012 04:01 U_G_L_Y wrote:
TvT is my worst matchup since I started making marines, when I scout no gas with my first scout, is it viable to just add a third cc after combat shield and my bunker are started (before the extra 2 rax)?
Is there a time I should scan or poke to check for a build that could punish this? What am I looking for?
What I have been doing is making a factory after second rax and taking 3rd and 4th gases to be able to get tanks and medivacs in order to compensate for my lower marine count when they attack around 10-11. It is still a bit bumpy, though, mostly due to my bad improvisation skills, does anyone have experience with this style?
If both of you are doing a 1rax gasless expo you can even go for 2 ccs before any gas/extra rax.
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Yeah but I feel like I need at least 2 tanks in order to be able to land my third safely and I cant get behind on upgrades or doom drops will be an auto-win since I am spread out and have fewer units.
(Seems like every other game is TvT on Ohana and they try to take my watch tower between 10 and 12 if they didnt do some sort of hellion elevator)
How would you get your third out against the Thorzain timing push with stim and cs and plus 1 delayed?
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He's right, do the filterSC evertime in bronze. I had same question/problem posted here, i listened to there answer and did filterSC-guide. After that i won 80% of my games when i did his strategy. So 1raxFE, then 3 rax+1 starport+stim and 4 medivacs and push out at 10/11min. In custom maps, there are fliterSC practisemaps, practise there first to reach 100 supply in 10 minutes of which 50 scv's. Eng.bays and tanks etc. arent needed in bronze and make the build much harder, which supplyblocked me too many times allready. Eventually this hurts your economy and armysize at the 10 minutemark. So master basics of the build first!
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http://drop.sc/284118
I just lost a TvZ and I would love some tips
I opened 1rax FE into hellion banshee. I denied his overlord scout so I faked a 2rax pressure, but he didnt bite. Later on I see my oppurtunity to just go in with my hellions and kill drones, I kill 20 drones. My 2 banshees were unable to do any damage however. So now I'm aiming to harass him with drops, while hitting a ~15min 2/2 +1 vehicle weapons timing. The drops dont shit this game .. he always has lings perfectly split.I always had more army supply but he held any push with ease with his infestors. I really don't know how to win TvZ these days.
When I saw his ultras I should've made more marauders, but i already had 8 rax and no building space. I tried to add 3 more rax in front of my third but he killed them. So i was left with 2 techlabs. I also expected him to just make a few ultras and then go broods. My 2nd factory and 5-8th rax were also a bit late.
Would really appreciate some help from a skilled terran!
Highish Mid master Terran
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When you guys face a random do you have a seperate build order? I am playing 1 base all-in in every matchup at the minute because it seems to suit me better than late game. But when I face random I don't know how to open and end up playing a standard cheesy play like 2port cloakshees, or a sloppy macro game.
Only one of my openers is gas first (TvT) but I feel it makes a huge difference just knowing before hand, and I always feel like I am going to get cheesed more by a random opponent so I am doing extra scouting, etc which affects my timings.
How do you guys deal with random?
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On December 14 2012 06:22 Marathi wrote:
When you guys face a random do you have a seperate build order? I am playing 1 base all-in in every matchup at the minute because it seems to suit me better than late game. But when I face random I don't know how to open and end up playing a standard cheesy play like 2port cloakshees, or a sloppy macro game.
Only one of my openers is gas first (TvT) but I feel it makes a huge difference just knowing before hand, and I always feel like I am going to get cheesed more by a random opponent so I am doing extra scouting, etc which affects my timings.
How do you guys deal with random?
If you go 1rax expo, you can scout after first depo and know what build to do before any deviation. As terran you should'nt have many problems with your BO against random. Your problem is that you go 1base allin every game. If you like agressive play, try out some 2base allin after a 1rax expo.
As a random player myself, if you ask me nicely i'll tell you my race, so try it everygame you face a random. On the other hand, i don't usually cheese as random and don't think many randoms cheese imho.
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On December 14 2012 06:54 kitsch wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2012 06:22 Marathi wrote:
When you guys face a random do you have a seperate build order? I am playing 1 base all-in in every matchup at the minute because it seems to suit me better than late game. But when I face random I don't know how to open and end up playing a standard cheesy play like 2port cloakshees, or a sloppy macro game.
Only one of my openers is gas first (TvT) but I feel it makes a huge difference just knowing before hand, and I always feel like I am going to get cheesed more by a random opponent so I am doing extra scouting, etc which affects my timings.
