EPT[G] Cfestival's Ghost Nuke Push - Page 4
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statikg
Canada930 Posts
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perser84
Germany399 Posts
you pay 100 gas less but you must pay 100 minerals more but i think that affects your timing greatly | ||
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Antylamon
United States1981 Posts
On May 12 2011 22:50 statikg wrote: This is pure theory craft but I actually think that a modification of this idea could really work in TvP, generally the issue with rushes in TvP is that they just cut your army in half with forcefields at the ramp and you lose, but if you nuke above the ramp...then they have to retreat from the ramp and you can run your army up and maybe actually win with a 3rax. Or just EMP the sentries after scanning the top of the ramp. The nuke could be used to kill pylons powering gateways instead. | ||
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Crytch
Germany135 Posts
some BO mistakes etc, but shows the way that it still works :D currently ~1.000 Masterpoints EU http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=208504 or ![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-208504.jpg) | ||
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cfestival
United States32 Posts
On May 12 2011 22:50 statikg wrote: This is pure theory craft but I actually think that a modification of this idea could really work in TvP, generally the issue with rushes in TvP is that they just cut your army in half with forcefields at the ramp and you lose, but if you nuke above the ramp...then they have to retreat from the ramp and you can run your army up and maybe actually win with a 3rax. I've done this with much success actually. I just went 2 rax ghost to 3 rax mmg (marine/marauder/ghost), then got an "early" factory. Basically, it's a mm push, with a few ghosts. Less Ghosts (like 2)/More Marauders if they're going stalker/robo build, More Ghosts (4+) if they're doing 4 gate w/zealots. I find the build works well vs the Spanishiwa FE build too, cause all they have are the spines to defend....I just have to work it a little better to get it down; I almost totally take him out in the first attack, and probably could have, if I managed it a little better. Don't look at my gameplay after the first attack....I know I'm a nub terran  Against the FE, the enemy has mostly static defenses, or light units....which the Ghost nuke kills. Here are a few more replays: all games plays post 1.3.3 patch TvT Ghost Nuke vs FE Marines http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=208591 TvP Ghost vs Zealot http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=208586 TvP Ghost vs early attack expo http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=208587 TvZ Ghost Nuke vs FE http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=208588 4v4 nuke http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=208589 more 4v4 nuke action http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=208590 On May 13 2011 00:45 perser84 wrote: well i think the main problem is now how to change the built order with the cost change you pay 100 gas less but you must pay 100 minerals more but i think that affects your timing greatly Yes, but it's fun experimenting on the build. The benefit to the gas to minerals is the ease that Ghosts can be produced later in the game. I find that you're not as strapped for gas when making them now, and upgrades/tech is a much more viable option. On May 13 2011 03:42 Crytch wrote: tried it out after the recent patch. some BO mistakes etc, but shows the way that it still works :D currently ~1.000 Masterpoints EU posted! keep them coming!  On May 13 2011 02:34 noobinator wrote: Or just EMP the sentries after scanning the top of the ramp. The nuke could be used to kill pylons powering gateways instead. I find that the nuke is less effective vs protoss. The 100/100 that would have been for the nuke I spend it on getting STIM earlier (than a reg TvT Ghost Nuke), and maybe opting for more Marauders, instead of the Reapers, and an earlier Tank (without the Hellion)....but it sorta depends on the scouting. If my scouting is still "unknown," I find it safer to just sorta chill a little longer in a TvP, and wait to have a reg MM + G attack, with maybe a tank....depending on the map and how it's feeling. This doesn't mean I won't get the nuke anyways.....especially now that the new patch decreased the power radius, which means that those pylons might be a little closer together now  | ||
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Crytch
Germany135 Posts
Pulled scv's are fastfood for your hellion/reapers/ghosts. | ||
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Antylamon
United States1981 Posts
On May 13 2011 12:16 cfestival wrote: Here are a few more replays: all games plays post 1.3.3 patch TvT Ghost Nuke vs FE Marines http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=208591 TvP Ghost vs Zealot http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=208586 TvP Ghost vs early attack expo http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=208587 TvZ Ghost Nuke vs FE http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=208588 4v4 nuke http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=208589 more 4v4 nuke action http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=208590 That's a lot of replays :O You should put them in the OP since it looks like you forgot to lol On May 13 2011 12:16 cfestival wrote: I find the build works well vs the Spanishiwa FE build too, cause all they have are the spines to defend....I just have to work it a little better to get it down; I almost totally take him out in the first attack, and probably could have, if I managed it a little better. Yeah, Spanishwa's bo is kind of flawed imo. It's way too defensive, so it can be a reverse situation for TvZ: Terran mass expands and contains the Zerg while the Zerg turtles XD | ||
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cfestival
United States32 Posts