How do you guys deal with random? If you go 1rax expo, you can scout after first depo and know what build to do before any deviation. As terran you should'nt have many problems with your BO against random. Your problem is that you go 1base allin every game. If you like agressive play, try out some 2base allin after a 1rax expo. As a random player myself, if you ask me nicely i'll tell you my race, so try it everygame you face a random. On the other hand, i don't usually cheese as random and don't think many randoms cheese imho.
May be it's because I am only Gold and I am used to randoms cheesing a lot through bronze and silver. I don't know many 2base all-ins except the 2/2 bio +1 attack tank push for TvZ. I don't think I can trust random players telling me their race, even if they do so without me asking I am always sceptical or them trying to fool me.
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On December 14 2012 07:19 Marathi wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2012 06:54 kitsch wrote:On December 14 2012 06:22 Marathi wrote:
When you guys face a random do you have a seperate build order? I am playing 1 base all-in in every matchup at the minute because it seems to suit me better than late game. But when I face random I don't know how to open and end up playing a standard cheesy play like 2port cloakshees, or a sloppy macro game.
Only one of my openers is gas first (TvT) but I feel it makes a huge difference just knowing before hand, and I always feel like I am going to get cheesed more by a random opponent so I am doing extra scouting, etc which affects my timings.
How do you guys deal with random? If you go 1rax expo, you can scout after first depo and know what build to do before any deviation. As terran you should'nt have many problems with your BO against random. Your problem is that you go 1base allin every game. If you like agressive play, try out some 2base allin after a 1rax expo. As a random player myself, if you ask me nicely i'll tell you my race, so try it everygame you face a random. On the other hand, i don't usually cheese as random and don't think many randoms cheese imho. May be it's because I am only Gold and I am used to randoms cheesing a lot through bronze and silver. I don't know many 2base all-ins except the 2/2 bio +1 attack tank push for TvZ. I don't think I can trust random players telling me their race, even if they do so without me asking I am always sceptical or them trying to fool me.
I do a 15 gas opening. Scout after depot. If zerg, I just go into 2 marine -> reactor FE into hellion/bio play.
If protoss, I do the same, 2 marine, reactor, factory -> 3 hellion drop -> banshee harass into 3-5 rax, 1 fac, 1 port stim/cs all in.
If terran, 1 marine -> tech lab -> reaper -> FE -> rax rax -> 2nd depot -> stim -> reactor reactor when rax done. Then on second cycle of 5 marines, do a stim timing check. If you see them getting gas, and being greedy, delay the 2 reactors to get out 2 cycles of marines as you get an ebay for +1 and turrets around minerals, and one at your production incase of banshees. Then drop double reactor, 2nd + 3rd gas, factory, and just churn marines as you get up to medivacs.
That's what I do against random, at least.
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What is a solid opener for TvT; keep dying to cheese/aggression--I just need a safe build so I can practice my mechanics.
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On December 14 2012 11:29 CrazyF1r3f0x wrote:
What is a solid opener for TvT; keep dying to cheese/aggression--I just need a safe build so I can practice my mechanics.
All of the openings mentioned in the OP are solid and safe vs anything if used properly.
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On December 14 2012 11:46 13JackaL wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2012 11:29 CrazyF1r3f0x wrote:
What is a solid opener for TvT; keep dying to cheese/aggression--I just need a safe build so I can practice my mechanics. All of the openings mentioned in the OP are solid and safe vs anything if used properly.
Oh whoops; I seemed to have somehow missed that. How embarrassing >_>
EDIT:
On September 14 2012 12:20 Ver wrote:
5) Rax expand double gas into reactor hellion/viking, transitioning into both bio or mech.
If I use this and transition into mech, how many factories should I get before my starport?
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On December 14 2012 11:47 CrazyF1r3f0x wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2012 11:46 13JackaL wrote:On December 14 2012 11:29 CrazyF1r3f0x wrote:
What is a solid opener for TvT; keep dying to cheese/aggression--I just need a safe build so I can practice my mechanics. All of the openings mentioned in the OP are solid and safe vs anything if used properly. Oh whoops; I seemed to have somehow missed that. How embarrassing >_> EDIT: Show nested quote +On September 14 2012 12:20 Ver wrote:
5) Rax expand double gas into reactor hellion/viking, transitioning into both bio or mech.