On May 13 2011 20:26 noobinator wrote: EDIT: Had to fix the quotes after 3 edits :/ That's a lot of replays :O You should put them in the OP since it looks like you forgot to lol Yeah, Spanishwa's bo is kind of flawed imo. It's way too defensive, so it can be a reverse situation for TvZ: Terran mass expands and contains the Zerg while the Zerg turtles XD I didn't put them all in the original post because it's a TvP and TvZ, and the TvT isn't optimized yet (to the new patch). I did put the team games in there though....team nuke games are always fun to watch. Also, don't misunderstand me about the Spanishwa---it's an awesome build, and if you don't stomp him on the initial push, they can still recover and keep playing (if you look at my game, I do a lot of damage, even killing a bunch of drones, but he still had so many left over). Nukes vs Zerg aren't nearly as effective as they are against Terran, or even Protoss. A few well-placed EMPs will help defeat those pesky transfusing Queens though  On May 13 2011 20:23 Crytch wrote: I think this build is most effective against 1/2-Racks expand, because your enemy will transition into any 4 racks build with bunkers, which are nuked off, and bio becomes snipe-rounded and its gg. Pulled scv's are fastfood for your hellion/reapers/ghosts. Yes, my quickest, most decisive games were against a 1/2 rax FE (which seems to be popular now). Fun Fact: Fungal Growth does NOT stop the Nuke from coming down, like the play guide suggests. Same with Neural Parasite; it does not automatically stop to Nuke, you have to do this manually after parasiting. | ||
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Syorm
131 Posts
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cfestival
United States32 Posts
On May 13 2011 22:14 MarkBolinder3 wrote: Wow I tried this with my gold 4v4 team and it worked like a dream. I like the fact that I can get a nuke and an expansion at almost the same time Can you post your replay? It's always fun to watch nukes go down. For team games, it's ok you didn't use an "optimized build" (I haven't really optimized it for team games yet), but the general idea of a fast nuke for bunker/wall busting is awesome. | ||
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canox
Canada6 Posts
![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-209696.jpg) edit: heres another one lol. nuke finishes at 7:00 misclicking around nukes is dangerous!! ![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-209716.jpg) | ||
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Antylamon
United States1981 Posts
On May 18 2011 08:58 canox wrote: I managed to pull it off.. BO is a little messed up, too much gas, but it worked pretty well anyways edit: heres another one lol. nuke finishes at 7:00 misclicking around nukes is dangerous!! You had too much gas because the bo hasn't been changed since patch 1.3.3, which changed Ghost cost to 200/100 rather than 150/150. I usually get my 2nd gas around 18 now with this bo. OP: Also, I found an iEchoic build variant that delays the drop to get a banshee out quicker. With target firing vs the ghosts and kiting vs the rines, he destroyed my attack (which still managed to take out a bunker, 2 depots, all his rines and all his hellions). After that, I had 2 rax pumping marines and a factory pumping tanks. With one cloaked banshee he forced me to pull my SCVs and allin. Even if it wasn't a cloaked banshee, he could've kited my marines all day. Kind of ironic that the bo you're trying to counter destroys you with a slight change. | ||
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cfestival
United States32 Posts
On May 18 2011 08:58 canox wrote: I managed to pull it off.. BO is a little messed up, too much gas, but it worked pretty well anyways edit: heres another one lol. nuke finishes at 7:00 misclicking around nukes is dangerous!! I added your replays =) when you did the scan, you should have seen some better targets than the missle turret on the typon peaks match. There were 4 supply depots that may have been hit from the bottom (i think it reaches), and that would have given you a bigger bang for your buck. But yeah--second to that, tech labs are esp good to hit so they can't build marauders (marines can be easily sniped as they are made). On May 18 2011 20:18 noobinator wrote: You had too much gas because the bo hasn't been changed since patch 1.3.3, which changed Ghost cost to 200/100 rather than 150/150. I usually get my 2nd gas around 18 now with this bo. OP: Also, I found an iEchoic build variant that delays the drop to get a banshee out quicker. With target firing vs the ghosts and kiting vs the rines, he destroyed my attack (which still managed to take out a bunker, 2 depots, all his rines and all his hellions). After that, I had 2 rax pumping marines and a factory pumping tanks. With one cloaked banshee he forced me to pull my SCVs and allin. Even if it wasn't a cloaked banshee, he could've kited my marines all day. Kind of ironic that the bo you're trying to counter destroys you with a slight change. Yeah---banshees sorta suck. I've stayed behind a few times when I thought he was going banshees....got a few more ghosts, marines, and marauders, killed his banshees, and then pushed. That has worked fairly well too. | ||
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Crytch
Germany135 Posts
![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-214715.jpg) ![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-214716.jpg) And another one, lol: ![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-214717.jpg) | ||
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Crytch
Germany135 Posts
![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-215282.jpg) | ||
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BawheidbobSC2
United Kingdom12 Posts
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DrLOAC
United States53 Posts
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Crytch
Germany135 Posts
In my oppinion this build is very strong against any FE, mostly a autowin. Against 1 base it's always a coinflip. Cloakted banshees can become a problem before you finished stim because he just abuse his range (or cliffs on some maps) and you loose to much units to do a decent push. Against early siegetanks it's a skilltrade. If hes intelligent enough to unsiege only one tank after another while you are nuking you will do 0 DMG and you still can't push in cause he's always sieged with some tanks. Blueflame openings are another "cfestivals nukepush" killer, because they kill most of your units. Marines, Hellions and Reaper will die instant, and he can harras/drop your worker and you have to go allin or gg leave. The success of this strategy is very depended of your first scan, cause you have to check if he's fast expoing which means you can go ahead and autowin, or see what he is teching for to change your unitmix. Anyway, i love this build, i always have to laugh so fucking hard when my opponent just stay or run in the nuke :D Have got so much ragequits and flames in ladder, just to funny. 1.700 Master Terran, EU edit: I dont play every game 100% the correct BO, i change it up if i feel so. Dont stick to much to the BO, trust your feeling. | ||
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BawheidbobSC2
United Kingdom12 Posts
![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-218525.jpg) Thank you for the guide  | ||
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(supernerd)
United States8 Posts
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