If I use this and transition into mech, how many factories should I get before my starport?
regardless of whether you want to go bio or mech using that build, you would generally go 1-1-1 after the expand. The reactor on the rax would be switched onto the factory immediately when it's done and you would make the starport immediately after the factory. The port must be made right after the factory using this because without it you have no anti-air besides a couple marines and possibly a couple turrets, so you definitely need the port quick for vikings.
You can add factories soon after that, maybe even before your 3rd CC if you want to do a strong timing, or after if your opponent is playing greedy.
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Hey im a newb terran (gold league  ) and i cant seem to win in mid or late game vs toss i dont see how its possible to emp his templars and archons and take out his vikings w/o pro lvl micro .Anyone have any suggestions?
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This question is regarding TvP
I play 1 rax expand into two more rax, medivacs, and plus one. I get one tech lab and two reactors on my first three barracks, and I prefer to get two more barracks with tech labs before I expand (but I will expand before getting two more barracks depending on what I scout). I go for the +1 stem timing with two medivacs push at ~10 minutes, like almost every other terran.
I have been playing a against a protoss build where the protoss gets fast high templars. Their storm will finish before I reach their base for my timing. They make about 5 gateways, and take a third base sometime around 10 minutes (. Then they add a few more gateways, and go for a huge high templar, archon, charge zealot push as I land my third sometime around 12 minutes. I have trouble pressuring this build. I have trouble with the timing attack that hits at about 13:30. My concerns are that protoss seems to get ahead in tech and economy simultaneously. I have noticed that forges are late but I haven't found a way to make it to late game in a good position to capitalize on it. What is the appropriate response to this kind of build using my build? Thank you.
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How the fuck is Terran supposed to pressure Protoss in the mid game? Every game I have fucking toss players getting colossus and high templar at the same time and there is absolutely no way to punish them for it. By the time we both max out my army is seriously weak in comparison to theirs. So every game I expand faster, build more shit, and get rolled...
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On December 14 2012 15:43 alexanderzero wrote:
How the fuck is Terran supposed to pressure Protoss in the mid game? Every game I have fucking toss players getting colossus and high templar at the same time and there is absolutely no way to punish them for it. By the time we both max out my army is seriously weak in comparison to theirs. So every game I expand faster, build more shit, and get rolled...
A ton of drops. Flanks. Pick off units here and there. Keep your viking count at around 5 per colossi. 15 vikings if you are going against more than 4 colossi (actually easier to deal with than chargelot archon). If you are going against chargelot archon, you need to keep up with scouting so you can get ghosts out early enough for them to charge energy. Then you just spam EMP and hope you got all the templars or else you watch your army melt to blanket storms. In your case I think the opponent just got a colossus to force you to over make vikings. One thing people aren't doing is sending out suicide marauder hit squads to snipe pylons so protoss can't mass warpin after a battle.
On December 14 2012 14:28 heyra wrote:Hey im a newb terran (gold league ) and i cant seem to win in mid or late game vs toss i dont see how its possible to emp his templars and archons and take out his vikings w/o pro lvl micro .Anyone have any suggestions?
TvP lategame is a battle of micro. There's no way around it. Unless you hugely outmacro him or do crippling damage before lategame.
On December 14 2012 14:50 mothergoose729 wrote:
This question is regarding TvP
I play 1 rax expand into two more rax, medivacs, and plus one. I get one tech lab and two reactors on my first three barracks, and I prefer to get two more barracks with tech labs before I expand (but I will expand before getting two more barracks depending on what I scout). I go for the +1 stem timing with two medivacs push at ~10 minutes, like almost every other terran.
I have been playing a against a protoss build where the protoss gets fast high templars. Their storm will finish before I reach their base for my timing. They make about 5 gateways, and take a third base sometime around 10 minutes (. Then they add a few more gateways, and go for a huge high templar, archon, charge zealot push as I land my third sometime around 12 minutes. I have trouble pressuring this build. I have trouble with the timing attack that hits at about 13:30. My concerns are that protoss seems to get ahead in tech and economy simultaneously. I have noticed that forges are late but I haven't found a way to make it to late game in a good position to capitalize on it. What is the appropriate response to this kind of build using my build? Thank you.
Fast ghost academy as soon as you scout it. Be greedy and expand while denying his third. Or you can all in him with SCV pull before he has storms out.
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EPT
